Atlanta Sportscard Shows.......Really Really bad!!!!!

[Kennesawsportscards]

So you take a page out of Evan's book and carry tons and tons of inserts. Problem solved! At least that is what I would do if I still set up. Sunday is my only off day, and I tend to try and enjoy it.

As you know Chris, I have about as much inventory as anyone, including tons of inserts. That wasn't the point. It is about the cheaper buyers and the lack of sales to the general public for BETTER inserts and HIGHER end stuff, including 1/1's, Hall of famer Autographs, etc here in Atlanta...

Since Evan was highly instrumental in helping created the cheap market conditions here with dollar and less inserts ,I think alot of dealers followed suit. I understand there is a market for this and although capitalizing on it is fine: it would be nice to see the higher dollar buyers instead of people commenting on those of us who have this kind of inventory contantly hearing " Great Stuff" and then the buyer moving on to the 50 cent box... Not upset, just perplexed in this area, as I am sure you are as well in comparison to the national shows.

 

[craftysouthpaw]

It is hard to come up for explanations but this city just doesn't typically spend money on sports in comparison to most other mid-to-large sized markets. Don't know if it is due to the large number of transplants, the weather giving people other options, or what but that is the obvious conclusion.

Bob and the other autograph promoters can't afford to bring in high quality autograph guests as there is a good chance he will take a bath. And card dealers have a tough time moving high value stuff. Pricing is just a piece of that puzzle but there is a lot more to it. If there was an easy answer, it would have been solved by now.

And this just starts a vicious cycle that keeps away the better out-of-town dealers and the whole situation just feeds upon itself.

I will say Roger Neufeld has managed to do very well here with his one man shows that he does a few times a year and it is not because of his pricing. He tends to be on the high end as far as prices go but he has managed to build up a loyal group of collectors. My guess is it is because of the quality of his inventory (both selection and condition) and the fact it constantly turns over. Not to mention he is an honest guy that people enjoy spending time with.

Might be something to learn there, might not be. He could just be an anomaly that has kept it up due to his long standing place in the hobby. Tough to start that from the ground up these days.

 

[Kennesawsportscards]

It is hard to come up for explanations but this city just doesn't typically spend money on sports in comparison to most other mid-to-large sized markets. Don't know if it is due to the large number of transplants, the weather giving people other options, or what but that is the obvious conclusion.

Bob and the other autograph promoters can't afford to bring in high quality autograph guests as there is a good chance he will take a bath. And card dealers have a tough time moving high value stuff. Pricing is just a piece of that puzzle but there is a lot more to it. If there was an easy answer, it would have been solved by now.

And this just starts a vicious cycle that keeps away the better out-of-town dealers and the whole situation just feeds upon itself.

I will say Roger Neufeld has managed to do very well here with his one man shows that he does a few times a year and it is not because of his pricing. He tends to be on the high end as far as prices go but he has managed to build up a loyal group of collectors. My guess is it is because of the quality of his inventory (both selection and condition) and the fact it constantly turns over. Not to mention he is an honest guy that people enjoy spending time with.

Might be something to learn there, might not be. He could just be an anomaly that has kept it up due to his long standing place in the hobby. Tough to start that from the ground up these days.

All of your points are right on target here in Atlanta.....Plus, even though Roger Neufeld isn't the cheapest on the planet either, he has a tremendoous amount of vintage, which puts him in select company, in addition to carving his niche for a bazillion years...... He has indicated, ironically that Atlanta is one of his BEST markets...Also, most of his customers here don't frequent the Atlanta shows.

 

[predatorkj]

The last Larry D. show I was at here in Houston, I actually stopped and looked around as I was waiting for an autograph guest to arrive. The main problem I saw after having looked at all the dealer tables was that a good portion of them sold higher end vintage or new cards. And maybe three of four tables sold cheaper inserts and gu/autos and maybe one or two tables sold oddball stuff or just plain junk. The tables with the most people at them and actually making money were the tables with the cheaper cards.

Now, I'm not going to sit here and tell you that is the only thing you should bring. But as a buyer, I'll normally bring $150-$200 to a show at most. So if I'm attending a show, especially a three day show, I'm not going to blow my money all in one spot on one or two cards. Yes I know there are people who will but not me. And I'd hazard a guess a lot of collectors are like that. I'd much rather pick up cool inserts or rookies of good players, and stuff to finish off my sets and then maybe the few random autos or gu patch cards to polish off whats left of my money. So basically any card over $20, I'm not buying. And hell, you might have it lower than ebay. But it's more or a ratio or percentage thing. I'm on a budget when I go. In essence, I'm there to make the best absolute decision with what money I have that I can to help my collection. The fact that most dealers don't even have astros stuff(in Houston) and the ones who do never have anything that isn't run of the mill stuff, really hurts their chances. Now you may say "Well I'm from Chicago or I'm from Atlanta and Bagwell and Biggio don't sell there so I don't have any", but that hurts you, not me. The last time I found a high end Bagwell I didn't have at a show, I purchased it. So I will break my own rules but only if it's exactly what I need and it's not being overpriced.

