Pathetic card shops in my area .. and a question

I just moved to a new city - about 18,000 pop roughly 2 months ago and for the first time I decided to check out the area and see if I could find any card shops. I went to the mall and saw two little card shops. One I guess you could say wasn't really a card shop, more plaques with cards in them and WAY overpriced. The second one had a little case with mostly football cards in it and from what I could tell, also WAY overpriced. You could tell the boxes and singles were just collecting dust and they featured clothes and jerseys more than anything in their store which to me, I thought was funny because there is a sports authority store on the other side of the mall (not a big mall) that sells the exact same stuff and probably cheaper. There was a woman in there sitting down reading a book and I am thinking that wasn't the owner. Not saying a woman couldn't be the owner, but when I walked in, she didn't give me too much attention so that makes me think she was just a worker.

As I left the store, I noticed that there were some vacant spots that could be leased out. I always thought I had a good sense of to how to run and market a business. Currently I work in IT, but from what I found over the years is that people recognize your people skills and personality over anything else. Thankfully I have both. Ok, getting back to the card stores. I was thinking of finding out how much it is to lease a store front in the mall, I am sure it won't be cheap as typically malls cost a bit more in rent opposed to finding an open building in town. At least that was my impression anyone because of the added foot traffic.

Before I inquire about a possible store, I was thinking of finding and talking to the owner of the second card shop I went into and ask if they would like some assistance in marketing their store better. Not only limited to how to market their sports cards, but also to create a website and advertise a little bit. I know some people that have their own business can be stubborn and may be offended if I ask to help. But I am looking at it from my viewpoint if they accepted my assistance even on a temporary basis, it would allow me to get more involved in a store that I always wanted to create and also cutting down my costs of paying rent on a lease as well as adding new inventory.

Do you think I would be out of line for talking to the owner and mentioning that I could help him/her market their business a little better to sell the cards that are sitting in the corner and expanding their card inventory to appease a larger market? Or should I say "screw it' and try to open my own business which I believe would put both of those stores out of business? Also, what are your thoughts about having a card shop in a mall opposed to a store front downtown?

what city?

Its cant hurt to ask.

My parents always told me the worst answer you can get is NO.

cgilmo said:

what city?

Click to expand...

Marshfield, WI

All In Cards said:

Its cant hurt to ask.

My parents always told me the worst answer you can get is NO.

Click to expand...

That's true...or a slap in the face...which depending who is slapping me, I may like it.

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

I do think a good mix is a good idea because you will always have mom's shopping with their kids and a store should appeal to all ages. I like the gaming idea as I know a store in a town about 45 mins from me has more of a market on gaming opposed to sports cards, but I feel as though they would be more of a success if they spent as much time in both.

Also, the idea would be to have a ton of stock. I know from my experiences walking into shops is that I would want something that is new and readily available. I have been told so many times that they don't have something in stock, but they can order it for me. Well, if I was going to do that, I could just order myself and save some money in the process. Either way I have to wait. To me, seeing 2008 Topps Baseball/Football on the shelf isn't going to even barely scratch my itch for wanting to bust something. I know that if I get an overstock in boxes, I have an easy way out of eBay so to me, I don't believe you can ever have too much. Like you said, for the obsessive card geeks, they will want to bust something now opposed to find some cheap ass retail boxes.

Another thing is that, even though I have to cover the storefront costs and my overhead on boxes, this to me is more of a hobby and I would expect to keep my costs down and may not be as competitive as internet stores, I will try my best to be as close as I can be. I think I can make more profit that way selling things at a lower price instead of over pricing my boxes like so many store fronts do and thus meaning those higher priced boxes take longer to sell.

I have never been to either but doesn't one of them have a bunch of late 80'/early 90's factory sets?

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

you might as well sell singles too if you do the boxes

maximize your walk in traffic


First priority is to find a good source for product if you decide to do this.

Reds in 2009 said:

I have never been to either but doesn't one of them have a bunch of late 80'/early 90's factory sets?

Click to expand...

Yes, that would be the place. And from what I remember, they are marked up in price for what the would have sold in the 80's/90's. :?

prospectorgems said:

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

I do think a good mix is a good idea because you will always have mom's shopping with their kids and a store should appeal to all ages. I like the gaming idea as I know a store in a town about 45 mins from me has more of a market on gaming opposed to sports cards, but I feel as though they would be more of a success if they spent as much time in both.

Also, the idea would be to have a ton of stock. I know from my experiences walking into shops is that I would want something that is new and readily available. I have been told so many times that they don't have something in stock, but they can order it for me. Well, if I was going to do that, I could just order myself and save some money in the process. Either way I have to wait. To me, seeing 2008 Topps Baseball/Football on the shelf isn't going to even barely scratch my itch for wanting to bust something. I know that if I get an overstock in boxes, I have an easy way out of eBay so to me, I don't believe you can ever have too much. Like you said, for the obsessive card geeks, they will want to bust something now opposed to find some cheap ass retail boxes.

Another thing is that, even though I have to cover the storefront costs and my overhead on boxes, this to me is more of a hobby and I would expect to keep my costs down and may not be as competitive as internet stores, I will try my best to be as close as I can be. I think I can make more profit that way selling things at a lower price instead of over pricing my boxes like so many store fronts do and thus meaning those higher priced boxes take longer to sell.

