Arod joins Hank Aaron in exclusive 2,000 RBI club, fittingly with HR #666.

Exactly the point which makes it worse. He has the hand eye coordination, so any drug use enhances his ability which is already great. That is what makes this an issue because his numbers are compared to past legends, most of which were before the steroid era.



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All In Cards said:

drugs or no drugs, still takes hand eye coordination to do it.

and most of arod's rbi's probably came of pitchers that where on the juice also.

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That's true. Roids don't make you a better hitter. but it makes the ball go farther. Mike Schmidt once said imagine all those balls he hit that landed at the wall that would of been a HR if he was roiding. And again you are accusing a lot of pitchers are on the juice. Do you have proof or are or speculating?

homerun28aa said:

Aaron's hitting feats are truly extraordinary but A-Rod still deserves a heck of a lot of credit. Steroids or not, his swing is incredible and he played in an era where at least 80% of the top power hitters were juicing not to mention many of the top pitchers. Hats off to the guy I hope he gets to 700 HR's

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80% really? can you back this up?

bongo870 said:

80% really? can you back this up?

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At least 80%, I was being pretty conservative with that number. In the early 2000's you really question whether it was a culture or a select few? Read some of the stuff the players who have been caught from that era have to say about it. Yeah I get it, they were caught and have incentive to make it seem like everyone was doing it but by basically all accounts that was the case.

bongo870 said:

That's true. Roids don't make you a better hitter. but it makes the ball go farther. Mike Schmidt once said imagine all those balls he hit that landed at the wall that would of been a HR if he was roiding. And again you are accusing a lot of pitchers are on the juice. Do you have proof or are or speculating?

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they wouldnt call it the steroid era if it was 1 or 2 players.

My guess is the owners and league knew what was going on and it was good for baseball at the time.

They were both really good at baseballing.

Yay baseballers!

These threads devolve almost as quickly as musical taste threads. It's ridiculous.

All In Cards said:

they wouldnt call it the steroid era if it was 1 or 2 players.

My guess is the owners and league knew what was going on and it was good for baseball at the time.

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They had to have known about it, whether they went along with it proactively or turned the shoulder or what can definitely be debated but for something like that to go on without the owners or league even having a clue is difficult to imagine. If you read what the former players who got caught said (I guess they have skin in the game to lie, but still) it was a tough task to find someone who wasn't juicing.

I always ask this question to the steroid user supporters. And no one will ever answer. Say your son or brother or loved one comes home one day and says " dad I take steroids to get bigger is it ok?" What would you say? People say its not a big deal that Aroid took steroids but would you allow your child to take them? if no why not? you say its ok that Aroid and others take it and play ball.
I saw one time on real sports about steroids and they said something that stuck with me. These kids growing up look up to these players. They see that you can take steroids and get away with it. So they are buying the junk stuff out there because they cant afford the quality stuff like what Aroid gets. These kids are killing themselves because of people that support the roiders say its ok to use these drugs and keep on playing.
So if you want to support illegal drug users then fine but again what would you say if your family member was using?

never said it was ok, and if some ball player wants to inject some foreign substance in their body, who am I to stop them. Its their health not mine.

bongo870 said:

I always ask this question to the steroid user supporters. And no one will ever answer. Say your son or brother or loved one comes home one day and says " dad I take steroids to get bigger is it ok?" What would you say? People say its not a big deal that Aroid took steroids but would you allow your child to take them? if no why not? you say its ok that Aroid and others take it and play ball.
I saw one time on real sports about steroids and they said something that stuck with me. These kids growing up look up to these players. They see that you can take steroids and get away with it. So they are buying the junk stuff out there because they cant afford the quality stuff like what Aroid gets. These kids are killing themselves because of people that support the roiders say its ok to use these drugs and keep on playing.
So if you want to support illegal drug users then fine but again what would you say if your family member was using?

