Carlos Santana - What do you make of his season?

ballerskrip · Aug 29, 2011

I have always been a big fan of Carlos Santana, so I will start by saying that.

His season is a mystery to me. I love his BB, his power, etc. But his Batting Average is leaving a bit to be desired. I continuously hear that he is going to be a monster, I have always loved what I see when I watch him play. I personally think he will be a top 3-4 catcher in the bigs next year.

Anyone have any thoughts on him? Indians fans who see him day to day, what do you think?

The good

BB - 77 - 5th in the AL
OBP - .345 3rd among AL Catchers
HR - 20 - 2nd in the AL among Catchers
RBI - 64 - 4th among AL Catchers
2B - 27 - 2nd among AL Catchers
Runs - 62 - Leads AL Catchers
Slugging / OPS - 3rd Among AL Catchers

The Bad

Batting Average - .245

yrocks2001 · Aug 29, 2011

I think he's got a bright future ahead of him with his power and OBP. His average will rise the more experience he gets.

bdal23 · Aug 29, 2011

He hit .282 in August. He had a brutal April and his average just hasn't recovered. I think he has adjusted and looks to be locked in right now. I believe he will be an elite offensive catcher next year

ballerskrip said:
I have always been a big fan of Carlos Santana, so I will start by saying that.

His season is a mystery to me. I love his BB, his power, etc. But his Batting Average is leaving a bit to be desired. I continuously hear that he is going to be a monster, I have always loved what I see when I watch him play. I personally think he will be a top 3-4 catcher in the bigs next year.

Anyone have any thoughts on him? Indians fans who see him day to day, what do you think?

The good

BB - 77 - 5th in the AL
OBP - .345 3rd among AL Catchers
HR - 20 - 2nd in the AL among Catchers
RBI - 64 - 4th among AL Catchers
2B - 27 - 2nd among AL Catchers
Runs - 62 - Leads AL Catchers
Slugging / OPS - 3rd Among AL Catchers

The Bad

Batting Average - .245

sports-vault · Aug 29, 2011

He will be on my fantasy radar next year! I love him!

thefatguy · Aug 29, 2011

Shaman was a great album, but Black Magic Woman is just so classic, I dont know if anything he does will every top that single.

OscarOne · Aug 29, 2011

The good

BB - 77 - 5th in the AL
OBP - .345 3rd among AL Catchers
HR - 20 - 2nd in the AL among Catchers
RBI - 64 - 4th among AL Catchers
2B - 27 - 2nd among AL Catchers
Runs - 62 - Leads AL Catchers
Slugging / OPS - 3rd Among AL Catchers

The Bad

Batting Average - .245

OK, now look at what you wrote.

You have all those excellent numbers, and you are letting his batting average bring you down? I hate--HATE--when people call batting average an "idiot stat", but there is a reason why. Who cares what his average is as long as he is getting on base and hitting with power? Look at guys like Adam Dunn (post 2011) and Mark Texeria (2011) for all the proof that you need. We have been conditioned to looks at batting average, when it's really OPS, OBP or SLG and a litany of other stats we should be paying attention to.

Does this mean that you should ignore batting average? Well, mostly. OPS and SLG has a better correlation to a teams run rate
than average.

So ignore his stats. Buy his cards. Root for the Indians.

Go Tribe.

longbomberz · Aug 30, 2011

The main changes I see are an increase in strikeouts and a decrease in walks. Flip that around and his OBP is right back in line with his MiL career and his short stint in Cleveland last season pre-injury. Just curious if he will stick at catcher long term or if they will try to move him to 1B.

19braves77 · Aug 30, 2011

Batting average really doesn't tell you the full story. Batting average does not consider walks. It doesn't consider quality at bats. Its almost like comparing a quarterbacks passing rating but not including passes completed to RB's and TE's. The only sport where batting average makes sense is cricket and honestly that is why we have it.

Bornagaincollector · Aug 30, 2011

I think he will see a lot of time at 1st next year.Until Laporta starts hitting they have no other choice.I think he will be a 30 hr 100 rbi man next season.

ballerskrip · Aug 30, 2011

OscarOne said:
The good

BB - 77 - 5th in the AL
OBP - .345 3rd among AL Catchers
HR - 20 - 2nd in the AL among Catchers
RBI - 64 - 4th among AL Catchers
2B - 27 - 2nd among AL Catchers
Runs - 62 - Leads AL Catchers
Slugging / OPS - 3rd Among AL Catchers

The Bad

Batting Average - .245

Click to expand...