Click to expand...

Having a lot of stock is good and bad I think. I love going to a store and seeing the boxes I'm looking to buy. That's a big plus for me. But, you have to judge what percentage of your buyers are the HIGH END gamblers out there looking for Exquisite, NT, RRR and others. If you order too much of these products and you have like 1 or 2 high end busters...that could be an issue when a product tanks and you are stuck with "high end" boxes that you have no choice but to take a huge loss on.

My thinking on boxes is to have inventory but also a very balanced inventory. Things get sold out all the time...it's part of doing business and never underestimate the lower end boxes as (like you said) parents come in with kids all the time looking to "buy a few packs" and will NOT shell out more than $3 per pack of anything. Get a healthy supply of those as well.

cgilmo said:

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

you might as well sell singles too if you do the boxes

maximize your walk in traffic


First priority is to find a good source for product if you decide to do this.

Click to expand...

I agree, thank you. So is the mindset here to take a business and start a-new or try first at partnering up or offering advice to the other owner in hopes they will take me on as a part time consultant/marketing person?

cgilmo said:

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

you might as well sell singles too if you do the boxes

maximize your walk in traffic


First priority is to find a good source for product if you decide to do this.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm cool with that too. I was just referring to Hobby Box' approach to doing business and it seems to be working for him!

Messier2 said:

cgilmo said:

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

you might as well sell singles too if you do the boxes

maximize your walk in traffic


First priority is to find a good source for product if you decide to do this.

Click to expand...

Yeah, I'm cool with that too. I was just referring to Hobby Box' approach to doing business and it seems to be working for him!

Click to expand...

youtube has allowed it to work for him
without youtube i dont know if he would
be getting the same business

prospectorgems said:

cgilmo said:

Messier2 said:

Card shops whether in a mall or storefront HAS to have non-sports (gaming) cards in order to survive...Magic and whatever else is out there is a BIG money maker. They usually have very LOYAL followers that throw down $$$ for "gaming" cards.

Sports cards and autos are nice but you need to included some gaming stuff as well to ensure a continuous revenue stream (just in case the sports card business slows down).

Or, you can do what the Hobby Box does and just sell sealed boxes...no singles...that could be good too for the obsessive card geeks like me who have the itch to bust and will pay $5-$10 over retail just to "have it now"!

Click to expand...

you might as well sell singles too if you do the boxes

maximize your walk in traffic


First priority is to find a good source for product if you decide to do this.

Click to expand...

I agree, thank you. So is the mindset here to take a business and start a-new or try first at partnering up or offering advice to the other owner in hopes they will take me on as a part time consultant/marketing person?

Click to expand...

those guys do what they do for a reason


I wouldn't even bother with them.

There is one thing, and one thing only in determining whether or not you should even spend any more time thinking about opening a shop...market. So in a town of 18,000, there are two hobby related stores that don't do too much on the card side...there very well not be a market for it. If these businesses have been around for 10 years, if there was a market for cards, surely at least one of the stores would have seen the light.

Also understand where you'll make money and where you won't. Wax is almost always a convenience product for hobby store as the margin is so thin for brick and mortar stores with the overhead considerations. Wax also ties up capital more than anything else. You could outlay $100 for a box of SPx for a possible profit of $25, or $100 in team licensed items with a probable profit of $200+.

You could dedicate precious retail counter space to singles only to sell very few a week, and therefore create a constantly stale stock.

Sure, you could do a website, but who are you competing with, and for what? You can't compete with Sportlots (or similar) for base singles, you won't be able to compete with eBay for other singles, and you can't compete with distributors for wax.

Clearly there is a slant in the above...and it's "I think it's a bad idea because it makes no financial sense."

wax is to hobby shops what gas is to gas stations



the markup is low, but it gets people in the door


shop owners make a living off what they do with that traffic

you could start out small or even try something different.

Talk to the mall management and ask about having a show in the mall. You could promote the show and be in charge of it all. Make a few bucks and then also have a table for wax and singles.

cgilmo said:

wax is to hobby shops what gas is to gas stations



the markup is low, but it gets people in the door


shop owners make a living off what they do with that traffic

Click to expand...

Similar in concept only, but vastly different.

Gas station owners aren't losing money on gas because the concept of "shelf life" is non-existent. In wax, a shop can drop $70/cost for a $90/MSRP product only to have the product die and be selling online for $70, then $60, etc. A gas station owner is selling out of his product as a guaranteed sale as it is an immediate need. When you're shopping for gas...you can either buy it, or be stranded.

Gas station owners also have almost no competition, even with their competitors. Sure, the store across the street may be a penny less per gallon, but at 20 cents different for a full tank...is that really competition?

All In Cards said:

you could start out small or even try something different.

Talk to the mall management and ask about having a show in the mall. You could promote the show and be in charge of it all. Make a few bucks and then also have a table for wax and singles.

Click to expand...

Great idea.

Plus, doing this would allow you to see first hand if there is any interest locally regarding cards, and you'll see some spending habits.