LeBron James signing with Miami = lack of confidence

[miguelcabrera]

I think that Lebron handled the situation wrong and shouldn't have announced it on tv.
I also think that it was a poor decision to go to Miami simply because he is going to Wade's team. I think it hurts his brand and puts even more pressure on him to win; even if he does win the glory will a lot less than if he were to win elsewhere.

Make no mistake, it is NOT Wade's team anymore. When the 2 time MVP comes to your team, it becomes his team. Wade is Scottie Pippen now.

Regardless if Lebron is a better player, it's hard to say that it will automatically be his team. Wade has won without Lebron. In a way it is like A-Rod coming to Yankees; no matter how good he plays you can't call the Yankees his team.

and this is why baseball is better than basketball

 

[trademhigh]

At least, he will most likely always have one less championship than Dwayne Wade.

I think that he signed with desire to win, not lack of confidence. He named himself King James after all. While he probably isn't nearly as confident as he was in High School, I think he is still a fairly confident person.

 

[bballcardkid]

[quote="sportscardtheory":6xx0h52d][quote="bodiaz":6xx0h52d]Lebron over kobe imo. Kobe does not get his rings unless he is traded to the lakers. Had he stayed where HR was drafted, he would have bolted after 3 years. Lebron took that garbage team as far as it was going.

And what team has Kobe played for other than the Lakers?

he was drafted by the hornets, and as much as i hate to say it yes kobe would have been in the same boat as lebron if he wasnt traded

I know his situation. My point was that he was traded on Draft Day, so you can't hold that against him. You can say the same about ANY all-time great. "What ifs" are a dime a dozen.

you didnt answer my question above.....jordan played with top 50 pippen and all time great defensive/rebound guy in rodman...name one guy that lebron played with even half the caliber of those two guys? your trying to tell me that jordan with his crazy will to win wouldnt have left town if CHI didnt bring those guys in?

Brought those players in? Scottie Pippen played his first 11 seasons with the Bulls. Are you telling me he was a top-50 player before he stepped foot on an NBA court? And players like Rodman WANTED to play with Jordan. Where were all these Rodman-type players clamoring to play with LeBron in Cleveland? Clearly you aren't understanding my point that Jordan elevated his teammates. Scottie Pippen most likely would not be a top-50 player had he not been alongside the best ever for so many years. Jordan elevated his teammates and made them look better than they were, LeBron has yet to show he can will his team to a Championship like Jordan and/or possibly Kobe.

If there was an NBA "Best Supporting Player Award", players like Pippen and Rodman would have the record for number of awards won.

LeBron James can't touch Kobe or MJ because he lacks their mental edge. He lacks their confidence. He lacks the ability to elevate his team to elite. I'm sure he will win one or more Championships with Miami, but it will be at the expense of his integrity.[/quote:6xx0h52d]

God damn, if one more person talks about Pippen not being a top 50 player without Jordan I'm going to go crazy. Saying things like that make your opinions on any NBA topics meaningless.

Let me summarize you're point:
"I hate Lebron. I would have complained if he stayed in Cleveland because it was all about the money. I would have complained if he went to Chicago because he was trying too hard to be Jordan. I would have complained if he sacrificed money to play with other superstars because it's the easy way out."[/quote:6xx0h52d]

im a big kobe fan but the ripping on lebron is ridiculous, jordan played with top 50 all time player in scottie pippen and one of the top defenders/rebounders in the game in rodman....only difference is the bulls brought them players to him unlike the cavaliers. Name a player that lebron has played with that was even half the player of pippen or rodman? The cavs did nothing to get better, they actually got worst since last year, so why wouldnt he leave?

People give Scottie Pippen WAY too much credit. Just look at what he did, well what he didn't do, after Jordan retired. He went to a NBA All Time Top 50 Dream Team in Houston where they couldn't make it out of the west. Remember that team? Hakeem Olajuwan, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen? His scoring average dropped nearly 5 points per game to 14.5. Honestly, I think the only reason why Pippen is a top 50 guy is because he has 6 rings to his name and had respectable stats during those years, all of which he can think Jordan for, including the final ring in the 98 season where Pippen only played half the year due to injuries and missed a good deal of time during the playoffs. Pippen was a good offensive complement to MJ, as well as a great defender, but if he was the lead guy on his own team and had an inferior campanion, I don't think most would be talking about him as a top 50 player.

