BA TOP 10- INDIANS From print

[jpruitt2]

Having Howard at #2 is a joke, he will never pan out. He doesn't have the work ethic and doesnt like to compete.

How do you know this?

I've watched him the last few years as well as coached most of his high school teammates in legion ball.

 

[Wes]

Ubaldo's numbers are skewed, you're comparing NL to AL and it really doesn't work.

Let's look at his AL stats, shall we? When he had to face 9 hitters in one lineup he had a 5.1 ERA. And since you don't like ERA, and you prefer WAR... an astounding -0.4!

Also, he has logged 1,032.1 innings of high altitude pitching.



I think Ubaldo is winding down a decent career and Masterson is just getting his started.... I watched him blank the Yankees this year for 8 innings, 3 hits. I was impressed with the kid. Then 3 days later he pitched the 9th and allowed 0 hits. What a guy!


If I was building a team and had my choice between the two... Masterson > Ubaldo

If I wanted to argue about who has more/better stats to this point, I'd hand it you, Ubaldo is better. Maybe I was confused about the Masterson > Ubaldo equation.


Don't get me wrong, I like Ubaldo (although he does collapse ala A.J. Burnett sometimes) and I think Ubaldo might be able to be a true Ace in the AL. Do I really see that happening though? Sadly, no. These are the Indians we are talking about.

Ubaldo is 27 and Masterson 26. A little odd that you think one is winding down a decent career and the other is just getting started. Your anecdotal evidence actually weakens your argument as nobody would take a one or two game sample size as valuable. 11 starts aren't close to enough to judge his prognosis going forward.

 

[19braves77]

I imagine his zips are going to be close to 10-10 3.65 ERA 190K/84BB 201IP

Not bad but nothing to get excited about.....

 

[RL24]

Ubaldo is 27 and Masterson 26. A little odd that you think one is winding down a decent career and the other is just getting started. Your anecdotal evidence actually weakens your argument as nobody would take a one or two game sample size as valuable. 11 starts aren't close to enough to judge his prognosis going forward.

I know the sample size isn't big enough to judge him by, but as a tribe fan... it was big enough to scare me. They gave up kind of a lot for him.



Nobody gives any credence to the fact that pitching at high altitude tears a pitcher up after a certain amount of years? That's what really has me scared about Ubaldo, more than his less than stellar performance as the Indians "Ace"...

 

[Wes]

Ubaldo is 27 and Masterson 26. A little odd that you think one is winding down a decent career and the other is just getting started. Your anecdotal evidence actually weakens your argument as nobody would take a one or two game sample size as valuable. 11 starts aren't close to enough to judge his prognosis going forward.

I know the sample size isn't big enough to judge him by, but as a tribe fan... it was big enough to scare me. They gave up kind of a lot for him.



Nobody gives any credence to the fact that pitching at high altitude tears a pitcher up after a certain amount of years? That's what really has me scared about Ubaldo, more than his less than stellar performance as the Indians "Ace"...

Neither of these guys is an ace. I'd say the effect of being away from Coors will equalize any "tearing up" of a pitcher that has taken place.

 

[Flyer28]

Carlos Carrasco will be the Indians "Ace"

 

[OhioBobcat3]

Carlos Carrasco will be the Indians "Ace"

We'll see. Between Carlos, Ubaldo, and Fausto the Indians have three headcases to straighten out. All I ever hear is how good Carrasco's stuff is, but the fact of the matter is that he has not been able to use it effectively on a consistent basis. If he doesn't figure out how to command his stuff long-term, it doesn't matter how good it is. Not to mention that he's recovering from major elbow surgery and will miss all of 2012.

I don't see Fausto Carmona ever getting his act together, and Ubaldo reminded me A LOT of Fausto more often than not in his stead with the Tribe last year. Masterson pitched much better than any of them, and although he isn't the true definition of an ace (at least right now), I'd put my money on him to have the best season out of all Tribe starters in 2012. I don't trust any of the other three, and wouldn't be surprised if both Carmona and Jiminez finished with W/L records near .500 next season -- and not because of the Tribe's offense either.

 

[sheetskout]

We'll see. Between Carlos, Ubaldo, and Fausto the Indians have three headcases to straighten out. All I ever hear is how good Carrasco's stuff is, but the fact of the matter is that he has not been able to use it effectively on a consistent basis. If he doesn't figure out how to command his stuff long-term, it doesn't matter how good it is. Not to mention that he's recovering from major elbow surgery and will miss all of 2012.

I see Carrasco as a prime candidate to return from Tommy John with actually better stuff. It's his head that's always been the issue. Realistically, I see Carrasco as a high-end number two in his peak years.

 

[Wes]

We'll see. Between Carlos, Ubaldo, and Fausto the Indians have three headcases to straighten out. All I ever hear is how good Carrasco's stuff is, but the fact of the matter is that he has not been able to use it effectively on a consistent basis. If he doesn't figure out how to command his stuff long-term, it doesn't matter how good it is. Not to mention that he's recovering from major elbow surgery and will miss all of 2012.

I see Carrasco as a prime candidate to return from Tommy John with actually better stuff. It's his head that's always been the issue. Realistically, I see Carrasco as a high-end number two in his peak years.

Weird I always thought TJ replaced elbow ligaments and not brains.