If Albert Pujols

[Utleyfan1]

No of course I'm for Howard , however between Hanley and Prince I'd have to go with Hanley. Of course Prince has him beat in RBI's but Hanley has him in Stolen Bases. They are both stats that you'd expect them to beat each other in. Also Hanley's fielding percentage is .984 which at SS is very respectable and he's cut his errors in half. Also Hanley's put him team in an outside chance at the playoffs coming into the end of the season while Prince had Braun in the lineup as well and they couldn't guide the Brewers into second. Both Hanley and Prince are excelling at their jobs in the lineup but I see Hanley as being a more "valuable" player to his team then Prince.

Funny note-Both Prince and Howard have more triples than Hanley does.

 

[mikieward10]

Hanley or Kemp

The sad thing is all these guys have put up MVP type numbers and its not even close. Albert is AMAZING!!!!

 

[Daltonb1219]

No of course I'm for Howard , however between Hanley and Prince I'd have to go with Hanley. Of course Prince has him beat in RBI's but Hanley has him in Stolen Bases. They are both stats that you'd expect them to beat each other in. Also Hanley's fielding percentage is .984 which at SS is very respectable and he's cut his errors in half. Also Hanley's put him team in an outside chance at the playoffs coming into the end of the season while Prince had Braun in the lineup as well and they couldn't guide the Brewers into second. Both Hanley and Prince are excelling at their jobs in the lineup but I see Hanley as being a more "valuable" player to his team then Prince.

Funny note-Both Prince and Howard have more triples than Hanley does.

Funny note part 2- Hanley has more stolen bases in one season then Prince an Ryan have in a career

 

[Jeff D]

No way Fielder deserves it over Han-Ram.

I respect other's opinions (and mine is obviously biased)...but NO WAY?
Here's ONE way...Fielder has over 25% more RBI's than Hanley.
He has as many RBI's as Pujols and obviously on a team that's not nearly as productive.

To say there's no reason for Prince to get the vote is a gross exaggeration. And FYI Fielder has fewer errors and a better fielding percentage than Ramirez. Different positions, but FIelder has played in 150 games this year and has a .995 fielding percentage. Which incidentally, is better than Pujols.

obviously we're both biased, but how much weight can that fielding percentage really have in comparing the two? Let's put it this way:

Hanley: .984/9 E - *6 other players with equal or better fielding percentage at that position with a high of .989
Prince: .995/7 E - *12 other players with equal or better fielding percentage at that position with a high of 1.000 and .998

Not sure what stats you're looking at, but there are only 3 players with a better fielding % than Prince with more than 90 games at 1B. There are 4 players at SS with a better percentage than Hanley with more than 90 games.

So at best they're pretty comparable at their respective positions.

 

[sheetskout]

Stolen bases is really being brought up as an large argument for? Are you kidding me?

It's not like Hanley is swiping 100 bags.....let's get real here.

 

[Greg Cleveland]

Everyone is talking about the amazing season Mauer is having in the AL. Let's compare:

Mauer .373/28 HR/88 RBI/88 R/4 SB
Hanley .352/23 HR/100 RBI/95 R/26 SB

Twins - 77 Wins
Marlins - 81 Wins

Those two don't seem to far off, yet Hanley isn't getting anywhere near the talk that Mauer is getting. Obviously Pujols gets it in the NL, but I think Hanley should be #2.

And just to compare to prince, Hanley is hitting .055 better, has 17 less HR, but only 28 less RBI, with 1 more R, and 24 more SB. Also the Brewers only have 74 team wins as well compared to the Marlins 81. One more thing to think about is that both Mauer and Prince have another great player on their team (Morneau and Braun).

Okay, but Mauer missed the entire month of April, and his numbers are that good. He'd likely already have 30/100/100 runs, so there'd be no contest in the AL. That's why you can't compare across the Leagues. Ramirez has great numbers, but they aren't neccesarily comparable to Mauer's, IMO. (that's the discrepancy between the AL and NL.) As far as #2 behind Pujols, it's a push. Both teams will miss the playoffs, both teams need their guy to put up the numbers, and they've done it.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_ ... order/true[/url]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/order/true

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

Everyone is talking about the amazing season Mauer is having in the AL. Let's compare:

Mauer .373/28 HR/88 RBI/88 R/4 SB
Hanley .352/23 HR/100 RBI/95 R/26 SB

Twins - 77 Wins
Marlins - 81 Wins

Those two don't seem to far off, yet Hanley isn't getting anywhere near the talk that Mauer is getting. Obviously Pujols gets it in the NL, but I think Hanley should be #2.

And just to compare to prince, Hanley is hitting .055 better, has 17 less HR, but only 28 less RBI, with 1 more R, and 24 more SB. Also the Brewers only have 74 team wins as well compared to the Marlins 81. One more thing to think about is that both Mauer and Prince have another great player on their team (Morneau and Braun).

Okay, but Mauer missed the entire month of April, and his numbers are that good. He'd likely already have 30/100/100 runs, so there'd be no contest in the AL. That's why you can't compare across the Leagues. Ramirez has great numbers, but they aren't neccesarily comparable to Mauer's, IMO. (that's the discrepancy between the AL and NL.) As far as #2 behind Pujols, it's a push. Both teams will miss the playoffs, both teams need their guy to put up the numbers, and they've done it.