Everyone likes to point out the fact that Jordan had Pippen and Rodman for the last 3 years, but everyone forgets about the near league minimum roster fill ins he had to play with.

1995/96 Bulls Roster organized by points per game
Michael Jordan
Scottie Pippen
Toni Kukoc
Luke Longley
Steve Keer
Ron Harper
Dennis Rodman
Bill Wennington
Jack Haley (played only 1 game)
Jud Beuchler
Dickey Simpkins
James Edwards
Jason Caffey
Randy Brown
John Salley

It gets worse the next 2 years. Everyone got older, and the ones that did retire get replaced by even worse scrubs, including a fossil in Robert Parish.

Jordan doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves as making everyone around him better. In fact, that was one of his calling cards or intangibles back in the day that most seem to have forgotten. He made people better. I'm not talking about driving down the lane and recieving a dish for a wide open layup to pad your stats better. I'm talking about a guy who led by example and who's play inspired everyone else around them to elevate their game to match his passion better.

Not only did he elevate the game of his teammates, he won without a dominant big man. Look back over the past 20 years and you'll find that the only teams to win a championship without a dominant big man were Jordan's teams. That's unimaginable to do nowadays, but he did it.

I only wish Jordan had not have retired in his prime the first time, nor the second time. We could have seriously been looking at a modern day 8 peat.

 

[Anthony K.]

You should add this option to the choices:

Wanted to play with his two best friends in one of the best cities for a young, rich bachelor and not have to worry about having to carry the entire team on his back for 100 games a year.

Because, let's not forget, LeBron is just 25 years old and, being a 25 year old myself, if I had the opportunity to join a team that had two of my best friends on it and it was a bachelor haven, I would definitely take the pay cut to join them.

 

[nborton]

You should add this option to the choices:

Wanted to play with his two best friends in one of the best cities for a young, rich bachelor and not have to worry about having to carry the entire team on his back for 100 games a year.

Because, let's not forget, LeBron is just 25 years old and, being a 25 year old myself, if I had the opportunity to join a team that had two of my best friends on it and it was a bachelor haven, I would definitely take the pay cut to join them.

Agreed. I do think the city has more to do with it than people will like to think. In all reality I think that's why no one wins championships in Cleveland. No one wanted to join him in Cleveland. It's not sexy to go to any city outside of LA, NY, CHI, or MIA. Although, you can break the big city trend if you have a previous history of championships like BOS. That's the ONLY reason NY was even considered in this whole discussion. I guarantee if the Knicks were in Charlotte we wouldn't have heard a peep about James going to them.

If you think about it, 5 teams have dominated nearly all the championships in the last 30 years. Outside of a few sporadic teams winning (HOU, PHI, MIA).

LA - 9
CHI - 6
BOS - 4
SA - 4
DET - 3

Now that they are all in MIA it will be the 6th team on the list of teams dominating.

 

[mlbsalltimegreats]

People give Scottie Pippen WAY too much credit. Just look at what he did, well what he didn't do, after Jordan retired. He went to a NBA All Time Top 50 Dream Team in Houston where they couldn't make it out of the west. Remember that team? Hakeem Olajuwan, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen? His scoring average dropped nearly 5 points per game to 14.5. Honestly, I think the only reason why Pippen is a top 50 guy is because he has 6 rings to his name and had respectable stats during those years, all of which he can think Jordan for, including the final ring in the 98 season where Pippen only played half the year due to injuries and missed a good deal of time during the playoffs. Pippen was a good offensive complement to MJ, as well as a great defender, but if he was the lead guy on his own team and had an inferior campanion, I don't think most would be talking about him as a top 50 player.

Everyone likes to point out the fact that Jordan had Pippen and Rodman for the last 3 years, but everyone forgets about the near league minimum roster fill ins he had to play with.

1995/96 Bulls Roster organized by points per game
Michael Jordan
Scottie Pippen
Toni Kukoc
Luke Longley
Steve Keer
Ron Harper
Dennis Rodman
Bill Wennington
Jack Haley (played only 1 game)
Jud Beuchler
Dickey Simpkins
James Edwards
Jason Caffey
Randy Brown
John Salley

It gets worse the next 2 years. Everyone got older, and the ones that did retire get replaced by even worse scrubs, including a fossil in Robert Parish.

