Say it ain't so...Mark Grace

[G $MONEY$]

Mugshot, courtesy of Scottsdale Police Dept.

who smiles for a mugshot? especially after getting busted for a dui, must have been feeling the effects still :?

 

[Gwynn545]

I would really like for someone to define drunk for me.

person A who is 180lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .07

person B who is 150lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .08

So...person A is within the limits of the law and person B is a POS?

How about we just have zero tolerance for the entire country?

75% of the restaurants and bars in the country would close their doors.

I'm sorry for anyone's loss because of a drunk driver, but you're not going to convince me that someone who has 3 beers with their wings at BWW is "drunk"

Wow...I am slowly losing respect for quite a few members here because of this. Three beers with dinner, they shouldn't be driving. How hard is that to understand?

So you haven't been affected. You are lucky. You have no connection to the argument. You have your opinion and it's a slap in the face for those that actually care, so why post it? Oh, that's right...you don't care.

Sportscardtheory brought up a good point about making one mistake, and having it ruin their lives, and that makes sense to me now. He definitely opened my eyes to the other side, but for people to continually post that it's no big deal, or making excuses, or splitting hairs (.07 < .08) is ridiculous. It's probably the same people who say smoking pot should be legal...

Poor beer drinker. He did not mean to drive drunk. He did not even mean to drive under the influence. He didn't know. And since he lost focus and plowed into that lady and her 1 year old in a stroller, he didn't really meant it. And he was only blowing a .07 so it's not even a big deal. It's not like he wanted to kill those two people. It doesn't matter that if he wasn't impaired, he would have seen them in plenty of time. Cut him some slack! Plus, she had one foot out of the crosswalk, anyways! Learn how to walk, lady! Maybe you and your baby would be alive...

 

[ChasHawk]

Then like I said, why not make a federal zero tolerance law?

Because in your world, millions of people are putting lives at risk every day by having beer & wine with dinner.

Why not make alcohol illegal? Just stop selling beer & booze period.
Or at least stop selling it in restaurants & bars.

Btw chief, marijuana is medically legal all over the country, but I don't care about it either way.
I don't come anywhere near drugs myself. I even quit smoking cigs a little over a year ago.

Way to generalize and take things to a ridiculous extreme though...

 

[Card Magnet]

Wow...I am slowly losing respect for quite a few members here because of this. Three beers with dinner, they shouldn't be driving. How hard is that to understand?

Three beers for the average man over a one hour dinner would still put him under the limit with room to spare. Everybody handles alcohol differently, so he could be significantly impaired, or he could be sober as Sunday.

If somebody harms another while driving drunk, then they should have no mercy shown. A local guy (23) and his girlfriend (22) killed a 19 year old pedestrian last year, fled the scene, and tried to cover it up. He admitted to it a few days later and that he was drinking, but this is two or three days after the kid died. They were just sentenced today. He is getting 2 years of jail with work release, she is getting two years of probation. Both of them should be in jail for no less than 10 years with no work release breaks.

Now somebody who gets pulled over for a routine stop or random checkpoint that comes up as legally drunk shouldn't be viewed or persecuted the same as somebody who hurt/killed another in the act. There's a limit to how many "what ifs" should be used against somebody.

If you're out hunting or at a shooting range and forget to put your safety on as you're walking, you're making a mistake that could be costly. If your gun goes off and hurts/kills somebody, then it is a completely different story. Or how about a person texting or on the phone while driving? They are in control of a car, but have impaired themselves. Same goes for a DUI offender; only hold the "what dids" against them and not the "what ifs".

 

[RL24]

I would really like for someone to define drunk for me.

person A who is 180lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .07

person B who is 150lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .08

So...person A is within the limits of the law and person B is a POS?

How about we just have zero tolerance for the entire country?

75% of the restaurants and bars in the country would close their doors.

I'm sorry for anyone's loss because of a drunk driver, but you're not going to convince me that someone who has 3 beers with their wings at BWW is "drunk"

Wow...I am slowly losing respect for quite a few members here because of this. Three beers with dinner, they shouldn't be driving. How hard is that to understand?

So you haven't been affected. You are lucky. You have no connection to the argument. You have your opinion and it's a slap in the face for those that actually care, so why post it? Oh, that's right...you don't care.

Sportscardtheory brought up a good point about making one mistake, and having it ruin their lives, and that makes sense to me now. He definitely opened my eyes to the other side, but for people to continually post that it's no big deal, or making excuses, or splitting hairs (.07 < .08) is ridiculous. It's probably the same people who say smoking pot should be legal...

