Buying question...ethics involved.

[Bob Loblaw]

I have my own opinion on this, and I'll share it later.

I recently purchased a raw card. It was in a toploader, no mention was made about what grade / condition it was. When I received it, it was in a hermetically sealed penny sleeve. There is no doubt it was graded by BGS and cracked out.

Is there anything ethically wrong with cracking a card and selling it raw, leaving it in the sealed penny sleeve?

Again, I have my own opinion, but I'm curious as to what the hobby thinks.

 

[aarne13]

If seller doesn't mention grade I see no problem with transaction.

 

[bcubs]

If there is no mention of a grade and it is being sold as raw, then I see no issue.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

I don't see how this card is different than any other card, graded or not.

 

[Juan Gris]

So long as you don't advertise it as being in a condition better than it had been graded before you crack it free, no.

 

[Dmscards]

Im curious as to your opinion. Are you against it?

 

[Pine Tar]

I actually have a bag sealer at my house and have sealed penny sleeves with it before. But it was for my use only though.

 

[metallicalex777]

I don't think there is anything ethically wrong in the seller selling it after cracking and keeping it in the sleeve. I think as a buyer, if your intent is to buy raw and grade, it would be up to you to ask questions around condition prior to purchasing if nothing specific was in the listing details. Did the listing picture show the card in the sealed penny sleeve? Previously graded or not, I think it is okay for the seller to do so if he is selling it ungraded and you as a buyer purchasing it as a raw card. Although...if the definition of raw is a card that has not yet been graded, did the title of the listing state it was raw? And if so, did the scans provided show that it was in a sealed penny sleeve? Lastly, were there any questions/communication between the buyer and the seller around the condition of the card? I can see this both ways, but I also think something around this/ethics is circumstantial.

Please note, this is coming from a collector that doesn't purchase to grade

 

[matfanofold]

Obviously if no mention of grade was made, and it is indeed the same card shown in the listing then there should be zero problem. However, I just know some anal buyers will look at this as a negative because it would suggest grading out a gem would be unlikely. But more to the point of ethics, would it be unethical? Hardly...

 

[KLARNOLD]

You have the right to remain silent...

Personally, I would not do that. I would lay everything out on the table.

 

[notjomommasclint]

Yes I take issue with it.

It was broken out of the slab and not mentioned for a reason. Profit.. Doing something to maximize the dollar isn't really top shelf behavior.

 

[Mighty Bombjack]

You say you are certain it was cracked out of slab. Are you certain it was the seller who did the cracking?

 

[BowmanChromeAddict]

I'll say it like this: I don't think it's an ethical business practice to regularly buy low grade cards, bust them out and relist as raw to sell at a profit.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I'll go ahead and post my opinion and see if others agree. When purchasing a grade, it's a subjective guess as to the condition of the card and is 1-2 people's guess. Whether it's truly right or not is only an opinion. Removing the card from the holder is simply removing that opinion, and I don't see a problem with selling the card raw not disclosing the former grade (although I know now not to send it to BGS).

Even though I have no problem with it, I still feel "dirty" as though I received someone else's leftovers. Would have felt a lot better had they replaced the penny sleeve.

 

[bmc398]

I'll go ahead and post my opinion and see if others agree. When purchasing a grade, it's a subjective guess as to the condition of the card and is 1-2 people's guess. Whether it's truly right or not is only an opinion. Removing the card from the holder is simply removing that opinion, and I don't see a problem with selling the card raw not disclosing the former grade (although I know now not to send it to BGS).

Even though I have no problem with it, I still feel "dirty" as though I received someone else's leftovers. Would have felt a lot better had they replaced the penny sleeve.

I also thought about this since I sold you a card recently and was like....was the toploader sealed?

But, a lot of people buy a card, never take it out of the topload and file it away to resell. I did this with the card I sent you. I also made no guarantee as to condition or grade. No reason to lash out at the person you bought it from because they might not have been the person to grade it.

 

[metallicalex777]

I'll go ahead and post my opinion and see if others agree. When purchasing a grade, it's a subjective guess as to the condition of the card and is 1-2 people's guess. Whether it's truly right or not is only an opinion. Removing the card from the holder is simply removing that opinion, and I don't see a problem with selling the card raw not disclosing the former grade (although I know now not to send it to BGS).

Even though I have no problem with it, I still feel "dirty" as though I received someone else's leftovers. Would have felt a lot better had they replaced the penny sleeve.

This makes me think about something else about the penny sleeve. What if a seller somehow was able to seal off a penny sleeve to make it look as if it was cracked from a slab, and advertised that it was cracked from a grade. For example, seller seals a base auto in a penny sleeve, advertises it is from a BGS 9 or 9.5 with 10 auto, even puts a picture of said BGS slabbed card...but since it is a base auto there is no way to confirm as there is no serial numbering on the actual card.

 

[vwnut13]

So when is somebody going to create a penny sleeve sealer for collectors?

Would be a pretty easy way to "waterproof" a card.

 

[bmc398]

So when is somebody going to create a penny sleeve sealer for collectors?

Would be a pretty easy way to "waterproof" a card.

I dont have steady enough hands for this. NOt a lot of room at the top of the sleeve for the seal.

 

[DAVEPETERS239]

I was wondering about this myself because I have two BGS 8.5 cards that I think should have graded higher. I was considering cracking them from their cases and trying to find the right person to maybe resubmit for me.

I thought about maybe cracking them open and trying to sell them raw but it seems kinda dishonest in a way knowing they graded only an 8.5.

But on the other hand I feel they should have graded higher, but I am not an expert on grading, so I don't know.