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Thread: 1993 Finest Refractor Hoards

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    1993 Finest Refractor Hoards

    I came across these auctions that are actually kind of amazing.

    Lot of 710 #1-50

    Lot of 510 #51-100

    Lot of 800 #101-150

    Lot of 1000 #151-199

    It's a pity that in typical PWCC style they don't list exact details about the composition of these lots, but just based on the pictures there's some serious compulsion happening. And it's tempting to imagine the breakup value. For instance, with Edgar Martinez this><close to HOF election and the 93 Finest Refractor being one of his earlist really nice cards, seeing 10 of them in one listing is serious potential, although that one is already up to $8200. Not to mention 34 Bob Welches. And apparently no Griffeys, Ripkens, Ryans, or Thomases included, but if you're in the market for this you already have those, I'd guess.
    Looking for 2011 Topps Marquee Museum autographs, rare Frank Thomases, and any Grady Sizemores I don't have

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    3,020 refractors, 1:15 packs, 18 packs/box, 12 packs per box = 209 cases worth of refractors. BBCP states 4,000 cases produced. Or 241 copies of 199 subjects. = 5-6% of all refractors for sale in this auction.
    Randy Johnson Collector!! 5,506 Unique Cards & Counting.
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    That is mind blowing. I have a hard time believing that one person collected all of these. It is much easier to believe that someone at Topps has these and was too lazy to sell anything other than the biggest starts. If also makes me question the total number produced.

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    After 25 years, it could be believable that someone squirreled away all those slowly over time. It is also believable that someone backdoored a bunch of stuff too. You never know with the stuff anymore. Card stories seem to get sleazier and sleazier as the years go by.

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    Maybe this guy Phil Gold? Scroll down on page to see his text (3,000+). I remember seeing a spreadsheet from some 93 finest ref super collector years ago that had all of this in there and tracked prices paid. Was crazy comprehensive.

    https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=177686


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    Uhmmmm...holy crapoli
    Tanner Jones, Author of Confessions of a Baseball Card Addict - Now Available on Amazon!
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    I have never believed that only 241 copies exist of each of these refractors. It seems like there are hundreds more just based on ebay listings on a monthly basis.

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    I've heard of people hoarding one card (Andre Dawson supposedly hoarded...Andre Dawson). But 3000 cards with as many as 3 dozen copies of one card is indeed a labor of love. I don't think it's proof of there being more than 241 copies, it's just what happens when people devote decades to collecting something, plus the exposure the web allows.
    Looking for 2011 Topps Marquee Museum autographs, rare Frank Thomases, and any Grady Sizemores I don't have

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    Quote Originally Posted by brian26 View Post
    I have never believed that only 241 copies exist of each of these refractors. It seems like there are hundreds more just based on ebay listings on a monthly basis.
    I've long believed this too. Too many show up for the 241 copies theory. Talked to several 90's insert collectors that feel the same way. Either some got back doored in addition to the ones that were packed out, or the production numbers are off. Of the rare 90's inserts everyone chases, I feel these are the most overvalued.

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    I really want to believe there are just 241, but can see how it could be more than this as well. Between PSA and BGS, there are nearly 300 Frank Thomas refractors that have been graded. Certainly, this is skewed due to re-subbing, plus, I think '93 finest is HIGHLY susceptible to this practice, but to think that the number represents the potential for anywhere near 100% of all copies having been graded is a bit crazy.

    I will follow up by saying this: I do not think they are necessarily overvalued at all - even if the print run is double. Here's why:

    - It is the first baseball refractor set ... and quite possibly the most beautiful.
    - It is a true pre-strike, limited parallel in the junk-era. Consider the Donruss Elite cards. Many of those sell quite well in spite of their monsterous 10,000 print run.
    - The site is notorious for off-centering and refractor lines. It is one thing to find your guy. It is quite another to find a well-centered, refractor line-free example.
    Tanner Jones, Author of Confessions of a Baseball Card Addict - Now Available on Amazon!
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    Quote Originally Posted by mouschi View Post
    Between PSA and BGS, there are nearly 300 Frank Thomas refractors that have been graded. Certainly, this is skewed due to re-subbing, plus, I think '93 finest is HIGHLY susceptible to this practice, but to think that the number represents the potential for anywhere near 100% of all copies having been graded is a bit crazy.

    - The site is notorious for off-centering and refractor lines. It is one thing to find your guy. It is quite another to find a well-centered, refractor line-free example.
    If you're starting a poll, mine has never been graded (although I'm considering submitting it because it's centered better than most PSA 9s I've seen for sale).
    Wanting to buy '96 Select Certified Mirror Gold baseball...commons & stars

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    Quote Originally Posted by Letch77 View Post
    If you're starting a poll, mine has never been graded (although I'm considering submitting it because it's centered better than most PSA 9s I've seen for sale).
    If I had the ability to poll the entire collecting community, there are so, so, SO many I'd like to start. There are just so many different flavors of collectors. On this site, if you were to ask what the best '90s insert/parallel was, folks would say the 97 finest embossed, 98 crusade, 96 mirror gold, etc. On blowout, I conducted a poll already and '93 finest refractors blew the doors off of all the others. Crazy!
    Tanner Jones, Author of Confessions of a Baseball Card Addict - Now Available on Amazon!
    For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Romans 6:23 - Questions about this? PM ME!

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    Absolutely. I have been thinking this too, but with no evidence other than the same thing you mentioned, the endless number of ebay listings. Other cards with vastly higher print runs don't show up nearly as often.

    Every damn one seems to sell at a pretty decent price though. So whatever the number they are a cornerstone card. I remember when they came out and they blew me away. Especially the all stars with that beautiful green color, and that shiny, almost liquid finish.

    Quote Originally Posted by brian26 View Post
    I have never believed that only 241 copies exist of each of these refractors. It seems like there are hundreds more just based on ebay listings on a monthly basis.
    Collecting Roberto Alomar. Over 4000 unique cards, but always looking for those I'm missing!

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    Quote Originally Posted by banjar View Post
    I remember when they came out and they blew me away. Especially the all stars with that beautiful green color, and that shiny, almost liquid finish.
    Indeed...I was so enamored with the All-Star cards - they STILL look better than most of the junk companies put out today. Finest had such a clean, crisp look to it. I remember thinking that the pack design seemed rather plain for being so expensive, but when I opened my first pack and saw the All-Star card sandwiched in between the other cards, I was blown away.
    Wanting to buy '96 Select Certified Mirror Gold baseball...commons & stars

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    Oh yeah. Languid mirror pools of shiny emerald refractor luminescent rainbowiness...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Quote Originally Posted by Letch77 View Post
    Indeed...I was so enamored with the All-Star cards - they STILL look better than most of the junk companies put out today. Finest had such a clean, crisp look to it. I remember thinking that the pack design seemed rather plain for being so expensive, but when I opened my first pack and saw the All-Star card sandwiched in between the other cards, I was blown away.
    Collecting Roberto Alomar. Over 4000 unique cards, but always looking for those I'm missing!

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