Poor beer drinker. He did not mean to drive drunk. He did not even mean to drive under the influence. He didn't know. And since he lost focus and plowed into that lady and her 1 year old in a stroller, he didn't really meant it. And he was only blowing a .07 so it's not even a big deal. It's not like he wanted to kill those two people. It doesn't matter that if he wasn't impaired, he would have seen them in plenty of time. Cut him some slack! Plus, she had one foot out of the crosswalk, anyways! Learn how to walk, lady! Maybe you and your baby would be alive...

That's the thing though. I have a friend who is going through a really hard time right now. Back in February he was driving home from work and a young girl (presumably lost her focus and) slid on some ice, flipped her truck over the median, and smashed into his truck. It was icy and she wasn't wearing her seat belt. My poor friend held this 20 year old girl in his lap while she died. He is damaged from the experience. And think of the family of the girl who died, they must be really upset, even still all these months later.

What should we do? Should we make it illegal to drive on icy roads? Illegal to drive period? She was a responsible young adult who didn't drink and always wore her seatbelt according to her parents...

I'm sorry, but if somebody who blows a .07 gets in an accident, it's a coincidence that he blew a .07. If you get a little portable breathalyzer and a couple beers, and get yourself to .07, you'll see what I'm talking about. There are thousands and thousands of traffic accidents in America each and every day, and a very small percentage of them involve alcohol. 115 people die each day. Driving must be stopped!!!~


Really though, I agree that if you get sloppy drunk and then drive, you are a POS. If you check my post in the DUI thread in the general forum, you'll see that I said I think that the punishment for DUI should be more severe for people who are driving DRUNK. I also think it should be much less severe for people who have a small buzz.

Myself, I'm a relatively skinny fellow, 6'0" 200lbs. I would not drink 3 beers at dinner and drive home. It gives me a really good buzz, and I won't drive with one of those.

 

[gracecollector]

Grace made a mistake, undoubtably. He probably had 3-4 glasses of Scotch. At 6'1, 210 and with a pretty high tolerence, he probably was right at the legal limit. He shouldn't have finished a drink and driven 5 minutes later, should have waited a while. Stupid thing to do when you're driving a Jaguar, don't ya think?

Again, what he did was a mistake, but in the grand scale of celebrity/athlete mistakes, this wasn't too big of a deal. I hope he is punished, but commiserate to the crime. I hope he reflects about his attitude towards alcohol, and learns that 100% of the time you need to take drinking and driving seriously. He's a parent and a representative of a public organization, and that entails making responsible decisions. I believe he'll learn his lesson, and I bet he sincerely feels like he let down his family and fans. I'll bet an apology is forthcoming, and ownership of his deeds. What more can you ask? None of us makes the right decision 100% of the time - it's how we deal with the adversity in our lives that determines our true character.

 

[RL24]

gwynn5453l4u, I think what everybody is trying to say is, not all DUIs are the same. It does not take much alcohol for some people to get one. For you to see that somebody got a DUI and automatically, without knowing any details, jump to the conclusion that the person is a POS, is wrong of you.

Preacher Joe got one after having 1 beer at the summer softball/BBQ charity event. He's not used to drinking, and probably didn't eat enough. He surely didn't feel drunk, but the officer said he blew a .08 so now he's a POS.

Grandma Wilma takes a trip to the grocery store. It is more crowded than usual, and she has a small anxiety attack. Her doctor has prescribed her xanex for anxiety. She shouldn't have mentioned taking it to the officer, because he gave her a DUI, and now she's a POS.

If you call my grandma a POS again, there's gonna be problems. :twisted: :lol:


I can understand you lost somebody to a drunk driver, and I'm sorry for your loss. I lost somebody to a sober driver.

 

[SamHell]

Preacher Joe got one after having 1 beer at the summer softball/BBQ charity event. He's not used to drinking, and probably didn't eat enough. He surely didn't feel drunk, but the officer said he blew a .08 so now he's a POS.

Grandma Wilma takes a trip to the grocery store. It is more crowded than usual, and she has a small anxiety attack. Her doctor has prescribed her xanex for anxiety. She shouldn't have mentioned taking it to the officer, because he gave her a DUI, and now she's a POS.

Preacher Joe decided having a beer at the charity event was more important than the safety of the people of on the road he drives around?

Grandma Wilma not smart enough to read the bottle of her xanax that says not to drive or operate heavy machinery when taking this medicine?

 

[gracecollector]

Preacher Joe got one after having 1 beer at the summer softball/BBQ charity event. He's not used to drinking, and probably didn't eat enough. He surely didn't feel drunk, but the officer said he blew a .08 so now he's a POS.