So I guess my question is, why do dealers show up with a few display cases full of high end cards, most of which have nothing to do with the location they set up in(i.e. bringing New York Yankees to Texas), and then complain that nobody goes over there and drops a few hundred dollars(maybe all of their budget) on one or two cards? I realize they can really make your show and help pay for everything and make you some profit. But if you know that a lot of times, it's not going to happen, why not try a different angle? If I or any other collector collected and paid the types of prices that rare or high end cards commanded, we'd all be broke. Yes there are a handful that do it. But just like with the housing market or any other market, most of your buyers will be in the lower end market. Bring nothing but million dollar mansions to a home buyer, or rare high end stuff to a card collector, and the majority will take a walk.

 

[predatorkj]

I guess the real problem is if you pick up a beckett, or even look online on ebay at what's hot or what everyone's attention is driven to, the prices of all these cards are insane. If an uneducated collector looks at beckett, they'd think you'd have to be a rich man to collect cards. Or, they'd look at all the old sets or cards they had from the 90's and 80's and then they'd see they were now worthless. Then they'd see all the current stuff with all these crazy prices and assume that one day they will be worthless. And hell, they might. The problem became that this hobby isn't about normal cards anybody can pull. It's all about bat barrels and mlb logoman patches and button cards and low numbered patch autos. And different colored bowman parallel rookie autos(half of which nobody but the guy on the card's momma knows about). Can this hobby really sustain millions of cards that are worth $200 or more? Because back in the 80's and 90's, it was possible to pull good cards without breaking the bank. And even if prices swell, so what. Look at McGwire during his peak of hotness or Canseco or Clemens or anyone. Now look at every single set being produced today. Each one is littered with very expensive cards. Even the packs and base sets are hard to obtain in a frugal fashion. And when you do, they are considered worthless which is funny. And parallels out the *****!

This is becoming a rich man's hobby except where are all the rich men? I don't know about all of you but my collection is not boxes and boxes full with several hundred dollar cards. And yet, this is what I will find if I go to shows. It makes me question the reason they are offered in bulk and also if the hobby can sustain bat barrel after bat barrel or Knob after Knob or low numbered patch auto after low numbered patch auto.

 

[brianga26]

I stopped setting up about 2 years ago b/c I kept hearing 1. I can buy that cheaper on ebay.. (I don't sell expensive cards.. mostly bulk prospects or recent Bowman autos) but someone who haggles over $1.00 or $2.00 is not someone I want to deal with.. or 2. the guys that want to buy your entire collection.. "umm thanks, but not thanks.. I collect b/c I enjoy it, and set up at shows for fun really"..

There needs to be new life into these shows. The same people set up at all three of them and there is no young blood. I like the people that set up, let me go ahead and say that, they are nice folks, but a lot of them sell junk. I deal with one or two guys there and then I leave. When I do buy something I use ebay as a barometer. The people that bust out the beckett are the ones I do not work with. Sorry, the prices are not true!
I agree with Jimmy (as much as it pains me to say so) Atlanta sucks for card shows. heck look at the National when it was here. It was dreadful.

 

[jimmyjam1973]

So you take a page out of Evan's book and carry tons and tons of inserts. Problem solved! At least that is what I would do if I still set up. Sunday is my only off day, and I tend to try and enjoy it.

You see what I bring to shows
1. My display case with my better cards.
2. A 3 row box with where I sell $1 each 10 for $12, etc (most cards $3+)
3. Common GU/Auto's for $2.50 each or 3 for $5
4. 5000ct boxes of "commons". And by commons, that's anything that isn't an auto, gu, etc

I don't sell vintage, wax, supplies, and I still can't break $300. I respect the customers that come in and ask how they're doing etc....even when I know they're not going to spend a dime.

 

[cgilmo]

You see what I bring to shows
1. My display case with my better cards.
2. A 3 row box with where I sell $1 each 10 for $12, etc (most cards $3+)
3. Common GU/Auto's for $2.50 each or 3 for $5
4. 5000ct boxes of "commons". And by commons, that's anything that isn't an auto, gu, etc

I don't sell vintage, wax, supplies, and I still can't break $300. I respect the customers that come in and ask how they're doing etc....even when I know they're not going to spend a dime.