Jordan doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves as making everyone around him better. In fact, that was one of his calling cards or intangibles back in the day that most seem to have forgotten. He made people better. I'm not talking about driving down the lane and recieving a dish for a wide open layup to pad your stats better. I'm talking about a guy who led by example and who's play inspired everyone else around them to elevate their game to match his passion better.

Not only did he elevate the game of his teammates, he won without a dominant big man. Look back over the past 20 years and you'll find that the only teams to win a championship without a dominant big man were Jordan's teams. That's unimaginable to do nowadays, but he did it.

I only wish Jordan had not have retired in his prime the first time, nor the second time. We could have seriously been looking at a modern day 8 peat.[/quote]




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Very Well Put and I love Pippen but Micheal Jordan molded these guys single Handedly (He dint Mold Rodman but Kept him inline for the most part). Keep in mind that Micheal was on Pippen ass during practice his first 3 years and beyond and that termedously helped Pippen become one of the best small forwards/Gaurds in the game. Jordan especially Helped Pippen become one of the best defensive players to play the Game. Keep in mind that Jordan is the one with the "Defensive Player of the year" award on their resume and not Scotty but for good reason. As for Rodman, Jordan won with out Rodman in the first 3 Peat and Rodman was basically a Great complimentry Piece to a Team Who would have grabbed another Big Forward (Had Rodman not come to the Bulls) and they still would have won.
Also lets get another thing Straight!! Micheal Jordan is still the best player to ever play the game not Kobe and Micheal Just Micheal. He is on his own pedistal. Basically you have Micheal Jordan and then............




















Everyone else (Magic, Kobe, Wilt, Bird, Oscar, Shaq, Ect).


As to not stray away from the original Topic.
I think his move is All about Winning and I think he saw that he has the best chance to win now with Miami. I dont think for one sec it is Lack of confidence as we all know he would have won atleast 1 if not 2 had he gone to the Bulls, Knicks, or even stay in Cleveland (And made a few moves). Too me the fact that he went to Maimi and is Giving up money, Giving up Rep and possibly giving up Legacy tells you how bad the guy wants to win. Also For people who say he can't reach Kobe or Magic status ( I dont think he will ever reach Jordan Status) I think you are wrong. For one Does it Diminish the fact that Kobe has 5 Rings and 3 of them were with Shaq? Yes and no. Kobe was clearly Shaq's Side Kick with the Lakers first 3 peat (Who won the Regular Season MVP's and Finals MVP's?). Now having Kobe as a sick kick would put Kobe as possibly the best side Kick in the history of the Nba (That may change with Miami now) but he still was Robin. One thing Kobe has shown is that he can win being the Main man and thus is why people Put him up there as one of the best to play the game. How couldnt you?
The one way I think Lebron can still come out at the end of his career as one of the Best ever is if the Heat Win Multiple Championship (And I dont mean 2 or 3 I mean 4 in a row), and in atleast 2 of those championships wins Finals Mvp. Also a couple of more regular season Mvp's will help. I know this sounds Crazy but Its not out of the Realm of possibility that within Next 4 years or Sooner that Lebron in one season (Or More) could Avg a triple Double, Win Regular Season Mvp, Win a title and Win the Finals MVP. Heck even throw in a Defensive Player of the year award as he can now concetrate on Defense more now that he doesnt have to be the 1st Option on scoring all the time (Dwight Howard wont give that up easily). I could accually see Lebron Avg 17-18Pt - 11Rbs and 11ast with this team. You cant tell me that if (Big if ofcourse) he were to pull off a season or 2 of what I wrote above that when its all said and done he would'nt be regaurded as one of the best players of all-time? I for one think that they are going to come together at some point and I hope not this year as I still have faith in my Celtics that we can Meet up with the Lakers again and win it this time for one last Hurra! If they do for some reason then there is nothing I can do and enjoy it for what it is. Once these guys do start to come together its going to be a long winning ride and no one will be able to stop them.

 

[Anthony K.]

