Adrian headed to the Red Sox!

[scotty21690]

This is a good fit for Boston. He has a great glove, and they won't ask him to carry the team. The Green monster will help his #s also.

My thoughts exactly....I don't think the Red Sox were going to end up going after Gonzalez, so the next step that would make sense would be signing Beltre.

If we hadn't signed Beltre then Youk would have played 3rd with Lowell backing him up with Kotchman at first with noone backing him up. Now we have improved defense and a lot of depth all around the field.

 

[baseballguy350]

baseballguy350, don't even try it.....it's SO pointless arguing with the retard about baseball, as it appears as *it* has never watched a baseball game before or even know how the sport works.

It doesn't help that *it* can't get the Yankee bias out of it's brain before posting.... :benson:

Leave her alone. She lives in Vermont. Needs to take a break from milking the cows, to actually learn the sport.

 

[jeremy]

you tards will argue over anything

 

[andyduke86]

Haven't read the thread but this is a very good signing for the Sox. He'll provide more total value than any of the other options at third simply because of his stellar defense. He's one of the best defenders at any position in the game. Playing in Boston won't hurt his bat either.

Cameron in center, Ellsbury in a corner and Beltre at third is a pretty slick fielding trio. That'll be much more valuable than wasting the money on Jason Bay.

Looks like the good teams are starting to realize the value of defense

 

[vwnut13]

Cameron in center, Ellsbury in a corner and Beltre at third is a pretty slick fielding trio. That'll be much more valuable than wasting the money on Jason Bay.

Looks like the good teams are starting to realize the value of defense

Be prepared to be attacked. Ellsbury is the greatest centerfielder ever.

 

[andyduke86]

Cameron in center, Ellsbury in a corner and Beltre at third is a pretty slick fielding trio. That'll be much more valuable than wasting the money on Jason Bay.

Looks like the good teams are starting to realize the value of defense

Be prepared to be attacked. Ellsbury is the greatest centerfielder ever.

LOL, ok.

I hope you're not being serious.

 

[baseballguy350]

Haven't read the thread but this is a very good signing for the Sox. He'll provide more total value than any of the other options at third simply because of his stellar defense. He's one of the best defenders at any position in the game. Playing in Boston won't hurt his bat either.

Cameron in center, Ellsbury in a corner and Beltre at third is a pretty slick fielding trio. That'll be much more valuable than wasting the money on Jason Bay.

Looks like the good teams are starting to realize the value of defense

Absolutely. Putting him in LF hides Ellsbury's arm, and helps with the wear and tear of stealing bases. Obivously, until I see otherwise, Ellsbury will be penciled in at CF, but there is a lot of speculation, that I absolutely agree with, that puts Cameron in CF, and Ellsbury in LF.

I'm also not real sure why everyone is so low on Cameron's ability. The fangraphs link that compares Cameron and Bay is an eye opener.

Baseball comes down to run differential, and the retards don't realize that a run prevented is worth statistically more valuable then a run created. In Layman's terms, which team would hypothetically win all of it's games... A team that scores 10 runs a game, or a team that gives up 0 runs a game?

 

[andyduke86]

Haven't read the thread but this is a very good signing for the Sox. He'll provide more total value than any of the other options at third simply because of his stellar defense. He's one of the best defenders at any position in the game. Playing in Boston won't hurt his bat either.

Cameron in center, Ellsbury in a corner and Beltre at third is a pretty slick fielding trio. That'll be much more valuable than wasting the money on Jason Bay.

Looks like the good teams are starting to realize the value of defense

Absolutely. Putting him in LF hides Ellsbury's arm, and helps with the wear and tear of stealing bases. Obivously, until I see otherwise, Ellsbury will be penciled in at CF, but there is a lot of speculation, that I absolutely agree with, that puts Cameron in CF, and Ellsbury in LF.

I'm also not real sure why everyone is so low on Cameron's ability. The fangraphs link that compares Cameron and Bay is an eye opener.

Baseball comes down to run differential, and the retards don't realize that a run prevented is worth statistically more valuable then a run created. In Layman's terms, which team would hypothetically win all of it's games... A team that scores 10 runs a game, or a team that gives up 0 runs a game?

No doubt. Playing Ellsbury in a corner will make him much better since he gets such terrible reads on the ball in Center. However Derek Jeter syndrome makes people think he's great in Center. For those who don't know Jeter Syndrome is when a player either makes a routine play look extremely difficult or uses another tool (arm or speed) to cover up for poor range or poor reads off the bat, leading to a highlight reel catch, which is Ellsbury's problem in center. A player making a great catch because of a poor read is not a good defensive play. He's pretty bad in center but he obviously has the tools to be better in a corner.

