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Walter Johnson Signed Type 1 Washington Post Photo - Would love some help researching this

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Topnotchsy

Featured Contributor, The best players in history?
Aug 7, 2008
9,446
170
Hey all,

I recently was able to pick up this really cool "Type 1" photo signed by Walter Johnson. Now I am trying to find out who the people in the photo are (the one on the left is Johnson)

Here's the info from the piece itself:
It's a photo from the Washington Post from the 1940's. Johnson died in 1946, so it is obviously from before then.

On the back it says:
"This photograph made by the Washington Post and may not be reproduced by any publication unless credit line is give."

Along with:
THE WASHINGTON POT
AUTOMOTIVE HEADQUARTERS
NEWS - MARKET INFORMATION - SALES
ALLAN C. WHITEHEAD, AUTOMOTIVE EDITOR

Thanks in advance!


Johnson, Walter Signed Photo 001.jpg
Johnson, Walter Signed Photo Back 001.jpg
 

A_Pharis

Active member
Hey all,

I recently was able to pick up this really cool "Type 1" photo signed by Walter Johnson. Now I am trying to find out who the people in the photo are (the one on the left is Johnson)

Here's the info from the piece itself:
It's a photo from the Washington Post from the 1940's. Johnson died in 1946, so it is obviously from before then.

On the back it says:
"This photograph made by the Washington Post and may not be reproduced by any publication unless credit line is give."

Along with:
THE WASHINGTON POT
AUTOMOTIVE HEADQUARTERS
NEWS - MARKET INFORMATION - SALES
ALLAN C. WHITEHEAD, AUTOMOTIVE EDITOR

Thanks in advance!


View attachment 46452
View attachment 46453

Is that a facsimile signature or hard signed by Johnson?


I gotta be honest, man. Is there anywhere on their site the differentiates? The slab label and the sticker both have the same cert. number, and it only denotes the authenticity as a Type I.
 

LWMM

Well-known member
Feb 21, 2009
1,062
46
Oh, I see where you say there's a cert for the auto, too. What's the number on it?

http://www.psacard.com/DNACert/1P03406


Item: Photo 1900-1969
Primary Subject: WALTER JOHNSON
Size: 8x10
Photo Type: I
Photo Genre: Original Photograph
Issuer: The Washington Post
Item Era: c. 1940s
Result/Grade: Authentic


Supersized:
https://catalog.scpauctions.com/ItemImages/000024/0127A_lg.jpeg
https://catalog.scpauctions.com/ItemImages/000024/0127B_lg.jpeg

Really nice auto!
 

A_Pharis

Active member
http://www.psacard.com/DNACert/1P03406


Item: Photo 1900-1969
Primary Subject: WALTER JOHNSON
Size: 8x10
Photo Type: I
Photo Genre: Original Photograph
Issuer: The Washington Post
Item Era: c. 1940s
Result/Grade: Authentic


Supersized:
https://catalog.scpauctions.com/ItemImages/000024/0127A_lg.jpeg
https://catalog.scpauctions.com/ItemImages/000024/0127B_lg.jpeg

Really nice auto!

I saw all of that. I think that is authenticating it as a Type I, but I don't look up Type I's... that's why i was asking if there was a separate cert. # sicne he said there were two.

PSA does have this on their site, though:
walter-johnson-signed-photo-3.jpg


And it's titled as "signed"
 

Topnotchsy

Featured Contributor, The best players in history?
Aug 7, 2008
9,446
170
@LWMM : Here's another example of a Type I

http://www.psacard.com/DNACert/1P04884

Note that there's no signature, and the wording for the authentication is the same.
If I were @Topnotchsy, I'd at least want a cert. # for the signature, specifically, if he didn't get one.

I'm not sure the word "signed" in the picture cert would be enough to go on, since I think it is simply noting that there is a signature without saying who signed it.

That said, It's got a separate full-page cert for the signature:

http://www.psacard.com/DNACert/h58958
 

A_Pharis

Active member
I'm not sure the word "signed" in the picture cert would be enough to go on, since I think it is simply noting that there is a signature without saying who signed it.

That said, It's got a separate full-page cert for the signature:

http://www.psacard.com/DNACert/h58958

Very cool! See, I don't follow Type I's, and I couldn't imagine buying something of that tier without very specific certification. I know you're on your toes with the types of stuff you own, but it is nice to see.
 

Topnotchsy

Featured Contributor, The best players in history?
Aug 7, 2008
9,446
170
Very cool! See, I don't follow Type I's, and I couldn't imagine buying something of that tier without very specific certification. I know you're on your toes with the types of stuff you own, but it is nice to see.

I appreciate it. I've made a zillion mistakes over the years and continue to do so at times, so it was definitely a valid point.

I'm just starting to learn a bit about the world of photos, having bought this more for the signature than anything else, but getting introduced to a whole different world of collecting here. Based on the wording on the back it seems clear that this is an original Washington Post photo, beyond being a "Type 1" (which means it was made from the original negative within roughly 2 years of the picture being taken.)