[quote="KOBEARODLT":3m5x6g0f][quote="sportscardtheory":3m5x6g0f][quote="bodiaz":3m5x6g0f]Lebron over kobe imo. Kobe does not get his rings unless he is traded to the lakers. Had he stayed where HR was drafted, he would have bolted after 3 years. Lebron took that garbage team as far as it was going.

And what team has Kobe played for other than the Lakers?

he was drafted by the hornets, and as much as i hate to say it yes kobe would have been in the same boat as lebron if he wasnt traded

I know his situation. My point was that he was traded on Draft Day, so you can't hold that against him. You can say the same about ANY all-time great. "What ifs" are a dime a dozen.

you didnt answer my question above.....jordan played with top 50 pippen and all time great defensive/rebound guy in rodman...name one guy that lebron played with even half the caliber of those two guys? your trying to tell me that jordan with his crazy will to win wouldnt have left town if CHI didnt bring those guys in?

Brought those players in? Scottie Pippen played his first 11 seasons with the Bulls. Are you telling me he was a top-50 player before he stepped foot on an NBA court? And players like Rodman WANTED to play with Jordan. Where were all these Rodman-type players clamoring to play with LeBron in Cleveland? Clearly you aren't understanding my point that Jordan elevated his teammates. Scottie Pippen most likely would not be a top-50 player had he not been alongside the best ever for so many years. Jordan elevated his teammates and made them look better than they were, LeBron has yet to show he can will his team to a Championship like Jordan and/or possibly Kobe.

If there was an NBA "Best Supporting Player Award", players like Pippen and Rodman would have the record for number of awards won.

LeBron James can't touch Kobe or MJ because he lacks their mental edge. He lacks their confidence. He lacks the ability to elevate his team to elite. I'm sure he will win one or more Championships with Miami, but it will be at the expense of his integrity.[/quote:3m5x6g0f]

God damn, if one more person talks about Pippen not being a top 50 player without Jordan I'm going to go crazy. Saying things like that make your opinions on any NBA topics meaningless.

Let me summarize you're point:
"I hate Lebron. I would have complained if he stayed in Cleveland because it was all about the money. I would have complained if he went to Chicago because he was trying too hard to be Jordan. I would have complained if he sacrificed money to play with other superstars because it's the easy way out."[/quote:3m5x6g0f]

im a big kobe fan but the ripping on lebron is ridiculous, jordan played with top 50 all time player in scottie pippen and one of the top defenders/rebounders in the game in rodman....only difference is the bulls brought them players to him unlike the cavaliers. Name a player that lebron has played with that was even half the player of pippen or rodman? The cavs did nothing to get better, they actually got worst since last year, so why wouldnt he leave?

People give Scottie Pippen WAY too much credit. Just look at what he did, well what he didn't do, after Jordan retired. He went to a NBA All Time Top 50 Dream Team in Houston where they couldn't make it out of the west. Remember that team? Hakeem Olajuwan, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen? His scoring average dropped nearly 5 points per game to 14.5. Honestly, I think the only reason why Pippen is a top 50 guy is because he has 6 rings to his name and had respectable stats during those years, all of which he can think Jordan for, including the final ring in the 98 season where Pippen only played half the year due to injuries and missed a good deal of time during the playoffs. Pippen was a good offensive complement to MJ, as well as a great defender, but if he was the lead guy on his own team and had an inferior campanion, I don't think most would be talking about him as a top 50 player.

Everyone likes to point out the fact that Jordan had Pippen and Rodman for the last 3 years, but everyone forgets about the near league minimum roster fill ins he had to play with.

1995/96 Bulls Roster organized by points per game
Michael Jordan
Scottie Pippen
Toni Kukoc
Luke Longley
Steve Keer
Ron Harper
Dennis Rodman
Bill Wennington
Jack Haley (played only 1 game)
Jud Beuchler
Dickey Simpkins
James Edwards
Jason Caffey
Randy Brown
John Salley

It gets worse the next 2 years. Everyone got older, and the ones that did retire get replaced by even worse scrubs, including a fossil in Robert Parish.

Jordan doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves as making everyone around him better. In fact, that was one of his calling cards or intangibles back in the day that most seem to have forgotten. He made people better. I'm not talking about driving down the lane and recieving a dish for a wide open layup to pad your stats better. I'm talking about a guy who led by example and who's play inspired everyone else around them to elevate their game to match his passion better.

