GARY SHEFFIELD HOFer????

There has been an never ending debate on whether Gary Sheffield is a MLB Hall of Famer. I cannot argue he has been brash, has made mistakes, but a lot of his passion for the game seems to get blown out of proportion.

If he gets it, it will be after a few years...IE: more than the two years you have as options.

What is your opinion?

juicers dont belong in the hall

I have always been a huge fan being a Brewer fan and always took the heat for liking him. One of the extreme talents in MLB history. I wish someone would have signed him so he could get 3000 hits which is a short ways off. With all of his injuries, the numbers do not lie. My License plate was SHEF 11, I have Sheffield Street Signs, and a huge collection of his cards and memorabilia.

blazers091 said:

juicers dont belong in the hall

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In a perfect world, we wouldn't have the issue, but here in the real world, we'd be fools to assume that no one currently in the HOF used steroids at least once.

blazers091 said:

juicers dont belong in the hall

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I agree with this statement to a point, but he only used it once and it was a cream. Not HGH like Bonds and others. Another point to think about would be, the pitchers were on it too. I wish there was some scientific formula to see what % of the HR's these guys hit would not have gone out. I mean if Bonds hit one 500 ft. If he was not on HGH would it have gone 450 ft. Or does the quick reflexes make it possible for him to hit it. THe debate will go on forever.

There is a long list of roiders that I would put in before him.
Mike

You either let no one in from this era and you let everyone in if their numbers are worthy. There is no way anyone will ever be able to sort out who used and who didn't and what the impact was. And Sheffield's numbers are worthy.

Does everyone forget that he dogged it to get out of Milwaukee?

hofmichael said:

There is a long list of roiders that I would put in before him.
Mike

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+1

If he gets in, it won't be until after Bonds/Sosa/McGwire/Palmeiro get in, among others.

ALL_THE_HYPE said:

hofmichael said:

There is a long list of roiders that I would put in before him.
Mike

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+1

If he gets in, it won't be until after Bonds/Sosa/McGwire/Palmeiro get in, among others.

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I'd actually put him in before Palmeiro. I can't remember teams ever fearing Palmeiro when he stepped to the plate (all statistics aside), but Sheffield in his prime was always a threat.

200lbhockeyplayer said:

blazers091 said:

juicers dont belong in the hall

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In a perfect world, we wouldn't have the issue, but here in the real world, we'd be fools to assume that no one currently in the HOF used steroids at least once.

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I used to have a very anti-steroid stance. However, the bolded part is what continues to stick in my head. I have absolutely zero doubt that a steroid user is in the Hall. I would venture to say that they were a user and not someone who tried it just once.

I still disagree with steroid use and I would like for them not to be inducted, but it was something that was rampant in MLB for a period of time. Unless you do not include anyone from that era, then you can't just let some in because we'll never know who all used and who didn't.

If someone failed a test, then I would say if the voters wanted, they have a reason to keep them out. As for someone that was just surrounded by pure speculation with no proof, then I don't think it should hurt them.

My biggest problem is for those who didn't use and are potential HOFers. I think it is unfair that they did things the right to make it while others cheated their way in. Like I mentioned before though, we'll never know the entire truth on who falls into which category.

ThoseBackPages said:

Does everyone forget that he dogged it to get out of Milwaukee?

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This was what was reported, but he was 18 years old at the time. It later was reported that he was joking. Ask Robin Yount what he thought of Sheffield, glowing reports all over the place.

200lbhockeyplayer said:

ALL_THE_HYPE said:

hofmichael said:

There is a long list of roiders that I would put in before him.
Mike

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+1

If he gets in, it won't be until after Bonds/Sosa/McGwire/Palmeiro get in, among others.

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I'd actually put him in before Palmeiro. I can't remember teams ever fearing Palmeiro when he stepped to the plate (all statistics aside), but Sheffield in his prime was always a threat.

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I totally agree with the last comment. Sheffield didn't use steroids at great lengths like the above mentioned. He at least admitted that Bonds tried to get him to use them and then when he found out, they were no longer friends.

