Unbelieveable Redemption Replacement from Topps!

[predatorkj]

And as far as your point about it being a simple hobby and all...Unique, you have to understand that people who only collect also value...well...value. If someone collects a certain player and they normally spend pretty good money on his stuff because it commands it, they either want what they are paying for or if they can't get it, they want something they can trade or flip of equal money so they can turn it into something for their hobby. It's not always about people trying to make it a business. Say it was you wanting this Hendrix card and you win it on eBay for $100 and you're accustomed to paying high dollar for his stuff. Now you redeem the card, it never gets made, and you get a $10 replacement. So in essence, you've lost $90 of money that was intended to go towards your Hendrix collection. Purely as a hobby collector, you just got kicked in the junk. And it's worth being upset about.

As for the quote in your sig, someone else already mentioned it but it more than likely applies to topps not making any claims to whether or not their cards are worth anything on the secondary market. Because the market may not reflect that in many areas and now all of a sudden people get mad because the cards they purchased under the pretenses they were worth something are actually worth less or nothing at all. Really it's dumb topps would even have to put that on their products as a disclaimer but in today's sue happy society, it's not surprising. But trying to apply it to the value of a redemption card makes no sense. If the card is made, it'll hold whatever value the market demands. The redemption card/code is merely an IOU or a ticket for the prize. You can deny the card has been made but the redemptions, or ticket or IOU if you will, is worth(or should be worth) what the physical card is. Topps doesn't get to decide what the card is really worth. The secondary market does. Now if they want to value it at their cost to make, cool. Just be consistent. And they are not. And they are a business. Is it wrong for us to expect them to act like a business? You take any hobby in the world, or any product, the people using said products may not be sellers or business men. It may just be a casual hobby for them. But the customers will always expect a businesslike and professional behavior from a business. You can't just act like "oh, they make baseball cards so to expect them to behave like a real business is asking too much.". Because it's not.

 

[rsmath]

Now topps can basically just make cards for a set and what doesn't go out in boxes, may never be made. Whereas before, they had to have something laying around to send you. Might not be any more of that.

yep, I think the future of redemption replacements is custom replacement cards that won't be priced in Beckett.

My reasoning.... can you imagine if someone pulled a 2013 Triple Turds Matt Harvey relic/auto redemption and topps later replaced it with a 2013 bowman Bryce Harper auto? You'd have people - both those who busted 2013 bowman and those that didn't but are passionate about the hobby - wondering WTF was that card not packed out yet saved for redemption replacements? Topps has to create customs from now on so that people aren't outraged some marquee cards weren't packed out.

 

[predatorkj]

Well, eBay sales have kind of screwed this up. Normally, you buy a box, you are guaranteed an auto. Say your one auto is a redemption, you try to redeem it, the card never gets made and they send you a random replacement. Now if it was a redemption for a very valuable card and you get crap in return, you'll be upset but it's a lot easier to swallow because whatever they end up sending you fulfills their obligation to you. They provided an auto. You had just as good of a chance to pull that auto as you did the redemption. So theoretically, you're close to square.

But where it gets bad is when somebody who never busted a pack at all ends up going on eBay and buying the redemption for the actual card because they want that actual card. Now, if it doesn't get made, there is an issue because this guy purchased the redemption for that card. And he purchased it at market value. So if it doesn't get made and he gets a random auto, it's even worse than the guy who got his box worth of contents by buying a box and getting the amount of specified cards and inserts.

 

[Juan Gris]

Well, eBay sales have kind of screwed this up. Normally, you buy a box, you are guaranteed an auto. Say your one auto is a redemption, you try to redeem it, the card never gets made and they send you a random replacement. Now if it was a redemption for a very valuable card and you get crap in return, you'll be upset but it's a lot easier to swallow because whatever they end up sending you fulfills their obligation to you. They provided an auto. You had just as good of a chance to pull that auto as you did the redemption. So theoretically, you're close to square.

But where it gets bad is when somebody who never busted a pack at all ends up going on eBay and buying the redemption for the actual card because they want that actual card. Now, if it doesn't get made, there is an issue because this guy purchased the redemption for that card. And he purchased it at market value. So if it doesn't get made and he gets a random auto, it's even worse than the guy who got his box worth of contents by buying a box and getting the amount of specified cards and inserts.

Is it? The person that originally buys the box of cards and pulls a redemption shouldn't be left with Schrödinger's cat in the box disguised as the code under the scratch-off area. There is a deeper problem than whether the original buyers should keep or sell redemptions and whether the after market collectors should buy redemptions. When Topps started placing dead cats in boxes that promised live cats they lost their credibility and place in the hobby. Everyone loses when Topps doesn't play by the rules.

 

[predatorkj]

Is it? The person that originally buys the box of cards and pulls a redemption shouldn't be left with Schrödinger's cat in the box disguised as the code under the scratch-off area. There is a deeper problem than whether the original buyers should keep or sell redemptions and whether the after market collectors should buy redemptions. When Topps started placing dead cats in boxes that promised live cats they lost their credibility and place in the hobby. Everyone loses when Topps doesn't play by the rules.

That was kind of my point. The redemption process needs to end completely. I know people say its necessary but it's not. You should, as a company, constantly be getting stickers in from players. Keep an inventory and use it to decide what can and can't be made. When certain players' stuff gets depleted, get more and have them in hand before you add them into a new product. In the example of the Hendrix or something similar that topps probably doesn't use that often, that's even better because you can get things like that, they won't be dated, and you make a plan for a set, secure all that you can for the set, and then release the info for the set and begin production. Set a deadline for when you need the items by and if the items aren't secured by then, they don't go on the checklist and the hobby is none the wiser there was even plans for the card. This would be hard for on card autos because they can date themselves either by a current player being on a team they have been traded from by the time the card makes it out, or by having 201x topps ( insert product name here) already printed on the card. But hell, everything is sticker these days anyways. And IMO, stickers can either really screw up s card or make it look nice. But they actually are more of a necessity than redemptions and I have no problem with them being around. My question is exactly why both stickers and redemptions need to coexist. They don't.

So all that said, when the redemption stuff became more about companies trying to hype a product by including anything they thought might make it sell better whether they had it in hand or not, that's when the can of worms opened. It has led to items that are probably very hard if not impossible to secure on time, to be commonly included. And that's not smart when you're writing checks your rear end can't cash. Worse yet, it's forced them into a corner where a lot of times they have to replace it. And so, they end up sending things out people may not like. And they'll never admit it but a business isn't going to lose money to keep a customer happy. That's all businesses. They may try to make a customer happy. But at the end of the day, if it comes down to it, they'd rather have some upset customers that'll probably continue to buy anyways than lose money for their business.