Not only did he elevate the game of his teammates, he won without a dominant big man. Look back over the past 20 years and you'll find that the only teams to win a championship without a dominant big man were Jordan's teams. That's unimaginable to do nowadays, but he did it.

I only wish Jordan had not have retired in his prime the first time, nor the second time. We could have seriously been looking at a modern day 8 peat.[/quote:3m5x6g0f]

It seems you didn't mention the time off in between the 2 championship runs, when Scotty average 22 points, 8 rebounds, 5 assists, 2.9 steals, 1 block per game and shot 48.5% from the field, as the MAN of those two teams.He carried over those same averages in '94, then they took a dip when MJ came back in the 95 playoffs.

It's tough to say Pippen was nothing when MJ retired the 2nd time, especially since he was coming off of his 11th season and a major injury, at the time. Had Barkley not had chemistry issues with the Rockets (he couldn't get over being a)not as good as he used to be and b) being one of the two main guys), that 98-99 Rockets team would have been a lot better (not to mention the pupu platter of crappiness after the big 3 - Cuttino Mobley, Michael Dickerson and Othella Harrington rounded out their top 6).

He is a top 50 player because he is arguably one of the 10 best defenders of ALL time. I won't argue he is one of the greatest sidekicks of all time, though, as I completely agree there. Scottie was the perfect compliment to MJ and, had he been the #1 guy on his own team, may well have been a good foe for Jordan to have had in his prime.

 

[Anthony K.]

People give Scottie Pippen WAY too much credit. Just look at what he did, well what he didn't do, after Jordan retired. He went to a NBA All Time Top 50 Dream Team in Houston where they couldn't make it out of the west. Remember that team? Hakeem Olajuwan, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen? His scoring average dropped nearly 5 points per game to 14.5. Honestly, I think the only reason why Pippen is a top 50 guy is because he has 6 rings to his name and had respectable stats during those years, all of which he can think Jordan for, including the final ring in the 98 season where Pippen only played half the year due to injuries and missed a good deal of time during the playoffs. Pippen was a good offensive complement to MJ, as well as a great defender, but if he was the lead guy on his own team and had an inferior campanion, I don't think most would be talking about him as a top 50 player.

Everyone likes to point out the fact that Jordan had Pippen and Rodman for the last 3 years, but everyone forgets about the near league minimum roster fill ins he had to play with.

1995/96 Bulls Roster organized by points per game
Michael Jordan
Scottie Pippen
Toni Kukoc
Luke Longley
Steve Keer
Ron Harper
Dennis Rodman
Bill Wennington
Jack Haley (played only 1 game)
Jud Beuchler
Dickey Simpkins
James Edwards
Jason Caffey
Randy Brown
John Salley

It gets worse the next 2 years. Everyone got older, and the ones that did retire get replaced by even worse scrubs, including a fossil in Robert Parish.

Jordan doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves as making everyone around him better. In fact, that was one of his calling cards or intangibles back in the day that most seem to have forgotten. He made people better. I'm not talking about driving down the lane and recieving a dish for a wide open layup to pad your stats better. I'm talking about a guy who led by example and who's play inspired everyone else around them to elevate their game to match his passion better.

Not only did he elevate the game of his teammates, he won without a dominant big man. Look back over the past 20 years and you'll find that the only teams to win a championship without a dominant big man were Jordan's teams. That's unimaginable to do nowadays, but he did it.

I only wish Jordan had not have retired in his prime the first time, nor the second time. We could have seriously been looking at a modern day 8 peat.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Very Well Put and I love Pippen but Micheal Jordan molded these guys single Handedly (He dint Mold Rodman but Kept him inline for the most part). Keep in mind that Micheal was on Pippen ass during practice his first 3 years and beyond and that termedously helped Pippen become one of the best small forwards/Gaurds in the game. Jordan especially Helped Pippen become one of the best defensive players to play the Game. Keep in mind that Jordan is the one with the "Defensive Player of the year" award on their resume and not Scotty but for good reason. As for Rodman, Jordan won with out Rodman in the first 3 Peat and Rodman was basically a Great complimentry Piece to a Team Who would have grabbed another Big Forward (Had Rodman not come to the Bulls) and they still would have won.
Also lets get another thing Straight!! Micheal Jordan is still the best player to ever play the game not Kobe and Micheal Just Micheal. He is on his own pedistal. Basically you have Micheal Jordan and then[/quote]