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I've taken steroids. I know a lot of people who have/do. Where I'm from its not that uncommon and when I was n the army it was pretty rampant too. Of course abusing steroids isn't a good idea, just like abusing anything else but doing it safely and with proper information they're not as dangerous as people r led to believe

bongo870 said:

No but i have evidence that Aroid did. And Aaron (if he did) was never caught so there is no proof that he took anything. but Aroid on the other hand....

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Ok, like everything, there's no problem until you are caught.

To me these are the ultimate RBI legends. It took a rare disease and 3 prime years into the military for them to miss the highest marks.

Except for Bonds, the best all-around player(s) IMO that I’ve seen play (juice or not). Ahead of Pujols. Ahead of Griffey. As was said earlier, we will never know who was truly clean during that time. One can assume all he/she wants, but ya know what that’s worth.

I hadn’t looked at these in a while, so it was nice to pull them out and scan them. Here are my Arods (without scanning dups):

George_Calfas said:

"The spotlight on the "Pittsburgh problem" by the national media led to the more widespread awareness of use of other drugs such as amphetamines ("greenies" in baseball vernacular) and marijuana in the game. Both have a long history in baseball; Milner (who had retired two years earlier due to recurring hamstring injuries), in fact, spoke of Willie Mays and Willie Stargell, both iconic figures and Baseball Hall of Famers, giving him greenies."

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What most people don't understand doing greenies reefer or even blow is only going to affect a performance for one game at most.

Roids on the other hand help create muscle that leads to cheating on another level. Unlike greenies roids affect the athlete for a MUCH longer period thus the true unfair advantage.

Aroids # will always have an * like Bonds and big Mac.

Waxov said:

View attachment 52021


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To me these are the ultimate RBI legends. It took a rare disease and 3 prime years into the military for them to miss the highest marks.

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YES!

Krom said:

What most people don't understand doing greenies reefer or even blow is only going to affect a performance for one game at most.

Roids on the other hand help create muscle that leads to cheating on another level. Unlike greenies roids affect the athlete for a MUCH longer period thus the true unfair advantage.

Aroids # will always have an * like Bonds and big Mac.

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Thank you

Krom said:

What most people don't understand doing greenies reefer or even blow is only going to affect a performance for one game at most.

Roids on the other hand help create muscle that leads to cheating on another level. Unlike greenies roids affect the athlete for a MUCH longer period thus the true unfair advantage.

Aroids # will always have an * like Bonds and big Mac.

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Mmmm, no if you do them daily like cups of coffee. Exactly the way they are described to have been used in the 60s and 70s.

good article from 2005 about greenies

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=kreidler_mark&id=2225013

greenies got mentioned at least as far back as the Pittsburgh drug trials of the 1980s, when players testified they received the stimulants from Willie Stargell, Bill Madlock and even Mays. All three men, who denied either using or supplying, later were cleared of wrongdoing by the commissioner's office. (The current commissioner, Selig, has said he first heard about greenies in the old Milwaukee Braves clubhouses of the late 1950s.)

The stimulants have been steadily mentioned ever since, too -- but almost never by anyone in the midst of his career. A retired Tony Gwynn spoke openly of baseball's amphetamine problem in 2003, estimating for The New York Times that 50 percent of position players were using them routinely, many of them before almost every game. (Gwynn subsequently was blasted by those in uniform at the time for, in their opinion, speaking out of school.) Chad Curtis spoke after his retirement about the pressure on fielders not to play the game "naked" -- that is, not to play without speed.

Anyone who compares the effects of greenie use and steroid use is an idiot.
Using steroids and growth hormones to transform your body into a monster like McGwire, Bonds and Sosa is on another level compared to taking speed to get you through a long grueling season.

Austin said:

Anyone who compares the effects of greenie use and steroid use is an idiot.
Using steroids and growth hormones to transform your body into a monster like McGwire, Bonds and Sosa is on another level compared to taking speed to get you through a long grueling season.

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Bummer MLB and other professional sports have not asked four you knowledgeable opinion and inviting you to their committees of Drug Programs.