Grandma Wilma takes a trip to the grocery store. It is more crowded than usual, and she has a small anxiety attack. Her doctor has prescribed her xanex for anxiety. She shouldn't have mentioned taking it to the officer, because he gave her a DUI, and now she's a POS.

Preacher Joe decided having a beer at the charity event was more important than the safety of the people of on the road he drives around?

Grandma Wilma not smart enough to read the bottle of her xanax that says not to drive or operate heavy machinery when taking this medicine?

Major League Baseball executives willfully ignoring research on thin ash bat handles and an effective handle wrap solution that could potentially save the life of a pitcher, infielder, coach or fan? A product that Mark Grace has endorsed and tried to raise awareness of? Yeah, he's such a POS. ::facepalm::

http://itsaboutthemoney.net/archives/2010/06/29/the-batglove-story/

 

[Card Magnet]

Preacher Joe got one after having 1 beer at the summer softball/BBQ charity event. He's not used to drinking, and probably didn't eat enough. He surely didn't feel drunk, but the officer said he blew a .08 so now he's a POS.

Grandma Wilma takes a trip to the grocery store. It is more crowded than usual, and she has a small anxiety attack. Her doctor has prescribed her xanex for anxiety. She shouldn't have mentioned taking it to the officer, because he gave her a DUI, and now she's a POS.

Preacher Joe decided having a beer at the charity event was more important than the safety of the people of on the road he drives around?

Grandma Wilma not smart enough to read the bottle of her xanax that says not to drive or operate heavy machinery when taking this medicine?

Preacher Joe should consult a lawyer, because the .08 was not a true reading after one beer (unless Preacher Joe was a midget weighing 40 pounds). Preacher Joe is probably not putting anybody's life in danger.

 

[i43770]

Preacher Joe got one after having 1 beer at the summer softball/BBQ charity event. He's not used to drinking, and probably didn't eat enough. He surely didn't feel drunk, but the officer said he blew a .08 so now he's a POS.

Grandma Wilma takes a trip to the grocery store. It is more crowded than usual, and she has a small anxiety attack. Her doctor has prescribed her xanex for anxiety. She shouldn't have mentioned taking it to the officer, because he gave her a DUI, and now she's a POS.

Preacher Joe decided having a beer at the charity event was more important than the safety of the people of on the road he drives around?

Grandma Wilma not smart enough to read the bottle of her xanax that says not to drive or operate heavy machinery when taking this medicine?

Preacher Joe should consult a lawyer, because the .08 was not a true reading after one beer (unless Preacher Joe was a midget weighing 40 pounds). Preacher Joe is probably not putting anybody's life in danger.

I'm not sure about other states, but in Oregon, you don't have to blow over a .08 (legal limit) to get a DUII. If you don't blow over a .08, you can still get the DUII, but don't lose your license.

 

[Card Magnet]

I forgot that some places have a zero tolerance. I was going off of Pennsylvania's .08.

 

[fengzhang]

I would really like for someone to define drunk for me.

person A who is 180lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .07

person B who is 150lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .08

So...person A is within the limits of the law and person B is a POS?

How about we just have zero tolerance for the entire country?

75% of the restaurants and bars in the country would close their doors.

I'm sorry for anyone's loss because of a drunk driver, but you're not going to convince me that someone who has 3 beers with their wings at BWW is "drunk"

What would you rather have: an objective threshold to define someone as legally drunk or have someone convicted of a DUI solely based on road-side sobriety tests? Based on your logic, you seem to favor more "functional" type testing. Someone can have 3 beers and function fine and someone else can have 3 beers and be totally out of it. So, should we have police officers subjectively decide whether someone is acting drunk or not and not use any kind of objective evidence at all? How do YOU suggest we determine if a person is driving drunk?

 

[ChasHawk]

I would really like for someone to define drunk for me.

person A who is 180lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .07

person B who is 150lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .08

So...person A is within the limits of the law and person B is a POS?

How about we just have zero tolerance for the entire country?

75% of the restaurants and bars in the country would close their doors.

I'm sorry for anyone's loss because of a drunk driver, but you're not going to convince me that someone who has 3 beers with their wings at BWW is "drunk"

What would you rather have: an objective threshold to define someone as legally drunk or have someone convicted of a DUI solely based on road-side sobriety tests? Based on your logic, you seem to favor more "functional" type testing. Someone can have 3 beers and function fine and someone else can have 3 beers and be totally out of it. So, should we have police officers subjectively decide whether someone is acting drunk or not and not use any kind of objective evidence at all? How do YOU suggest we determine if a person is driving drunk?

zero tolerance. make alcohol illegal.

 

[IndyManning18]

I was going to condemn the actions of Mark Grace for what he did, but then I realized he's white so I don't care.