 

[MallCopKJ]

Defense is being WAY overvalued in this thread. Anyone want to tell me who ranked #1 in team defense in the Majors last year?




........

The PITTSBURGH PIRATES!!

I'll take the 50 homerun, 120 RBI guys over the gold glove players everytime. The reason the Sox have been bumped out of the postseason the past 2 years was because their bats went absolutely DEAD. No one at all was hitting the ball. How about the Tampa Bay playoff series in 2008? The Rays won because Pena and Longoria blasted the ball all series. The Sox couldnt even get anyone on base and their bullpen had to carry them through that series. Im as big a fan as anyone but this is going to be a weak, weak lineup. If Beltre is going to be here for 2 years they had better make a run at JoeMauer and at least get a high average hitter in this lineup or theres going to be some long, ugly seasons coming up.

 

[vwnut13]

Defense is being WAY overvalued in this thread. Anyone want to tell me who ranked #1 in team defense in the Majors last year?

........

The PITTSBURGH PIRATES!!

I'll take the 50 homerun, 120 RBI guys over the gold glove players everytime. The reason the Sox have been bumped out of the postseason the past 2 years was because their bats went absolutely DEAD. No one at all was hitting the ball. How about the Tampa Bay playoff series in 2008? The Rays won because Pena and Longoria blasted the ball all series. The Sox couldnt even get anyone on base and their bullpen had to carry them through that series. Im as big a fan as anyone but this is going to be a weak, weak lineup. If Beltre is going to be here for 2 years they had better make a run at JoeMauer and at least get a high average hitter in this lineup or theres going to be some long, ugly seasons coming up.

At least there's one Sox fan that sees a not so good offense good defense won't win.

After all, in order to win you need to score runs don't you?

The saying goes, "Pitching and Defense wins Chamionships"
It should be...

"Pitching and Defense wins Chamionships, but only if you have the bats to get you there"

 

[pac213up]

Defense is being WAY overvalued in this thread. Anyone want to tell me who ranked #1 in team defense in the Majors last year?




........

The PITTSBURGH PIRATES!!

I'll take the 50 homerun, 120 RBI guys over the gold glove players everytime. The reason the Sox have been bumped out of the postseason the past 2 years was because their bats went absolutely DEAD. No one at all was hitting the ball. How about the Tampa Bay playoff series in 2008? The Rays won because Pena and Longoria blasted the ball all series. The Sox couldnt even get anyone on base and their bullpen had to carry them through that series. Im as big a fan as anyone but this is going to be a weak, weak lineup. If Beltre is going to be here for 2 years they had better make a run at JoeMauer and at least get a high average hitter in this lineup or theres going to be some long, ugly seasons coming up.

Probably has something to do with the fact that the Pirates also ranked LAST in runs scored. Considering the Red Sox ranked 3rd last year with a partial season of Martinez, and given the loss of Bay and the upgrades at short & catcher they should still score plenty of runs. The Texas Rangers scored the most runs in 2008....how did that work out? Fact is you need a balance of both, neither will provide success independent of the other.

 

[bodiaz]

I agree. The reason the Sox have not won the last couple of years is the loss of Manny, and the decline of Papi. I think if they made an offer to get Cabrera from Detroit he could really replace the missing Manny #s, and help Ortiz also. I hear all the rumors about Adrian Gonzalez, but IMO Cabrera is a better fit for that ballpark. This is the trade I have wishing would happen:

Detroit trades Cabrera to Boston.

Boston trades Cotchman, Buckholz, and other prospects to Padres.

Padres trade Adrian Gonzalez and Heath Bell to Detroit.


I don't see any downside for any of the teams in that deal.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

I agree. The reason the Sox have not won the last couple of years is the loss of Manny, and the decline of Papi. I think if they made an offer to get Cabrera from Detroit he could really replace the missing Manny #s, and help Ortiz also. I hear all the rumors about Adrian Gonzalez, but IMO Cabrera is a better fit for that ballpark. This is the trade I have wishing would happen:

Detroit trades Cabrera to Boston.

Boston trades Cotchman, Buckholz, and other prospects to Padres.

Padres trade Adrian Gonzalez and Heath Bell to Detroit.


I don't see any downside for any of the teams in that deal.

