A Football eBay Question.

[pigskincardboard]

I sold about 130 cards in one night and just shot photos of 'em individually. I wrote that I don't accept returns because many of the cards would increase in value solely because of combined shipping. Thus, if I accepted a return after the previous packages had been sent out, the card would immediately decrease in price because I'd have to charge full shipping to resell it.

Someone got a card and it had a crease in it. The crease is visible in the picture but the gentleman still wants a refund.

When it comes to condition of cards, I almost never describe their condition because of liability issues. I always offer to take close up pictures and scans of areas to anyone that wants 'em. On this lot of 130 cards, I took about 40 additional pictures and scans for anyone that asked.

Because I'm such a dandy guy, i charged this guy (and many others) 4 bucks to ship a package that costs me about 7.50 to ship. It was essentially a free upgrade from ground shipping that takes 30 days to airmail that takes about 7 (i'm international, remember). I've basically already spent an additional 3 bucks on this package.

So, on a six dollar card, do I refund this guy his money? He's got great feedback but this is upsetting.

I'm also worried about not receiving this card when he sends it back. If he says he sends it back, and I don't receive it, he's going to leave negative feedback anyways.

I just don't understand why someone would see a white line across a card and not either a) assume that it's a crease or b) ask for a closer shot. If I said this card had a minor crease and this guy said it had a major crease, we'd still be in this situation. If I said small surface imperfections and this guy thought it was a huge problem, we'd be in the same spot.

I know exactly what happened and it's exactly what I wanted to happen: people just dumped bids on additional items because they all ended within seconds of each other. They didn't read the description or actually look at the large photo. Unfortunately, a few of the items got higher than they ever should've because of this but I don't think that's my responsibility.

 

[CollectorsCorner]

I think on a creased card you should say in the auction that there is a crease in the card

 

[pigskincardboard]

I think on a creased card you should say in the auction that there is a crease in the card

Does the photo not do that though?

This is what I don't understand about eBay: In every other legal contract, you screw yourself by providing any subjective knowledge without proper expertise and you screw yourself more by providing it with proper expertise. You just shouldn't do it for various reasons that I don't care to get into. You open yourself to more legal liability by writing small surface crease than you do by not writing anything at all.

I just find it absolutely ridiculous that someone doesn't have time to look at the photograph but would have time to read the description.

I have a feeling that if this is the common feeling on eBay, I'm going to be in serious trouble.

 

[Watt]

Is the crease very easy to see in the picture? If not I understand why he'd be upset.

 

[pigskincardboard]

Is the crease very easy to see in the picture? If not I understand why he'd be upset.

Well, it's not a huge crease if I remember correctly. Just minor surface wrinkle. The photo was a pretty good representation of exactly what I was selling.

 

[JimmyD]

well , if there is an upside, it is only 6$.. not the end of the world if you have to cut your losses. I know creases are deal breakers for me on newer cards.
I cant say i would be willing to spend 4$ to send back a 6$ card. I am betting he wants you to say "keep the card" so he has his money and the card.

You gotta figure out if the head ache is worth the 6$ to you. It has already cost you time via emails to and from him, stress wondering what to do, and time reading and writing this thread, all for For 6$

 

[Card Magnet]

My opinion is to just refund to avoid a negative. Should he not return the card and open a dispute, you should be fine since he will have no proof of the card being sent to you since it's international. If he then negs you, you should be able to make a quick call to ebay and get that taken care of since ebay would have ruled in your favor.

Even if the photo shows a crease in the card, always state it in your auction just to be safe.

 

[RavensFan]

This is why I choose not to sell anything less than NM-MT on eBay. If i see anything more then light wear on the edges I usually do not post it up. The only time those would go up is on Vintage cards. I dont feel like dealing with all the hassle that you are going through.

 

[mstng99tim]

Selling a card over the internet without briefly describing the condition isn't fair to the buyer. If the condition isn't noted, I'm going to assume it's NM/MT. I put this in all of my card auctions, "All cards are NM/MT unless otherwise noted". So if a card is damaged, I briefly describe the damage so the buyer is aware.