 

[Lancemountain]

I would really like for someone to define drunk for me.

person A who is 180lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .07

person B who is 150lbs drinks 2 beers and blows .08

So...person A is within the limits of the law and person B is a POS?

How about we just have zero tolerance for the entire country?

75% of the restaurants and bars in the country would close their doors.

I'm sorry for anyone's loss because of a drunk driver, but you're not going to convince me that someone who has 3 beers with their wings at BWW is "drunk"

What would you rather have: an objective threshold to define someone as legally drunk or have someone convicted of a DUI solely based on road-side sobriety tests? Based on your logic, you seem to favor more "functional" type testing. Someone can have 3 beers and function fine and someone else can have 3 beers and be totally out of it. So, should we have police officers subjectively decide whether someone is acting drunk or not and not use any kind of objective evidence at all? How do YOU suggest we determine if a person is driving drunk?

zero tolerance. make alcohol illegal.

stop being a baby.

Don't drink anything with alcohol and drive, dude. Is this that hard for anyone here to grasp?

This whole "guy A is 210 pounds and has one scotch and a beer over two hours blah blah." argument is stupid. Just do not do it. Call a cab, have someone drive you or drink at home.

Simple. Enjoy yourself and alcohol responsibly and no matter what, do not consume any alcohol and drive a motor vehicle. Very very simple. Very simple

 

[Lancemountain]

. Intent is a big deal to me, and no one sets out to hurt others by hitting them with their car. So forgive me if I don't think it's right to compare manslaughter to driving under the influence.

Way to contradict yourself, batman.

You are aware, of course, that manslaughter requires a lack of any prior intention to kill or create a deadly situation. And inebriating oneself and driving a motor vehicle simply to get from point A to point B and in the process killing another human, by your wonderful ethical stance of intent being a big deal in your life, would fall in line with exactly what manslaughter is?


:benson:

 

[sportscardtheory]

. Intent is a big deal to me, and no one sets out to hurt others by hitting them with their car. So forgive me if I don't think it's right to compare manslaughter to driving under the influence.

Way to contradict yourself, batman.

You are aware, of course, that manslaughter requires a lack of any prior intention to kill or create a deadly situation. And inebriating oneself and driving a motor vehicle simply to get from point A to point B and in the process killing another human, by your wonderful ethical stance of intent being a big deal in your life, would fall in line with exactly what manslaughter is?


:benson:

Clearly you don't understand what I said or meant. That's okay though. ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: Here is some of these for you.

So I don't have to wait for your lame response, an idiot driving drunk's intent is to get from point A to point B, not to kill anyone.

 

[Lancemountain]

. Intent is a big deal to me, and no one sets out to hurt others by hitting them with their car. So forgive me if I don't think it's right to compare manslaughter to driving under the influence.

Way to contradict yourself, batman.

You are aware, of course, that manslaughter requires a lack of any prior intention to kill or create a deadly situation. And inebriating oneself and driving a motor vehicle simply to get from point A to point B and in the process killing another human, by your wonderful ethical stance of intent being a big deal in your life, would fall in line with exactly what manslaughter is?


:benson:

Clearly you don't understand what I said or meant. That's okay though. ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: Here is some of these back at you.

feel free to explain, or did my utter destroying of your silly stance render you to only respond in emoticons?


"oh I am a big believer in intent, it's a big deal! But someone doing the definition of manslaughter isn't manslaughter! It's just driving under the influence! It's not like they didn't meant to kill, they didn't mean to kill on a different level of didn't mean to kill. Intent is a big deal to me"

 

[sportscardtheory]

. Intent is a big deal to me, and no one sets out to hurt others by hitting them with their car. So forgive me if I don't think it's right to compare manslaughter to driving under the influence.

Way to contradict yourself, batman.

You are aware, of course, that manslaughter requires a lack of any prior intention to kill or create a deadly situation. And inebriating oneself and driving a motor vehicle simply to get from point A to point B and in the process killing another human, by your wonderful ethical stance of intent being a big deal in your life, would fall in line with exactly what manslaughter is?


:benson:

Clearly you don't understand what I said or meant. That's okay though. ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: ::facepalm:: Here is some of these back at you.

feel free to explain, or did my utter destroying of your silly stance render you to only respond in emoticons?


"oh I am a big believer in intent, it's a big deal! But someone doing the definition of manslaughter isn't manslaughter! It's just driving under the influence! It's not like they didn't meant to kill, they didn't mean to kill on a different level of didn't mean to kill. Intent is a big deal to me"

You are severely lost. You are literally making things up. I have no idea what the hell you are saying.