If the Sox are trading the prospects needed to get either Cabrera or Gonzalez, they are getting Gonzalez in the deal. No way they prefer Cabrera.

 

[bodiaz]

Cabrera is a better fit for Fenway. He hits for a much better average, and he is the closest thing to Manny in his prime than any other hitter in the league. On most teams Adrian may be a great fit, but in Boston Cabrera is a better fit.

 

[pac213up]

I agree. The reason the Sox have not won the last couple of years is the loss of Manny, and the decline of Papi. I think if they made an offer to get Cabrera from Detroit he could really replace the missing Manny #s, and help Ortiz also. I hear all the rumors about Adrian Gonzalez, but IMO Cabrera is a better fit for that ballpark. This is the trade I have wishing would happen:

That would make sense except for the fact that their offense produced more runs last year than it did in 2007. The difference being in '07 the gave up the least amount of runs in baseball and in '09 they were not even in the top 10. I would agree that a hitter of Manny's ability does provide stability and consistency which seemed to be lacking last year. However even with that consistency I doubt they would beat a team if they give up 5+ runs game as they did against the Angels.

Obviously this is not the last move. Theo will head into the season and see how things shake out. This team is easily good enough to make the Playoffs as it is now. If they need to add a bat to get them over the hump they will. Beltre being on a 1 yr contract will not hinder the Red Sox from going out and getting a AGon or Cabrera if they are available and are needed.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

Cabrera is a better fit for Fenway. He hits for a much better average, and he is the closest thing to Manny in his prime than any other hitter in the league. On most teams Adrian may be a great fit, but in Boston Cabrera is a better fit.

Maybe, but Cabrera also comes with a hefty contract, questions about weight, questions about defense, and questions about commitment with off the field issues. Gonzalez doesn't have those extra problems, and I believe his road numbers are second only to Pujols over the last couple years. Gonzalez is a much better hitter than his stats show with half his games played in a pitchers park.

 

[baseballguy350]

By virtue of the inclusion of the player option, the Red Sox' luxury tax hit will be diminished. Rather than being calculated as a $9 million salary for the purposes of the collective bargaining tax in 2010, Beltre's deal will be interpreted as being worth $7 million against the $170 million threshold for the 2010 season.

http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston ... th-beltre/



As far as Gonzalez vs. Cabrera, Gonzalez has a MUCH friendlier contract, and there were only two players with a career road OPS higher then Gonzalez... Pujols, and Howard. As I've stated in this thread a couple of times, I'm a believer in defensive abilities, and Gonzalez certainly brings that as well.

 

[baseballguy350]

"Pitching and Defense wins Chamionships, but only if you have the bats to get you there"

To be completely honest with you, I'm sick and tired of you posting worthless crap in every discussion about the Red Sox and the Yankees. You post with the intention to stir the pot, and you don't add anything of substance.

In 2009, the Red Sox scored 872 runs. In 2009, the Red Sox allowed 736 runs. Run differential of +136.
In 2010, the Red Sox will post a run differential greater then +136. I am very confident with a full season improvement at C, SS, and a likely improvement at DH. As I said before, 3B production will likely be a wash, and I'm on board with the Fangraphs article I told you to read comparing Cameron to Bay.

You are blinded by Red Sox hatred, and your Yankee bias, so let's up the stakes, and put your money where your mouth is.

vwnut13 - You don't like the moves the Red Sox have made, and you think they will be worse off because of it. Here's your chance to prove you are more than just a homer. My $400, to your $150, the Red Sox in 2010 will post a greater run differential, then they did in 2009. Simple. Put your money where your mouth is, or shut your mouth.

 

[011873]

"Pitching and Defense wins Chamionships, but only if you have the bats to get you there"

vwnut13 - You don't like the moves the Red Sox have made, and you think they will be worse off because of it. Here's your chance to prove you are more than just a homer. My $400, to your $150, the Red Sox in 2010 will post a greater run differential, then they did in 2009. Simple. Put your money where your mouth is, or shut your mouth.

Hey guys, can we get in on this?

 

[bodiaz]

I am not taking away from Adrian Gonzalez, he is a great player. I am just saying Miggy is a consistant .325 hitter with great power, and it would be even better in Boston! Adrian plays in a park similar to Comerica. Both are tough to hit Home Runs in, but bothe are condusive to high batting averages with the large power alleys. Gonzo is not as good a hitter as Cabrera. Gonzo is slighlty better in the field, but it is 1B.