If you go to a car dealership to buy a new car, you expect there to be an engine under the hood. If there wasn't, you would expect them to let you know. I think that same logic applies to what you did.

 

[KandKCards]

Selling a card over the internet without briefly describing the condition isn't fair to the buyer. If the condition isn't noted, I'm going to assume it's NM/MT. I put this in all of my card auctions, "All cards are NM/MT unless otherwise noted". So if a card is damaged, I briefly describe the damage so the buyer is aware.

If you go to a car dealership to buy a new car, you expect there to be an engine under the hood. If there wasn't, you would expect them to let you know. I think that same logic applies to what you did.

I say the same thing, and when someone asks about condition, I just tell them all cards are sold as NM-MT. Too many people out there only want gem mint. Either way, is there a link to the auction in question? Hard to give a fair judgment without seeing the listing.

 

[pigskincardboard]

Selling a card over the internet without briefly describing the condition isn't fair to the buyer. If the condition isn't noted, I'm going to assume it's NM/MT. I put this in all of my card auctions, "All cards are NM/MT unless otherwise noted". So if a card is damaged, I briefly describe the damage so the buyer is aware.

If you go to a car dealership to buy a new car, you expect there to be an engine under the hood. If there wasn't, you would expect them to let you know. I think that same logic applies to what you did.

That's the conundrum, though. If you buy a car in a personal purchase, it's your duty to lift up the hood. If you end up purchasing a car that doesn't have an engine, that is your problem.

Now, if you a buy a car without seeing the inside and the seller describes the interior as lightly worn and you interpret the damage as heavily worn, that's when the seller is responsible. If the seller doesn't say anything about the interior, there's no liability. If the seller says something that can be misinterpreted, then the seller is at fault.

If you buy a car, the seller has no duty to divulge that 90% of the car is made of bondo -- this is why carfacts and all those companies exist.

You should never assume a card is NM/MT unless otherwise stipulated. This is just the legality of the situation. In contracts, you are to assume nothing. The only thing a seller cannot do is knowingly lie.

Anyways, that wasn't really my point. My point was that if a picture has a shot of the crease, why would someone ever claim that the card wasn't adequately described? It takes three seconds to ask for a different photo and if you don't get one, you just don't bid.

 

[deceptikon1978]

I never say NM/MT or anything, just too many nitpicky bastards. I usually say 'see scan for condition' or something along those lines. I might note a major flaw but as long as any flaws can be seen clearly in the scan, it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[pigskincardboard]

Selling a card over the internet without briefly describing the condition isn't fair to the buyer. If the condition isn't noted, I'm going to assume it's NM/MT. I put this in all of my card auctions, "All cards are NM/MT unless otherwise noted". So if a card is damaged, I briefly describe the damage so the buyer is aware.

If you go to a car dealership to buy a new car, you expect there to be an engine under the hood. If there wasn't, you would expect them to let you know. I think that same logic applies to what you did.

I say the same thing, and when someone asks about condition, I just tell them all cards are sold as NM-MT. Too many people out there only want gem mint. Either way, is there a link to the auction in question? Hard to give a fair judgment without seeing the listing.

Sure. It's a hairline crease that looks to the eye exactly how it looks in the photo.

I've told him I'd issue a refund.

 

[rymflaherty]

I'm with you on the see the scan ask questions thing......though since people don't always do that, if there is a noticeable flaw it is usually best to acknowledge it.

If you didn't make any "mint" claims or use the "Like New" condition option (don't know why people use that for cards - just asking for item not as described if anything is wrong) you may be able to win the claim.
The was Ebay is, not sure it'd be guaranteed.....and the only thing guaranteed is a hassle either way - so I'd probably just consider a refund if it was $6 and you sold another 100+ cards without incident.

As a seller - I think I'd be able to live with that, yes maybe they should have took more time to check out the pics, but you do know their not scamming or making things up about the condition.

 

[pigskincardboard]

I'm with you on the see the scan ask questions thing......though since people don't always do that, if there is a noticeable flaw it is usually best to acknowledge it.

