HOF '18 Results (43%)

[forgerelli]

Why not? The hall of fame has a character clause. It absolutely should keep him off ballots.

The character clause is a joke. If they keep people out of the hall because of off the field stuff or personality traits there are many, many people already in that would need to be removed to have any kind of moral standard. Going by the standards of 2018 Babe Ruth would not be considered a very good person.

Scott F

 

[tidel144]

I believe the character clause was written to further allow for the subjective opinion of voters

 

[zyceoa]

Maybe I'm missing something, but how is a guy with a 216-146 record and 3.46 ERA a shoe in HOFer? I guess that makes Kevin Brown a HOFer too. Too bad he didn't last a single year on the ballot.

 

[Therion]

Maybe I'm missing something, but how is a guy with a 216-146 record and 3.46 ERA a shoe in HOFer? I guess that makes Kevin Brown a HOFer too. Too bad he didn't last a single year on the ballot.

No maybe about it.

 

[jbone17]

Schilling is a Hall of Famer. The guy's postseason dominance and overall dominance speaks for itself. The writers love to invoke the "Character Clause" to keep those out who don't mirror their perfect view of the world. In that case, we might as well keep Roberto Alomar out for spitting on an umpire. Mickey Mantle was a womanizer and drank too much, as was others. Schilling isn't liked because he's a boisterous Conservative and plans to run as a State Senator in Liberal Massachusetts. What else is new...

 

[zyceoa]

Like I said, he's a mere 216-146 pitcher with a 3.46 ERA and ERA+ of 127. Kevin Brown went 211-144 with a 3.28 ERA and ERA+ of 127. And I'll throw in mystery player X from the past 20 years with a 222-133 record and 3.49 ERA and ERA+ of 120. I really don't get the fascination with Schilling outside of the Ks and postseason success against the Yankees. Might as well let every pitcher with 250+ wins in as well. Oh, and how many CYs did Schilling win?

 

[death2redemptions]

Maybe I'm missing something, but how is a guy with a 216-146 record and 3.46 ERA a shoe in HOFer? I guess that makes Kevin Brown a HOFer too. Too bad he didn't last a single year on the ballot.

3,000+ strikeouts.

Every other pitcher (who hasn't been suspended for steroids) who has reached that total is in the HOF. It's a tougher accomplishment than 3,000 hits.

Top that off with the fact he accumulated an 80+ career WAR, a career 3.23 FIP & a 2.0 BB/9 rate.

 

[death2redemptions]

Like I said, he's a mere 216-146 pitcher with a 3.46 ERA and ERA+ of 127. Kevin Brown went 211-144 with a 3.28 ERA and ERA+ of 127. And I'll throw in mystery player X from the past 20 years with a 222-133 record and 3.49 ERA and ERA+ of 120. I really don't get the fascination with Schilling outside of the Ks and postseason success against the Yankees. Might as well let every pitcher with 250+ wins in as well. Oh, and how many CYs did Schilling win?

That's like saying, "I don't understand the fascination of "insert player here" other than the 500 home runs he hit or 3,000 hits he had"

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Curt Schilling being a conservative is far different than Curt Schilling being a pandering kook.

He is both, however it's the "kook" aspect that makes him a reluctant choice.

Everything said...he's a Hall of Famer, for sure, but he's most certainly going to wait a couple of years because of his outspoken stances and "kook-abilities."

 

[jbone17]

Like I said, he's a mere 216-146 pitcher with a 3.46 ERA and ERA+ of 127. Kevin Brown went 211-144 with a 3.28 ERA and ERA+ of 127. And I'll throw in mystery player X from the past 20 years with a 222-133 record and 3.49 ERA and ERA+ of 120. I really don't get the fascination with Schilling outside of the Ks and postseason success against the Yankees. Might as well let every pitcher with 250+ wins in as well. Oh, and how many CYs did Schilling win?

Schilling had 3,000 K's in 20 seasons and pitched to an 11-2 record in the postseason with a 2.23 ERA. He finished with three top three finishes in the CY voting.

Brown finished with 2,397 K's in 19 seasons and pitched to a 5-5 record in the postseason with a 4.19 ERA. He finished with two top three finishes in the Cy voting.

It's very easy to see that Schilling was by far the more dominant pitcher.

 

[alexs64]

Why not? The hall of fame has a character clause. It absolutely should keep him off ballots.

I guess it is a good thing Gracie got in before the DUI huh?

