Your use of hyperbole makes you come off as foolish. Why don't you quit talking in such absolutes until the season actually starts and to think that 2-3-4 is the best in the NL is laughable. Padre fans are drunk with excitement, literally. Maybe we should just end the season now and give the padres the World Series trophy. San Diego isn't even good yet and their fans are already insufferable.
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Padres & Phillies Discussing Flipping Wil Myers (& More) For Cole Hamels
- Thread starter Jaypers
- Start date
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Your use of hyperbole makes you come off as foolish. Why don't you quit talking in such absolutes until the season actually starts and to think that 2-3-4 is the best in the NL is laughable. Padre fans are drunk with excitement, literally. Maybe we should just end the season now and give the padres the World Series trophy. San Diego isn't even good yet and their fans are already insufferable.
Anyone saying that the Friars need more hitting isn't looking at it through the NL West glasses. They've seen what the Giants have done. Giants have Posey and what else ? Yes, Pence and etc, but ask a casual fan and they'll be able to name the staff and the pen before 4 hitters. Does it make a lot of sense ? Probably not, but, to win the NL West, you need stout pitching and just enough offense, not a glut of offense and once ace (i.e., the Dodgers).
WCTYSON
Well-known member
- Nov 3, 2014
- 7,364
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Fantastic call by you and great move by the Padres if it happens. While the Giants do not have the big name offensive players they were top 10 in weighted run production and in team defense. The Padres too play solid team defense but where dead last of all 30 MLB teams in weighted run creation. They need all the offensive help they can get. Getting Hamels for the top of the rotation is certainly big for them, as they are filled with 3's in their rotation. Giving up Myers and prospects, is worth the risk for Hamels but just to be clear Hamels may only be a 3 and possibly a 4 in the Dodger's rotation behind Ryu. I like the moves for the Padres and am now a believer that they can top the Giants but the Dodgers are out of their league.
maxe0213
New member
What are you talking about? Show me a 2-3-4 that ON PAPER is better in the NL. I've said throughtout this thread (or in the other thread) that ON PAPER the Padres are the 2nd best team in the NL West. Nobody has said they will win the division, Nobody has said they will win a WS. You're response is laughable and moronic.
You don't think SD is good? They have improved their weakness. They already had a solid pitching staff and now got offense. Its clear they are not done as I would expect them to move some of those OF's for bullpen help or a back of the rotation player.
YOU are the one that is foolish if you think the Padres have not improved and are not a good/solid team right now.
WCTYSON
Well-known member
- Nov 3, 2014
- 7,364
- 171
Love me some Tyson, needs to get the walks down though. Not sold on Cashner yet but he has not a 200 inning season, so jury is out still. As they stand now, very good 3's IMO and compared to the Dodgers staff they would be at the bottom end. The talk here is not about the best in the West but they with Hamels could certainly take the second spot. If Upton and Kemp like playing there, they could be an interesting watch for sure.
maxe0213
New member
I think as they are built they are better than the Giants and adding Hamels makes them FOR SURE better than the Giants.
I think Tyson is an ace. Obviously you have two of the top 3-4 pitchers in the bigs in the NL West in Bumgarner and Kershaw but if you look around the rest of the bigs Tyson as an Ace is definitely in the top 10 IMO comparing to the aces of other teams. Cashner needs to put together a full season but he is a very very good #2 if he can give ya 200 innings.
Giving up Myers would be a mistake. You can control him for 4-5 years and he has shown the ability to have lots of pop and some speed and he is cheap.
Myers had 1 good year with 350 ABs and then a crappy year with 350 ABs. He had 6 HR last year and has been traded twice which throws up some red flags. Sure he has potential, but potential means you haven't done much yet.
maxe0213
New member
Myers has been in the league for two years and was injured for the majority of last year. He is a very good player and will be unless he continues to run into injury problems.
Just because he was traded twice doesn't "throw up red flags." Look at why he was traded. The royals needed an Ace and had to move Myers in order to get Shields and Davis. The Rays are having a fire sale so its obvious Myers was going to be moved. Just because someone gets traded numerous times doesn't throw up red flags.