I missed this quote, but keep in mind, Jordan won the DPOY award in his 4th season, which was Scottie's rookie year. From then until Ron Artes won DPOY, only one other non-big man won a DPOY award (Gary Payton in 95/96) and it could be argued that Pippen could have won one, had he not played in the same time frame as two of the greatest defensive centers of all time in Hakeem and DRob.

 

[mlbsalltimegreats]

People give Scottie Pippen WAY too much credit. Just look at what he did, well what he didn't do, after Jordan retired. He went to a NBA All Time Top 50 Dream Team in Houston where they couldn't make it out of the west. Remember that team? Hakeem Olajuwan, Charles Barkley, Scottie Pippen? His scoring average dropped nearly 5 points per game to 14.5. Honestly, I think the only reason why Pippen is a top 50 guy is because he has 6 rings to his name and had respectable stats during those years, all of which he can think Jordan for, including the final ring in the 98 season where Pippen only played half the year due to injuries and missed a good deal of time during the playoffs. Pippen was a good offensive complement to MJ, as well as a great defender, but if he was the lead guy on his own team and had an inferior campanion, I don't think most would be talking about him as a top 50 player.

Everyone likes to point out the fact that Jordan had Pippen and Rodman for the last 3 years, but everyone forgets about the near league minimum roster fill ins he had to play with.

1995/96 Bulls Roster organized by points per game
Michael Jordan
Scottie Pippen
Toni Kukoc
Luke Longley
Steve Keer
Ron Harper
Dennis Rodman
Bill Wennington
Jack Haley (played only 1 game)
Jud Beuchler
Dickey Simpkins
James Edwards
Jason Caffey
Randy Brown
John Salley

It gets worse the next 2 years. Everyone got older, and the ones that did retire get replaced by even worse scrubs, including a fossil in Robert Parish.

Jordan doesn't get nearly the credit he deserves as making everyone around him better. In fact, that was one of his calling cards or intangibles back in the day that most seem to have forgotten. He made people better. I'm not talking about driving down the lane and recieving a dish for a wide open layup to pad your stats better. I'm talking about a guy who led by example and who's play inspired everyone else around them to elevate their game to match his passion better.

Not only did he elevate the game of his teammates, he won without a dominant big man. Look back over the past 20 years and you'll find that the only teams to win a championship without a dominant big man were Jordan's teams. That's unimaginable to do nowadays, but he did it.

I only wish Jordan had not have retired in his prime the first time, nor the second time. We could have seriously been looking at a modern day 8 peat.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Very Well Put and I love Pippen but Micheal Jordan molded these guys single Handedly (He dint Mold Rodman but Kept him inline for the most part). Keep in mind that Micheal was on Pippen ass during practice his first 3 years and beyond and that termedously helped Pippen become one of the best small forwards/Gaurds in the game. Jordan especially Helped Pippen become one of the best defensive players to play the Game. Keep in mind that Jordan is the one with the "Defensive Player of the year" award on their resume and not Scotty but for good reason. As for Rodman, Jordan won with out Rodman in the first 3 Peat and Rodman was basically a Great complimentry Piece to a Team Who would have grabbed another Big Forward (Had Rodman not come to the Bulls) and they still would have won.
Also lets get another thing Straight!! Micheal Jordan is still the best player to ever play the game not Kobe and Micheal Just Micheal. He is on his own pedistal. Basically you have Micheal Jordan and then

I missed this quote, but keep in mind, Jordan won the DPOY award in his 4th season, which was Scottie's rookie year. From then until Ron Artes won DPOY, only one other non-big man won a DPOY award (Gary Payton in 95/96) and it could be argued that Pippen could have won one, had he not played in the same time frame as two of the greatest defensive centers of all time in Hakeem and DRob.[/quote]




------------------------------------------------------------

Good Point Anthony. I honestly do not want to take away from Scotty Pippen as he is one of my favorite Players of all-time. I think my point was more towards how Jordan Pushed him to become the player he was. We have to remember in all those books and stories about their famous practices and it was not Scotty or anyone else pushing people's buttons and challenging them to get better it was Micheal Jordan and to the point that people wanted to beat the crap out of him.
Let me put it to you like this If you and I were decent golfers and decided to take lessons from Phil Mickelson, who is a great Golfer, for the whole year I guarantee within that year and at the end we will be much better Golfers than lets say if we took those same lesson from Charles barkley :lol: . Now we may not be PGA Bound but we will be much improved.

