sportscardtheory
Active member
bouwob said:
I would think only players who were identified. Why would they punish presumed-innocent players.
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ivan rodriguez 3000 hits?
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I would think only players who were identified. Why would they punish presumed-innocent players.
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uniquebaseballcards
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bouwob said:
Why anyone should think this a black and white issue is beyond me. Surely even Bonds will get at least a couple votes but he won't get in. The more egregious a player's real or perceived offense the less likely he'll get in.
Mozzie22
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bouwob said:
Don't believe the hype surrounding the percentage of players who were juicing. When this steroid storm first started crazy numbers were being thrown out. I heard 80% were using, 65% were using. If I remember correctly based on the Mitchell report a more accurate number was closer to 5%. I think most but not all of the players that were using have been outed in one way or another. Either they did it themselves by turning into the Hulk (Mac, Bonds, Sosa) or they have been linked to a known user. Hell, some indicted themselves simply by producing crazy statistics for a year or two and then falling off the face of the earth (Brady Anderson).
The players that supposedly were clean during that era (Thome, Thomas, Griffey) remain untarnished because nobody has really ever accused them or brought forth any proof.
JoshHamilton
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sportscardtheory said:
Actually, I'm a big fan of facts over rumors
sportscardtheory
Active member
JoshHamilton said:
Ivan Rodriguez going from a twig to a muscley Pillsbury Doughboy back to a twig again is all the proof I need. That along with someone saying that they told him how to use PEDs, bought him PEDs and injected PEDs into him helps. Ignoring that info would make me an idiot. I don't want to be an idiot.
sportscardtheory
Active member
bouwob said:
Not at all. His first-hand knowledge is all that matters. How many players did he actually out with hardline information? I don't think it was that many. I don't think Ivan Rodriguez, Juan Gonzalez and Rafael Palmeiro are "every player in baseball".
Canseco mentioned his name and last I checked, Jose is a scumbag who has been correct in the names he has ratted out.
Pudge probably gets in the Hall of Fame in his second year of eligibility i.e. Roberto Alomar if the voting media has some grudges towards him or any possible PED use, but it isn't likely he's going to be held out.
Pudge probably gets in the Hall of Fame in his second year of eligibility i.e. Roberto Alomar if the voting media has some grudges towards him or any possible PED use, but it isn't likely he's going to be held out.
Crewfan82
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bouwob said:
No, but one can't deny that every name that has ever left his mouth in regards to PEDs has ended up either admitting to using or has been named in reports. ie. Mac, Palmero, Ramirez, Gonzalez, and so on.
wolfmanalfredo
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No roids= no hits
JoshHamilton
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sportscardtheory said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up
- Thread starter
- #32
Mozzie22 said:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=4367025
At the time, in 2005, Canseco said he believed 80 percent of big league players were using some substance to enhance their statistics. He since has amended that number.
"If you were in the game in the last 20 years, there's a 95 percent chance you were knowingly using something,'' Canseco said. "I said 80 percent back then because that was the number of players that I knew were on. But that number was greater.''
sportscardtheory
Active member
bouwob said:
Unless we know which specific players players were abusing, that number is meaningless. Just like I will never admonish a player tied to PED abuse simply because he never "officially" failed a test. Accusing players with no known ties to PED abuse is a worthless fight, but by all means, do whatever you want.
sportscardtheory
Active member
JoshHamilton said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote:1bk51d8q]
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.
JoshHamilton
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sportscardtheory said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote:31zoxm8t]
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.[/quote:31zoxm8t]
Thanks for finally providing solid proof, mert
sportscardtheory
Active member
JoshHamilton said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote:3q324ifn]
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.[/quote:3q324ifn]
Thanks for finally providing solid proof, mert[/quote:3q324ifn]
There is more information out there for it than against it. I'm just siding with the quantitave information like a good logical person.
JoshHamilton
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sportscardtheory said:JoshHamilton said:sportscardtheory said:JoshHamilton said:sportscardtheory said:[quote="JoshHamilton"g3sz5nf][quote="sportscardtheory"
I wasn't aware you had solid evidence he did steroids.
Oh wait, you DON'T have any evidence? You're just talking out your ass?
Shut up, moron
I think one would have to be a moron to truly believe Pudge didn't juice. You don't need conclusive evidence to know as much.
Actually, I'm a big fan of facts over rumors
Ivan Rodriguez going from a twig to a muscley Pillsbury Doughboy back to a twig again is all the proof I need. That along with someone saying that they told him how to use PEDs, bought him PEDs and injected PEDs into him helps. Ignoring that info would make me an idiot. I don't want to be an idiot.
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote
g3sz5nf]Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.[/quote
g3sz5nf]Thanks for finally providing solid proof, mert[/quote
g3sz5nf]There is more information out there for it than against it. I'm just siding with the quantitave information like a good logical person.[/quote
g3sz5nf]You're using "quantitative" in the incorrect context
sportscardtheory
Active member
JoshHamilton said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote:1af8k3yl]
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.[/quote:1af8k3yl]
Thanks for finally providing solid proof, mert[/quote:1af8k3yl]
There is more information out there for it than against it. I'm just siding with the quantitave information like a good logical person.[/quote:1af8k3yl]
You're using "quantitative" in the incorrect context[/quote:1af8k3yl]
Whatever. You know what I mean.
JoshHamilton
Well-known member
- Aug 7, 2008
- 12,205
- 320
sportscardtheory said:
WAY too late for that.
He doesn't look like a twig now. What the hell are you talking about?
Did he get bigger from the time he was a 17 year old on his 1988 ProCards rookie to his 2004 Topps card? Yes. So does, well, every other human being between the age of 17-33.
And that "someone" who outed him was Jose Canseco. I'm pretty sure Jose is either borderline retarded or completely delusional. Quite possibly insane. Read his twitter if you don't believe me. The guy is a total *******. So no, I don't believe anything he says in his book. He's a desperate, destitute attention ***** who had to go on a terrible reality show to make ends meet.
Until you get some solid proof Rodriguez was juicing, shut up[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
Thanks for finally providing solid proof, mert[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
There is more information out there for it than against it. I'm just siding with the quantitave information like a good logical person.[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
You're using "quantitative" in the incorrect context[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
Whatever. You know what I mean.[/quote:7ye2kuqj]
Actually, using that word somewhat ***** on your point.
The root of quantitative is quantity. The quantity of which you speak is exactly one
Your "information" comes from one person, Jose Canseco. He is an idiot.
Mert.
sportscardtheory
Active member
JoshHamilton said:
Ivan Rodriguez was a PED abuser. Deal with it.
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