Because heaney was traded twice this OF does that give you red flags? Not in my mind.
u2me57
Well-known member
If I were the Phillies I would keep Hamels, unless the Padres are willing to give up a lot more than Myers. And I'm sure Amaro is asking for a lot more. At least get some pitching prospects back. Trying to imagine the Phillies starting rotation without Hamels is pretty scary. O'Sullivan and Slowey?:-o
If I were the Padres I would want Hamels over Shields, for obvious reasons. Plus Shields threw a lot of innings last year. I would want the Phillies to throw in Revere so he can cover a lot of ground at Petco in center field. Hamels probably wants to go to the Padres as he is from San Diego and the Padres aren't in his no trade clause. I'm still not convinced this deal gets done. Go Phillies!
If I were the Padres I would want Hamels over Shields, for obvious reasons. Plus Shields threw a lot of innings last year. I would want the Phillies to throw in Revere so he can cover a lot of ground at Petco in center field. Hamels probably wants to go to the Padres as he is from San Diego and the Padres aren't in his no trade clause. I'm still not convinced this deal gets done. Go Phillies!
I'm going to start by saying that I think the Padres are much improved and have done a great job turning the team ultra-competitive in just a few months. That said, I think you've gone a bit overboard by claiming they have the best 2-3-4 in the NL. From a prospector's point of view, from sheer upside, I could see an argument, but from stats, I don't see it. Myers has been an average-slightly above average big leaguer this far. Justin Upton only eclipsed 100 RBIs once in his career, and is a more of a star than a "superstar." I think the Padres could be in the mix, but to say they're clearly better than what's going on in LA (Kendrick/Agon/Puig), Washington (Rendon/Werth/Harper), Reds (BPhillips, Votto, Frazier), Miami (Yelich, Giancarlo, Ozuna), etc is more of a debate than a fact.
maxe0213
New member
Okay I see it. The only ones I would say might be better are Miami and LA. Washington has Werth who brings you down and Harper has yet to put together a full season. I think Myers is just as good as Harper. The reds aren't close. Phillips is in rapid decline. Votto was injured and who knows if he will be any good. Frazier is the only good one there.
The only "superstars" that you mentioned are Puig and Giancarlo so not sure where that argument is going. Myers has had one full season. I've seen plenty of his games. He will be good pending his health.
Myers is not better than Harper by any statistic. You are projecting his one good year. Harper has had plenty injury issues of his own, but when he has played he has been consistently better than Myers. I'd take Harper over Myers at this point and it's not really close.
| Stat | Wil Myers | Bryce Harper |
| At Bats | 660 | 1309 |
| Runs | 87 | 210 |
| RBI | 88 | 149 |
| HR | 19 | 55 |
| AVE | 0.258 | 0.272 |
| OBP | 0.324 | 0.351 |
| SLG | 0.401 | 0.465 |
| OPS+ | 105 | 121 |
maxe0213
New member
If you don't think those numbers are close then idk what to tell ya. He's better with those stats yes. I think that this next year will be very similar for the two. But Harper is not someone I would want on my team EVER.
.27 points in OBP and .64 points in SLG are a huge difference.
maxe0213
New member
Harper has double the amount of AB's. I'll look at the stats once there is more than basically one full year of Myers right there. Come back after this year and I almost guarantee they have very similar stats. Myers is a much better clubhouse guy than Harper as well. Harper is a cancer IMO.
Wil Myers is two years older than Harper, yet Harper already has twice as many ABs in the big leagues as Myers. Plus, his rate stats are much better.
You don't make it to the big leagues as a 19 year-old without being a special player and Harper's best seasons should still be ahead of him. It will be extremely surprising if Wil Myers ends up being the better player.
maxe0213
New member
Myers best seasons are still ahead of him as well. Not a good argument.
gt2590
Super Moderator
I think 90% of baseball experts would say that Harper will be the overall better player, especially if you add in defense and overall speed.
But as a Philly area guy, I really hope they're both in the NL East...
But as a Philly area guy, I really hope they're both in the NL East...
u2me57
Well-known member
Anybody hear anymore on the possible Padres/Phillies trade or did it hit a snag?
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