 

[gracecollector]

I guess it is a good thing Gracie got in before the DUI huh?

Gracie isn't in the HOF, nor should he be.

 

[DeliciousBacon]

Schilling is a Hall of Famer. The guy's postseason dominance and overall dominance speaks for itself. The writers love to invoke the "Character Clause" to keep those out who don't mirror their perfect view of the world. In that case, we might as well keep Roberto Alomar out for spitting on an umpire. Mickey Mantle was a womanizer and drank too much, as was others. Schilling isn't liked because he's a boisterous Conservative and plans to run as a State Senator in Liberal Massachusetts. What else is new...

Schilling isn't liked because he's a racist piece of ****. That's not a liberal vs. conservative issue, that's an issue of just being a bad person. I'd say the HOF character clause can be invoked for racism, and this is coming from a guy who WAS one of the biggest Schilling fans and collectors around.

 

[jbone17]

Schilling isn't liked because he's a racist piece of ****. That's not a liberal vs. conservative issue, that's an issue of just being a bad person. I'd say the HOF character clause can be invoked for racism, and this is coming from a guy who WAS one of the biggest Schilling fans and collectors around.

Yes, Schilling's character is certainly called into question. Not disagreeing there. I just don't buy into the logic that keeps him out. It's called the Baseball Hall of Fame, not the Character Hall of Fame. Certainly character is weighed when it comes to voting, but the Hall of Fame has a bunch of womanizers, blatant cheaters and racists, etc. We need to look at the totality of circumstances and performance must be at the forefront. Going by the numbers and competitive pedigree, Schilling is a slam dunk HOF'er and that's where the door gets closed as far as I'm concerned. I don't care if the man shouts racist sentiments from a rooftop. That's his business.

 

[JVHaste]

[MENTION=12878]death2redemptions[/MENTION]

thanks for updating...

I don't think you'll see me watch a Sex and the City marathon anytime soon, that show really spooked me out as a kid. :lol: Ugly old ladies with witch faces talking about nasty subjects is no fun I swear when SJP says something repulsive they zoom in on her nose.


iirc the reason I put a 6% in with the 5% category is to show the likely potential that they end up there, as the final ballots are always the protest guys who refuse to vote for anyone from the whole era that PEDs happen and leave a ballot blank.

 

[forgerelli]

I wasn't even aware of Schilling being a racist, just one more character flaw on the pile for him and don't forget he swindled millions from the state of Rhode Island). Still doesn't mean he's not a hall of famer. There are dozens of racists already in, several of whom are suspected of being members of the ***.

Scott F

 

[WillBBC]

I'll post the updated vote totals so that you don't have to put your Sex In The City binge watch on pause.

45.8% of known ballots cast

Likely 1st ballots

Chipper Jones 98.5%
Vlad Guerrero 94.8%
Jim Thome 93.3%

Would make it in if votes were final right now

Edgar Martinez 80.9%
Trevor Hoffman 77.8%

Living on the edge

Mike Mussina 73.2%
Curt Shilling 65.5%
Barry Bonds 64.9%
Roger Clemens 64.9%

Drop outs

Johnny Damon 1.5%
Johan Santana 1.5%

I removed Andruw Jones from the drop outs list because he's actually still on pace to survive. Currently at 6.2% with 12 votes from the first 194 ballots cast. Needs 10 more votes from the (estimated) 232 ballots remaining to be cast. In all likelihood Schilling, Bonds & Clemens won't make it, as they all need over 190 votes to reach the 75% mark.

Vlad's a 2nd ballot guy, just missed last year. I was totally bummed. Can't wait for the reveal tomorrow!

*missed your first, my bad!

 

[Mozzie22]

Schilling isn't liked because he's a racist piece of ****. That's not a liberal vs. conservative issue, that's an issue of just being a bad person. I'd say the HOF character clause can be invoked for racism, and this is coming from a guy who WAS one of the biggest Schilling fans and collectors around.

And Schilling is a racist how? Being a Conservative does not make you a racist despite what the liberal media may tell you.

Sent from my [device_name] using Freedom Card Board mobile app

 

[alexs64]

Gracie isn't in the HOF, nor should he be.

Well there goes that. My bad.

 

[Austin]

Vlad's a 2nd ballot guy, just missed last year. I was totally bummed.

It's ridiculous that last year many voters didn't think he was worthy but now suddenly 95% of them do.
Voters who hold back votes because they don't think a player is a "first ballot guy" should have their voting credentials revoked.