Shill Bidding at it's best

Wow is all I can say one guy at 100%, another at 87% and a 3rd at 70%. Last one I could have sworn sold for like $325.00 and this is almost at $400.00 with 5 hours left. I can't see those bids being legit.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/DEREK-JETER...ON-CARD-Autograph-Auto-SP-Rare-/272121151995?

Honestly you can never tell sometimes though I see what your saying. A Griffey Green crusade which is about a $200 card and PSA 10s sold for about $300 at auction at peak times. A BGS 9 just sold for $510. The other side is 3 other rarer Griffey sold today all under what they normally do. Sometimes it just matters whose looking for what. Plus it's tax time, which in my opinion is the best time to sell.

bidder with 70% - 10 total spread out over 4 different items , each from a different seller......one bid on each of the other 3 items to go along with 7 bids on this item....sure doesn't look like shilling to me - just raising his bid on one item til he was the high bidder....(wont get into the strategy of doing that well before the item ends - some people just dont do things the best way)

new bidder with 87% - a newbie who has bid on 7 different items ..4 of the 7 are from this seller and this one alone saw him place 12 bids (with 4 bids on 2 of the others and a single bid on the fourth item)...again , i see no evidence of shilling , merely a newbie who bid over and over without ever becoming the high bidder and eventually stopped well short of the current high bid....

bidder with 100% - really ? an account with 42,000 feedback who just happens to have placed a single bid on 8 items with a single seller ? i just don't see someone using an account that well established to shill ...

maybe i'm jaded , but honestly , i don't care what this card HAS sold for or TYPICALLY sells for , i just think this is a case of someone seeing a card go for more than they want and crying wolf (or screaming shill) without really paying attention ....not every ebayer bids the same way and not everyone holds the same regard for the same items ...some things go high , others go low and they often have the conspiracy nuts coming out in droves even where there is no wrong doing....

Mikey!

with all of the bids.....Could be a Griffey jr. collectors in a bidding war. I been in a few myself. Best regards, David

The Green Crusade Griffey selling for $500+ is just nuts...

zlpeterson said:

The Green Crusade Griffey selling for $500+ is just nuts...

Click to expand...

Why is it nuts?

How often do any Griffey Crusades pop up for sale? Not very often. So when one does, if someone wants it, it's best to go ahead and get it while you can.

Just looking at ebay completed listings, there have been a total of four listings for green crusades and two of them were the same cards from two different sellers (both of whom are members of this forum). The reason the same cards were listed by the different sellers, is that [MENTION=12836]griffey0718[/MENTION] had them listed, but did a trade with [MENTION=12001]bcarlson33[/MENTION], who then offered it to me. The same rings true for the same Griffey Crusade Purple cards that were listed (same sellers), but I obtained both the green and the purple.

One Griffey Crusade Purple is showing sold for $999.99 back in November. I would say that it went for a best offer. However, it is a certain guarantee that if it did go for a best offer, that best offer was still very expensive.

Another Griffey Crusade Green was listed just a few short days ago, but was pulled. I contacted the seller and he received a offer for it that he could not refuse. I don't know what that offer was, but it was A LOT more than $200 than someone said it was "worth".

The book values of the Griffey Crusades and the real world values of the Griffey Crusades are vastly different.

viper said:

Why is it nuts?

How often do any Griffey Crusades pop up for sale? Not very often. So when one does, if someone wants it, it's best to go ahead and get it while you can.

Just looking at ebay completed listings, there have been a total of four listings for green crusades and two of them were the same cards from two different sellers (both of whom are members of this forum). The reason the same cards were listed by the different sellers, is that @griffey0718 had them listed, but did a trade with @bcarlson33, who then offered it to me. The same rings true for the same Griffey Crusade Purple cards that were listed (same sellers), but I obtained both the green and the purple.

One Griffey Crusade Purple is showing sold for $999.99 back in November. I would say that it went for a best offer. However, it is a certain guarantee that if it did go for a best offer, that best offer was still very expensive.

Another Griffey Crusade Green was listed just a few short days ago, but was pulled. I contacted the seller and he received a offer for it that he could not refuse. I don't know what that offer was, but it was A LOT more than $200 than someone said it was "worth".

The book values of the Griffey Crusades and the real world values of the Griffey Crusades are vastly different.

Click to expand...

I don't quote "book" value only real world value. Nobody uses book value that I know. Your right people can pay whatever they want. When I sold off parts of my collection every couple years I realized prices way beyond what they should of went for which was ok with me. I sold A Cut Above that used to be a $100 card for $525 at auction.

Forget the Hall Of Fame, the driver of Griffey in Feb through April is tax time. I've been following the market religiously since 2011 and it's like clockwork. I'm also not naïve to the fact Griffey values have steadily increased and I think will keep on increasing over the years. With that said its supply and demand. How rare is the green crusade? The Green Crusade pops up on a semi regular basis. It's not rare. Infact there have been 3 available just this month! The Purple a little more so but I personally don't think it's worth what It sold for recently. You can find Purple Crusades.