I think he goes in the Hall of Very Good but not the HOF. He really only had 4 or 5 great years. I also think jumping around to so many teams hurts him with the voters.

I can't wait until the 2013 ballot. Here are the first timers in 2013 (ranked according to Bill James HOF monitor): http://www.baseball-reference.com/play- ... reit/vxM4u

Barry Bonds
Roger Clemens
Mike Piazza
Sammy Sosa
Curt Schilling
Craig Biggio

I think we'll know a lot more about where the HOF stands on steroid users after this election. Palmeiro in 2011 will be a big test. 2012 as well, because there really isn't a single standout first timer on that ballot (the highest on the HOF monitor is Bernie Williams), and those years are usually good ones for the borderline players to accumulate votes.


David

Looking at baseball-reference, on stats alone Sheff has a good shot:

Similar Batters
Mel Ott (875) *
Reggie Jackson (864) *
Ken Griffey (856)
Fred McGriff (850)
Mickey Mantle (840) *
Billy Williams (837) *
Frank Robinson (836) *
Frank Thomas (832)
Al Kaline (830) *
Ernie Banks (821) *


Black Ink Batting - 4 (416), Average HOFer ? 27
Gray Ink Batting - 123 (153), Average HOFer ? 144
Hall of Fame Monitor Batting - 156 (77), Likely HOFer ? 100
Hall of Fame Standards Batting - 61 (28), Average HOFer ? 50

A couple things on Sheff...

1. He was terrible with the media, and don't forget who votes for the HOFers. Just like Jim Rice, he was not a great media-guy and look how long it took him to get in.

2. Steroid allegations/usage.

3. His 162 game average is good, but doesn't stand out as GREAT (.292-32-105). And of all the modern-day players with 500+ home Runs, his average of 32 over 162 games is the lowest. Palmeiro is next with 33, but Palmeiro at least has 500+ career doubles, more RBI's than Sheffield and 3000+ hits.

4. Outside of his batting title in '92 and OBP and OPS in '96, he never led the league in any category.

5. Yes, the 500+ HR's is nice. The 1676 RBI's is good. But the lack of 3000 hits (2689) and 500 doubles (467), especially for a guy with a .292 career average and was a good hitter, makes him a questionable HOFer. This is more and more reason why I think 600 HR's is becoming the new 500. 500 HR's is not what it used to be.

cubfan131 said:

I think he goes in the Hall of Very Good but not the HOF. He really only had 4 or 5 great years. I also think jumping around to so many teams hurts him with the voters.

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Agreed. It makes you look all about the money and writers never really get a chance to form a mutual respect with you since your bouncing around so much!

Positives - 500 hrs, 1600 rbis, 8 100 rbi seasons, batting title, WS, 3 top 5 MVP seasons.

Negatives - PEDs, 8 teams in 21 years + looks terrible, had a terrible attitude and wore out his welcome on many occasions. Also said some stupid stuff to the media.

IMO, considering he used PEDS, I would have to vote in the other PED users first before I get to sheffield!

yes on numbers he deserves to be in the hall of fame.

if we continue to discuss steroids and peds we need to open the dates that can be considered the "steroid era" steroids have a history in athletics that take us back pre WWII! the germans, russians, and other eastern countries have a noted olympic history with them. pre 1972 there was no testing in the olympics. so steroids were a big enough concern in 72 for the ioc to put testing into action. to assume that they had not made their way into other sports in their 42 years since inception is short sighted and to a point lacking intelligence.

not to mention the performance enhancing drugs category must include greenies. amphetamines increase focus and wakefulness while decreasing fatigue and wear. which by definition would be THE performance enhancer. this should cast the same haze over the last 40-50 years that steroids have over the last 7.

yet to admit that the heroes of yesteryear were using greenies or steroids to keep pace is abhorrent and unacceptable in the media and on chat boards. if i say cal ripkens streak is less impressive than lou gehrigs because cal ripken used amphetamines i get blasted. but if i say barry bonds record breaking homerun was less impressive than hank aarons i am embraced. bottom line is you cannot without doubt say that aaron did not ingest something to give him an edge. you cannot do it. the tools were available for him to have the same edge over his peers that barry had over his.