I think because the content is not super sports related (like a picture in uniform) it's not a particularly valuable photo on its own, but I'll take it over a signed check in a heartbeat, and the white ink on black background pops like crazy.
 

Austin

Well-known member
Aug 7, 2008
5,706
41
Dallas, Texas
So Johnson used a white paint pen or something? Can you see the ink marks under a magnifying glass?

The reason I ask is that is was very, very common for vintage photographs and postcards to include the white (or negative) facsimile signatures printed on them.
And PSA/DNA has been known to authenticate printed and facsimile signatures.

I hope it's really signed because that's a cool piece, but I don't recall seeing a baseball autograph from that era signed in white ink.
 
Last edited:

cjedmonton

Well-known member
Sep 20, 2009
1,890
313
Great White North
I love a good baseball mystery, especially with a cool item like this.

I am certain I've seen those other two men before (in a baseball context). However, since this was taken by the Washington Post, perhaps they are political figures? The one in the middle bears somewhat of a resemblence to VP Henry Wallace. Then again, he also looks a bit like George Mogridge...one of Johnson's ex-teammates from the '24 championship team.

If you haven't already, I'd definitely recommend posting this to Net54 as well.
 

Topnotchsy

Featured Contributor, The best players in history?
Aug 7, 2008
9,446
170
So Johnson used a white paint pen or something? Can you see the ink marks under a magnifying glass?

The reason I ask is that is was very, very common for vintage photographs and postcards to include the white (or negative) facsimile signatures printed on them.
And PSA/DNA has been known to authenticate printed and facsimile signatures.

I hope it's really signed because that's a cool piece, but I don't think I've ever seen an autograph from that era signed in white ink.

I'm not an expert to I appreciate any insight, but this is what I see and understand (beyond the PSA/DNA cert)

Looking at it under the light you can see that there is an imprint (from the force of something pushing down) where the pen went over so I'm pretty confident it's not printed on (there's even imprint in the loop of the "h" in "Johnson" where there is no ink.)

Can a "Type 1" picture (printed from the negative) have a facsimile signature? I'm not sure how it would printing from the negative. And from the looks of it (the stamp on the back and wording for the image cert) it seems like this was not just a Type 1 but the original copy made.

My guess is that if in fact the people here are executives, they met Johnson, who presented them with a ball, and then maybe signed the picture for them in white ink.

That said, I'm definitely not an expert, so any info is welcomed.
 

Austin

Well-known member
Aug 7, 2008
5,706
41
Dallas, Texas
Looking at it under the light you can see that there is an imprint (from the force of something pushing down) where the pen went over so I'm pretty confident it's not printed on (there's even imprint in the loop of the "h" in "Johnson" where there is no ink.)

Can a "Type 1" picture (printed from the negative) have a facsimile signature? I'm not sure how it would printing from the negative. And from the looks of it (the stamp on the back and wording for the image cert) it seems like this was not just a Type 1 but the original copy made.
Well that's great about the ink, and you're right that it wouldn't have a facsimile signature if it's from the original negative.
Awesome signature and photo!

As for your original question, the old man on the right looks familiar for some reason, but he may just be an automotive executive. Having the lone original photograph from 75 or so years ago could make it tough to find any record of the subjects pictured.
 

Topnotchsy

Featured Contributor, The best players in history?
Aug 7, 2008
9,446
170
I love a good baseball mystery, especially with a cool item like this.

I am certain I've seen those other two men before (in a baseball context). However, since this was taken by the Washington Post, perhaps they are political figures? The one in the middle bears somewhat of a resemblence to VP Henry Wallace. Then again, he also looks a bit like George Mogridge...one of Johnson's ex-teammates from the '24 championship team.

If you haven't already, I'd definitely recommend posting this to Net54 as well.

I had posted something about photos, so I added some info about this. If it does not get noticed where it is I'll make it a separate thread but because I'm basically a newbie there and there aren't that many threads posted, I didn't want to start too many threads. (Here I don't worry about that lol.)

This thread reminds me that I never finished researching the signed WWII Stan Musial baseballs I picked up when his estate was auctioned off. I was able to ID most of the people on one of them (many of whom never made the Majors) but never really went through the other one. After working on this that may be the next thing I work on. I too love researching these things (although I am kind of stumped on where to even look on this one without names, an idea of the event or even a year to work with...
 

metallicalex777

Super Moderator
Aug 7, 2008
13,903
117
Seattle, Wa
I couldn't find anything "legit" beyond trying to compare facial features, but I think the middle gentleman could be Calvin Coolidge. There are quite a few articles showing that Coolidge went to and was a part of meet/greets with players from the Washington Senators organization. Mainly the pointy ears and the dominant nose structure leads me to believe that:

walter_johnson_and_calvin_coolidge_shake_hands_final2.jpg

12220v.jpg

coolidges-baseball.jpg
 

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