Dont get me wrong, I personally sell 99% of my stuff at auction just for those reasons because I usually realize way higher prices. I get why someone people pay higher. They want the card, don't folllow Griffey(or whoever) closely and don't know how often the item comes up. In September - December when stuff is listed I'm willing to bet most of it falls back down closer to previous levels.

One example I was talking to with Sevlist was his gold fusion. I lost 2 at auction that went $700+. He sold his and only got $440 roughly and this was recently.

viper said:

Why is it nuts?

How often do any Griffey Crusades pop up for sale? Not very often. So when one does, if someone wants it, it's best to go ahead and get it while you can.

Just looking at ebay completed listings, there have been a total of four listings for green crusades and two of them were the same cards from two different sellers (both of whom are members of this forum). The reason the same cards were listed by the different sellers, is that @griffey0718 had them listed, but did a trade with @bcarlson33, who then offered it to me. The same rings true for the same Griffey Crusade Purple cards that were listed (same sellers), but I obtained both the green and the purple.

One Griffey Crusade Purple is showing sold for $999.99 back in November. I would say that it went for a best offer. However, it is a certain guarantee that if it did go for a best offer, that best offer was still very expensive.

Another Griffey Crusade Green was listed just a few short days ago, but was pulled. I contacted the seller and he received a offer for it that he could not refuse. I don't know what that offer was, but it was A LOT more than $200 than someone said it was "worth".

The book values of the Griffey Crusades and the real world values of the Griffey Crusades are vastly different.

Click to expand...

I'm not comparing to book value. I'm comparing to real world value. Since Christmas I know of at least 3 Griffey Green Crusades that have been sold, all of them around 50%-60% of the value of that one. In fact, there are at least two PURPLE Griffey Crusades that have sold in the same time frame and they've barely sold above that $510 for the Green.

That's why it's nuts, because compared to real world value established over the past two months it's an extreme outlier....like really extreme

Also the purple you reference that "sold" for $999 did not sell at that value. A best offer was accepted and it was much lower than that.

As for this Jeter that Chris is talking about, selling for $476 compared to $325 isn't that crazy considering the player and rarity. Also the fact that the card was one by someone with only 5% bids with this seller lets me know that that person was willing to spend that much on the card no matter how it got to where it ended. I know this has been mentioned numerous times by me and many other but the only way to protect yourself against a shill is to "SNIPE" at the end, otherwise you are rolling the dice on two thing. 1) the obvious "shill" and 2) people are not very bright.... I have noticed that some people just seem to think that they need to be on top of the bids at all times, but the only bid that really matter is your last bid. Take the guessing out, snipe at the end with what you are willing to spend and move on. Otherwise you are playing with fire. The only time I bid early is to maybe put a place holder bid really low. I am not defending people who shill there items because I think it is shady and crappy, but if you get into a bidding war at anytime of an auction you are screwing yourself. Just be patient and SNIPE.

Shill bidding thread about a Jeter card, and all of the discussion is about Griffey. If that doesn't tell you how hot the Griffey market is then I don't know what does

I know as a player collector I sometimes pay way above market price for certain super rare Mattingly cards that I don't have. I often find myself in the middle of a bidding war with several other hard core Mattingly collectors over these rare cards and know that the only way to get it is to pay above book. Its all about supply and demand.

Wow I didn't think this was going to draw that much attention as for my crying shill bid because I wasn't going to spend that much is a little off because as of right now I am not buying much due to my wife being pregnant and I am only using paypal fees which I don't have at the moment but I still follow cards I am looking for and this one the sellers talks about 2 corners being in excellent shape which to me would severely lower the value. Yes the winner wanted it bad but I don't care about feedbacks generally when I see someone with bids and over 50% of the bids are on one seller I question it especially early I have seen rarer Jeter card that are super low till the last few minutes to seconds. Card with minutes left at $100.00 and ending at $800.00 now and days people live and die by the snipe bid so seeing 3 people and I don't care the feedback at 50% bids on one person leads me to believe of shill biding. Who know his 42k feedback could be his primary which got bad feedbacks because of shill bidding and his fix was to have multiple accounts and I know plenty with more than one account all it takes is a different email account. You can think what you want I wasn't getting this card no matter what I just questioned how so many bidders had such a high percentage on one bidder with all the cards they list on ebay through multiple sellers.

I don't think anyone was giving you a hard time Chris, we were simply giving our opinions... Think you are being a little over sensitive bud. My wife just had twins so I get being a little on edge Good luck with the baby!! Cards will soon become secondary by a large stretch.

mrdallas said:

I don't think anyone was giving you a hard time Chris, we were simply giving our opinions... Think you are being a little over sensitive bud. My wife just had twins so I get being a little on edge Good luck with the baby!! Cards will soon become secondary by a large stretch.

Click to expand...

I am dealing with credit card fraud as well so I am not in the best of moods seeing it was my own brother who did it to me.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Freedom Card Board mobile app