 

[maxpower]

I think that Lebron handled the situation wrong and shouldn't have announced it on tv.
I also think that it was a poor decision to go to Miami simply because he is going to Wade's team. I think it hurts his brand and puts even more pressure on him to win; even if he does win the glory will a lot less than if he were to win elsewhere.

Make no mistake, it is NOT Wade's team anymore. When the 2 time MVP comes to your team, it becomes his team. Wade is Scottie Pippen now.

I think most of the time, you're correct, but in this case there really will be two leaders. LeBron is the better overall player and the guy that's key to them getting usable contributions out of the mish mash that will fill out the rest of the roster. No matter how you think he stacks up in the rankings of the all time greats, I don't think anyone can dispute that his abilities work well for making average teams look great. I mean, look at that Cleveland roster without LeBron. Brokedown Shaq, Jamison (for half a season), Mo Williams, Varejao, and an AVERAGE small forward? That team has 30 wins written all over it.

However, as has been astutely pointed out in this thread, LeBron is not a 'killer' in the mold of Jordan or Kobe. He's not the guy who takes over the game in the last two minutes. But DWade is. DWade isn't the guy who makes a 30 win team into a 60 win team, and LeBron isn't the guy who scores at will at the buzzer. But I think there's an understanding that each guy has an indispensable role. It's more of a Magic/Kareem dynamic than Jordan/Pippen, and I think their heads are on right for that.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

Miami looks like they're starting to fill out their roster.

Chalmers
Wade
Lebron
Bosh
Haslem

Miller

Miller is a real nice 6th man, Haslem gives them a big body that they lacked, and Chalmers is a good defender that has the ability to hit some 3's if left open.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

Also:

 

[bodiaz]

I think that Lebron handled the situation wrong and shouldn't have announced it on tv.
I also think that it was a poor decision to go to Miami simply because he is going to Wade's team. I think it hurts his brand and puts even more pressure on him to win; even if he does win the glory will a lot less than if he were to win elsewhere.

Make no mistake, it is NOT Wade's team anymore. When the 2 time MVP comes to your team, it becomes his team. Wade is Scottie Pippen now.

I think most of the time, you're correct, but in this case there really will be two leaders. LeBron is the better overall player and the guy that's key to them getting usable contributions out of the mish mash that will fill out the rest of the roster. No matter how you think he stacks up in the rankings of the all time greats, I don't think anyone can dispute that his abilities work well for making average teams look great. I mean, look at that Cleveland roster without LeBron. Brokedown Shaq, Jamison (for half a season), Mo Williams, Varejao, and an AVERAGE small forward? That team has 30 wins written all over it.

However, as has been astutely pointed out in this thread, LeBron is not a 'killer' in the mold of Jordan or Kobe. He's not the guy who takes over the game in the last two minutes. But DWade is. DWade isn't the guy who makes a 30 win team into a 60 win team, and LeBron isn't the guy who scores at will at the buzzer. But I think there's an understanding that each guy has an indispensable role. It's more of a Magic/Kareem dynamic than Jordan/Pippen, and I think their heads are on right for that.

Very well said. Could not agree more. Let me add that this will be the most versatile team maybe ever! Noah can play 3,4, or 5. Wade can play 1 or 2, and lebron can play all 5 spots. If they could have pulled Phil Jackson to coach, this team may have been able to win 75 games and a ring.

 

[Anthony K.]

Miami looks like they're starting to fill out their roster.

Chalmers
Wade
Lebron
Bosh
Haslem

Miller

Miller is a real nice 6th man, Haslem gives them a big body that they lacked, and Chalmers is a good defender that has the ability to hit some 3's if left open.