If you didn't make any "mint" claims or use the "Like New" condition option (don't know why people use that for cards - just asking for item not as described if anything is wrong) you may be able to win the claim.
The was Ebay is, not sure it'd be guaranteed.....and the only thing guaranteed is a hassle either way - so I'd probably just consider a refund if it was $6 and you sold another 100+ cards without incident.

As a seller - I think I'd be able to live with that, yes maybe they should have took more time to check out the pics, but you do know their not scamming or making things up about the condition.

I don't know. If you don't click the picture to enlarge it, the scan looks fine. Even then, we're dealing with a rather tiny crease. The guy has great feedback and stuff, so I don't think he's actively trying to screw me.

I know for a fact that I'll receive this card in much different fashion than when I sent it out, though. I'm pretty sure that the *little* crease is now a full out crease.

What I'm mainly pissed off about is that I am pretty sure that I included extra cards and gave him a free 3 dollar upgrade on shipping.

That's what pisses me off more than anything. I can't remember who got what, but he probably got about ten bucks worth of '50s and '60s cards as a bonus.

 

[seahawks4ever]

that sucks man but you did the right thing. I hear y'all about nitpicky people. I had a 2007 Longevity Matt Schaub Emerald card #d/49 up with a 0.49 starting bid. Buyer asks if the card is perfect. I humor him and look it over and I can't see anything so I tell him I'm not a grader and I didn't look at it with any kind of magnification, but to my eye, it looked great.

He asked me if I could look at it under magnification...for a 0.49 card.

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

 

[deceptikon1978]

that sucks man but you did the right thing. I hear y'all about nitpicky people. I had a 2007 Longevity Matt Schaub Emerald card #d/49 up with a 0.49 starting bid. Buyer asks if the card is perfect. I humor him and look it over and I can't see anything so I tell him I'm not a grader and I didn't look at it with any kind of magnification, but to my eye, it looked great.

He asked me if I could look at it under magnification...for a 0.49 card.

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

:lol: That's when you reply: "I looked at it under magnification and it was FLAWLESS!!! Then I ripped it in half. Thanks for the interest."

If it wasn't for the people, ebay would be a great place.

 

[pigskincardboard]

that sucks man but you did the right thing. I hear y'all about nitpicky people. I had a 2007 Longevity Matt Schaub Emerald card #d/49 up with a 0.49 starting bid. Buyer asks if the card is perfect. I humor him and look it over and I can't see anything so I tell him I'm not a grader and I didn't look at it with any kind of magnification, but to my eye, it looked great.

He asked me if I could look at it under magnification...for a 0.49 card.

:twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

:lol: That's when you reply: "I looked at it under magnification and it was FLAWLESS!!! Then I ripped it in half. Thanks for the interest."

If it wasn't for the people, ebay would be a great place.

See, this was the response that I gave absolutely everyone:

Q: Hi, Are there any stains, wrinkles, creases, writing, or scratches on the card. Are the corners and edges sharp or is there some wear? What condion would you estimate the card to be in? Thanks. Robert Aug-22-10

A: Hey, the card looks sharp to me. I don't estimate condition though because it only leads to problems. Some people have very jaded ideas of what a PSA9 or a BVG7 is. I will happily take the time to scan this card and email you, but you'll have to message me your email address ( i won't post it, don't worry). I hope you understand but I don't want someone asking for a $50 rebate because the card graded PSA7 instead of PSA8 or something. Thanks for your interest!

 

[Viking4Alpha]

I don't see what would be so hard about mentioning the defect in the description.

Would have saved everyone the headache. Yeah the picture is there, but you might as well double tap in the description just to cover yourself.

 

[pigskincardboard]

I don't see what would be so hard about mentioning the defect in the description.

Would have saved everyone the headache. Yeah the picture is there, but you might as well double tap in the description just to cover yourself.

Oh, It was because I listed 150 items at once and they all used around the the same description. It's the same reason that I took photos rather than individually scanning them. It was obviously partially laziness in that I didn't look through every card and describe every minor defect.

Also, legally anyways, it's more of a problem to say "minor crease" than it is to say nothing.