Very valid point, and also Mauer gets more days off since he plays a tougher position. I'm not questioning what he's done because he's been amazing. I'm just saying the end of year numbers for Hanley and Mauer aren't that far off assuming both their batting averages remain similar.

 

[Jeff D]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_ ... order/true

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/order/true

So we're combining NL and AL then? I thought MVP was determined by league.
And some people ahead of Fielder on that list have like half the innings as Fielder.

If we want to start looking at MLB stats, how about the fact that Fielder has more RBI's than anyone in all of MLB?
Is that ONE reason to vote for him?

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_ ... order/true

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/fielding/_/order/true

So we're combining NL and AL then? I thought MVP was determined by league.
And some people ahead of Fielder on that list have like half the innings as Fielder.

If we want to start looking at MLB stats, how about the fact that Fielder has more RBI's than anyone in all of MLB?
Is that ONE reason to vote for him?

I guess you can break it up and use the numbers you looked at, and I wasn't purposely including or excluding numbers. My point is that there really isn't any difference in fielding between the two. Prince is among the top at his position and Hanley is among the top at his, while you could argue that SS is a harder position because the highest fielding percentage is .989 versus the 1.000 and .998 at the top for 1B. Just saying fielding percentage shouldn't be in the discussion

I agree that the voters would go for prince because of HR and RBI. I think Hanley has more value for his team, and hence gets my non existent, biased, vote.

 

[markakis8]

You guys keep throwing out the stolen bases notion for Hanley and against Prince...but the fact is...stolen bases don't guarantee runs. And it really isn't that big of a factor when the person in discussion only has less than 30...

Fact is: RBI's = runs. Runs = wins. And Prince has many RBI's.

Hanley is having a monster season but he's #3 in the MVP voting for me...

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

You guys keep throwing out the stolen bases notion for Hanley and against Prince...but the fact is...stolen bases don't guarantee runs. And it really isn't that big of a factor when the person in discussion only has less than 30...

Fact is: RBI's = runs. Runs = wins. And Prince has many RBI's.

Hanley is having a monster season but he's #3 in the MVP voting for me...

Must be true because the Marlins have more wins and Hanley has more runs

 

[Jeff D]

Prince is among the top at his position and Hanley is among the top at his

This was sort of my point to, so we pretty much agree.

I took exception to the point that someone made that Hanley was a better all around player. I was only using Prince's defensive stats to show that he plays his position well, and even arguably better than the obvious MVP choice.

 

[dooly]

Hanley over Fielder if we are saying who should win and not who will win (voters like HR's and RBI's, both poor stats)

I looked at a few different stats:
1) OBP - Ramirez (.416 - 3rd), Fielder (.410 - 5th) - pretty similar numbers, basically a tie
2) Slugging - Ramirez (.556- 8th), Fielder (.589 - 2nd) - advantage fielder, but 1B is a power position so we'll look at positional value below
3) VORP (Value over replacement player - offensive stat considering position) - Ramirez (81.4 - 2nd), Fielder (62 - 4th) - Hanley by a long shot
4) UZR/150 (ultimate zone rating - defensive stat) - Ramirez (1.2 - slightly above avg), Fielder (-0.3 - right about avg, slightly below)
5) WAR (wins above replacement player - offense and defense) - Ramirez (7.5 - 3rd), Fielder (5.8 - 5th) - advantage hanley

From these, it shows me that they are both about average fielders, hanley being a bit better than fielder. By pure offensive numbers, fielder is better. However, due to the position Hanley plays, he is considerably more valuable as the level of offensive play by SS's are considerable lower on avg than of a 1B. Same reason why Mauer is such a beast at C.

 

[cubfan131]

Instead of RBIs I like to look at OBI% which is the % of guys on base a player drives in. Just looking at RBIs can be skewed by a guy being in a great offense or hitting leadoff instead of 3rd. Hanley is 5th at 19.3% and Fielder is 8th with 19%. For the record McCutchen leads at 20.7%.

 

[Jeff D]

You guys keep throwing out the stolen bases notion for Hanley and against Prince...but the fact is...stolen bases don't guarantee runs. And it really isn't that big of a factor when the person in discussion only has less than 30...

Fact is: RBI's = runs. Runs = wins. And Prince has many RBI's.

Hanley is having a monster season but he's #3 in the MVP voting for me...

Must be true because the Marlins have more wins

Well if you'll notice, the Brewers pitchers have allowed 197 home runs to the Marlins 147. Might have something to do with the loss column.

 

[darocker80]

crap i voted for braun but i mean to click hanley ::facepalm::

 

[Daltonb1219]

crap i voted for braun but i mean to click hanley ::facepalm::

:lol:

 

[darocker80]

crap i voted for braun but i mean to click hanley ::facepalm::

:lol:

that one vote is mine haha

 

[nborton]

Instead of RBIs I like to look at OBI% which is the % of guys on base a player drives in. Just looking at RBIs can be skewed by a guy being in a great offense or hitting leadoff instead of 3rd. Hanley is 5th at 19.3% and Fielder is 8th with 19%. For the record McCutchen leads at 20.7%.

I've always found that to be an interesting stat. No other sport is so stat heavy. You can almost come up with a tracked stat for anything baseball. :lol: Probably the reason it's my favorite sport.