I'm not questioning your demeanor. You are a nice guy. I just haven't seen your set up in a while because I haven't been to the shows.

 

[jimmyjam1973]

I know Chris, that was referencing on the other couple of post where they say the dealers are rude/unknowlegable, etc and way overpriced.

 

[bcubs]

I stopped setting up about 2 years ago b/c I kept hearing 1. I can buy that cheaper on ebay.. (I don't sell expensive cards.. mostly bulk prospects or recent Bowman autos) but someone who haggles over $1.00 or $2.00 is not someone I want to deal with.. or 2. the guys that want to buy your entire collection.. "umm thanks, but not thanks.. I collect b/c I enjoy it, and set up at shows for fun really"..

There needs to be new life into these shows. The same people set up at all three of them and there is no young blood. I like the people that set up, let me go ahead and say that, they are nice folks, but a lot of them sell junk. I deal with one or two guys there and then I leave. When I do buy something I use ebay as a barometer. The people that bust out the beckett are the ones I do not work with. Sorry, the prices are not true!
I agree with Jimmy (as much as it pains me to say so) Atlanta sucks for card shows. heck look at the National when it was here. It was dreadful.

We have the same problem in Central IL with our shows, many people coming in, asking for a price, then looking it up on Ebay with their phones and offering what the last one sold for. When I set up at the shows was I a little higher than Ebay? Yes, maybe a $5 Ebay card I ask $7 at the show. Why? Because I had to pack everything up, load, unload, pay $50 for a table, and do the pack load thing all again at the end of the day, plus I put a significant value on my time. Is that the buyers problem and should it mean they have to pay more? Absolutely not if they don't want to, but if they wanted my card on that day they would. Not many of them did, so I didn't sell much and eventually quit. I just sell now on Ebay where I don't have the overhead and time investment so I don't mind taking a lower price per card. The market evolved dramatically with the proliferation of Ebay and essentially killed all but the smallest percentage of card shows as we once knew them.

 

[brianga26]

I agree with Jimmy. When people are nice at the shows.. its almost shocking..

 

[BenG76]

Some great posts and points in this thread. Here are some things that help me want to buy from a dealer in no particular order
Clean neat looking table/setup. Random stuff piled up usually makes me walk away.
Boxes have prices on them. I like rummaging through $1-$5 or less boxes.
Organization. Star players should be organized together. Vintage cards for sets should be organized by year.
Dealer is friendly and polite. Also don't talk down to me or be a D bag.

I know it takes time to organize cards but that really helps people like me at least attempt to buy something. When I was collecting Griffey Jr. a bit I asked one dealer if he had any and he said yeah they are some in them boxes. He had maybe 10 monster boxes. I looked for a second or two and walked away. Later I asked another dealer. He was like yea they are all right here in this box. Needless to say I bought several cards from him. He also checked several other boxes to make sure I didn't miss any plus he asked his partner if they had any in his boxes.

Another example is when I was putting together all of Griffey Jr. Rookies graded in PSA 10. I was at a show and the seller had a nice looking 89 Bowman in a 10 and I still needed it. He was very friendly and helpful and answered my questions. He was a bit higher than EBay on his price but I bought from him anyway due to the card being nice as well as him treating me courteously.

 

[nappyd]

This is definitely an issue here in Atlanta as well. Too many dealers that rely almost solely on Beckett Hi values to price their cards. Not sure if they wonder why they have had the same inventory for the past several years because of this, but they should. So the combination of bad pricing and no inventory turnover makes it pointless to go to the shows for anything other than wax or supplies.

Atlanta also has the concurrent issue that the collectibles market is thin to begin with and a good chunk of it just doesn't spend like a lot of other markets.

Um...at first I thought this was covering all collectibles and not just sports. Even then it's a decent market for sports stuff just based off the volume of people, but with so many people moving here from other places they report to eBay and Amazon for what they're looking for.

Also not to mention the people selling "hot packs" I tend to shy away from those


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[jimmyjam1973]

Um...at first I thought this was covering all collectibles and not just sports. Even then it's a decent market for sports stuff just based off the volume of people, but with so many people moving here from other places they report to eBay and Amazon for what they're looking for.

Also not to mention the people selling "hot packs" I tend to shy away from those


Sent from my SCH-I535 using Freedom Card Board mobile app

What's wrong with "hot packs"...don't want to spend $20 to guarantee you a $2 worthless GU?