Haslem is a 6'8" power forward.

He would get eaten alive by just about every center in the NBA, just because of his size.

He will come off the bench behind Bosh (and when Bosh slides over to center, when, whoever their center is, needs rest), as the Heat are still searching for a center.

I think they should make a run at Erick Dampier when the Mavericks eventually cut him and his mega contract.

 

[Tomlinson21RB]

Miami looks like they're starting to fill out their roster.

Chalmers
Wade
Lebron
Bosh
Haslem

Miller

Miller is a real nice 6th man, Haslem gives them a big body that they lacked, and Chalmers is a good defender that has the ability to hit some 3's if left open.

Haslem is a 6'8" power forward.

He would get eaten alive by just about every center in the NBA, just because of his size.

He will come off the bench behind Bosh (and when Bosh slides over to center, when, whoever their center is, needs rest), as the Heat are still searching for a center.

I think they should make a run at Erick Dampier when the Mavericks eventually cut him and his mega contract.

He's shorter, but at least (in my opinion from limited experience watching him) is a wider body. Bosh is going to get eaten alive by any decent centers too. They need a Dampier or a Shaq (gasp) type to really filly that whole but I don't know if they're going to be able to do that with a minimum contract.

 

[Orangejello727]

A lot of people tend to focus on the names of players on a team then compare them to the best in the league. Sure Jordan didnt have a stacked team. But he did have a good team that won games. A team that played together, had leadership and drive to win. They gelled well. Thats what it takes to win. He had his Rodman and Pippen. They worked as a team with a leader to win what they did.

Did Lebron have what it took to win a ring in Cleveland? Yes.. No? I personally think there were maybe 2 things missing. Adding a bit more support and time. Cleveland sure had a good enough team to have the best record in the east 2 yrs in a row. There is no doubting that the cavs could win games. Yet they couldnt get it done in the playoffs. Playoffs being a whole different game and mentality takes experience. Lebron and the Cavs were getting that experience. In my opinion it was just a matter of time.

Im no Lebron fan. Infact I think he is a great athelete but thats about it. He doesnt have the passion, drive, killer instincts nor the leadership needed to take a team the whole way. He has great stats. He has skill. But not the rest. During his interview with ESPN he came out and said that he didnt want the pressure of having to score 30ppg and putting in 100%. Well, what can one say? Jordan, Kobe, Magic, Bird all would have stepped up to the plate, win or lose and still wanted the pressure and responsibility of having to go out there and work towards whatever it took to win. Not Lebron!! And not at 25 yrs old.

I personally think this is Wades team. Its not Dade County, its Wade County!!. Lebron is a compliment to Wade and not the other way around. I still dont think they have what it takes to win it all. We will see how they gel this up coming season.

 

[sportscardtheory]

A lot of people tend to focus on the names of players on a team then compare them to the best in the league. Sure Jordan didnt have a stacked team. But he did have a good team that won games. A team that played together, had leadership and drive to win. They gelled well. Thats what it takes to win. He had his Rodman and Pippen. They worked as a team with a leader to win what they did.

Did Lebron have what it took to win a ring in Cleveland? Yes.. No? I personally think there were maybe 2 things missing. Adding a bit more support and time. Cleveland sure had a good enough team to have the best record in the east 2 yrs in a row. There is no doubting that the cavs could win games. Yet they couldnt get it done in the playoffs. Playoffs being a whole different game and mentality takes experience. Lebron and the Cavs were getting that experience. In my opinion it was just a matter of time.

Im no Lebron fan. Infact I think he is a great athelete but thats about it. He doesnt have the passion, drive, killer instincts nor the leadership needed to take a team the whole way. He has great stats. He has skill. But not the rest. During his interview with ESPN he came out and said that he didnt want the pressure of having to score 30ppg and putting in 100%. Well, what can one say? Jordan, Kobe, Magic, Bird all would have stepped up to the plate, win or lose and still wanted the pressure and responsibility of having to go out there and work towards whatever it took to win. Not Lebron!! And not at 25 yrs old.

I personally think this is Wades team. Its not Dade County, its Wade County!!. Lebron is a compliment to Wade and not the other way around. I still dont think they have what it takes to win it all. We will see how they gel this up coming season.

Great post.