OK, now look at what you wrote.

You have all those excellent numbers, and you are letting his batting average bring you down? I hate--HATE--when people call batting average an "idiot stat", but there is a reason why. Who cares what his average is as long as he is getting on base and hitting with power? Look at guys like Adam Dunn (post 2011) and Mark Texeria (2011) for all the proof that you need. We have been conditioned to looks at batting average, when it's really OPS, OBP or SLG and a litany of other stats we should be paying attention to.

Does this mean that you should ignore batting average? Well, mostly. OPS and SLG has a better correlation to a teams run rate
than average.

So ignore his stats. Buy his cards. Root for the Indians.

Go Tribe.

I understand completely and have never put all of my stock in batting average. At the same time, for him to make the next step into stardom or super stardom, he will need to be in the .270+ range. Especially if he wants to get noticed in this hobby.

skrip

phillyfan0417 · Aug 30, 2011

19braves77 said:
Batting average really doesn't tell you the full story. Batting average does not consider walks. It doesn't consider quality at bats. Its almost like comparing a quarterbacks passing rating but not including passes completed to RB's and TE's. The only sport where batting average makes sense is cricket and honestly that is why we have it.

It doesnt tell you the full story but it tells a pretty good one. To discount average would be like discounting ERA, it only makes sense when you need it for your narrative. Sure, its great to walk alot and hit .245 but you'll be a star if you hit .290 and walk alot. That said, I think Santana will be fine and among the best catchers.

jjj7880 · Aug 30, 2011

Bornagaincollector said:
I think he will see a lot of time at 1st next year.Until Laporta starts hitting they have no other choice.I think he will be a 30 hr 100 rbi man next season.

LaPorta is hitting far better than Lou Marson though. Its a downgrade playing Carlos at 1st and Marson catching.

RL24 · Aug 30, 2011

You know when it's in between innings, and you see who the next three batters are? There are only a couple Indians I feel good about seeing on that list, and Carlos is one of them. Fukudome has been awesome, but I really get happy when I see Asdrubal is coming to the plate....

Asdrubal+Cabrera+Seattle+Mariners+v+Cleveland+Jt4dSTakOT0l.jpg

chompsmcgee · Aug 30, 2011

His .271 BABIP suggests a a bit of bad luck helped lower his avg this season.

19braves77 · Aug 30, 2011

Contact Rate is actually pretty good and I doubt any fantasy baseball player has dropped him this year due to his OBP% and extra base hits.

Also, I don't expect many catchers to hit .300.

Bornagaincollector · Aug 30, 2011

jjj7880 said:
Bornagaincollector said:

I think he will see a lot of time at 1st next year.Until Laporta starts hitting they have no other choice.I think he will be a 30 hr 100 rbi man next season.

Click to expand...

LaPorta is hitting far better than Lou Marson though. Its a downgrade playing Carlos at 1st and Marson catching.

Marson is a good defender and has a great arm.Santana is going to get a lot of time at 1st base until Laporta starts hitting,Laporta hasnt made any adjustments.His is a automatic out when it comes to a inside fastball or breaking ball.

I believe the Indians have a better chance of winning with Marson catching and Santana at 1st.

RL24 · Aug 30, 2011

Bornagaincollector said:
jjj7880 said:

Bornagaincollector said:

I think he will see a lot of time at 1st next year.Until Laporta starts hitting they have no other choice.I think he will be a 30 hr 100 rbi man next season.

Click to expand...

LaPorta is hitting far better than Lou Marson though. Its a downgrade playing Carlos at 1st and Marson catching.

Click to expand...

Marson is a good defender and has a great arm.Santana is going to get a lot of time at 1st base until Laporta starts hitting,Laporta hasnt made any adjustments.His is a automatic out when it comes to a inside fastball or breaking ball.

I believe the Indians have a better chance of winning with Marson catching and Santana at 1st.

Plus it's safer having Santana at 1st, better for the future of the franchise. Not everybody slides home with such class and grace as E.Z. Carrera. I was thinking about that last night. You always hear so much about it when a guy plows into the catcher, and that guy has no class. But you never hear about it when a guy chooses to slide around the catcher rather than plow into him. What a great play it was.

Ever since Santana got mowed over last year, it makes me nervous having him back there.

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