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Steroid Players and the HOF

moxacaine

Active member
Administrator
Aug 7, 2008
17,344
Fredericksburg, VA
I saw a post on Twitter today referencing Barry Bonds and him awaiting enshrinement into the Hall of Fame. And the first thing I thought was, would he even attend? Bonds seems to have that type of personality.

Do you think Bonds would show up if voted in? Do you think there are any other players tainted by steroids who wouldn't show if they got voted in?

Has there ever been anyone who hasn't shown up for their induction that wasn't related to health issues?
 

joey12508

Well-known member
Aug 7, 2008
21,232
Winterfell
He had the rep of being a **** head, it would stink if he showed. Going to see Mo get in, it would just not seem right JMO
 

jbone17

Active member
Sep 26, 2008
6,688
The Riverlands.
If I were the Chairman of the Baseball Hall of Fame, I take a legitimate stand and come up with a litmus test to determine if a player is eligible for consideration. There is so much ambiguity when it comes to PED usage across the game that writers simply have their hands tied. MLB (Independent of the Hall) won't dare take a stand other than harshly punishing current players so it doesn't happen again. The litmus test would be as follows:

1.) Has the player ever failed a test? If so, they're automatically disqualified from consideration on the ballot.
2.) Was the player named in copious documents indicating pass steroid use? E.g. Mitchell Report, BALCO, Biogenesis docs. If so, they're disqualified.
3.) Did said player voluntarily admit past usage at any point? Did they lie in front of Congress? If so, it's a no go.
4.) Did the player ever intimidate witnesses or attempt to obstruct in the wake of any steroid allegations in order to clear their name? If so, good-bye.
5.) If the player simply played in the era and does not fit the four standards set forth above, they are worthy of consideration. Players should not be held guilty until proven innocent under a cloud of suspicion. That's called Stalinism. No more kangaroo courts. The presence of evidence must indicate wrongdoing, not the other way around.
 

nosterbor

Active member
Jun 20, 2010
5,478
Sunny Florida
2.) Was the player named in copious documents indicating pass steroid use? E.g. Mitchell Report, BALCO, Biogenesis docs. If so, they're disqualified.
The Mitchell Report was a witch hunt, this is he said she said with no proof. Juan Gonzalez was tainted because a trainer was caught with PEDS in a gym bag going into Canada. A one liner in a billion page report tainted a player.
 

bstanwood

Active member
Sep 24, 2016
3,008
Mystic, CT
I definitely think bonds would show up, he seemed to have a great time when the giants had him back this past year. I think his surliness has subsided a bit since he retired but even if it hasn't I think his ego would be too big for him to pass up the opportunity to try and "set things straight" on that stage.
 

jbone17

Active member
Sep 26, 2008
6,688
The Riverlands.
2.) Was the player named in copious documents indicating pass steroid use? E.g. Mitchell Report, BALCO, Biogenesis docs. If so, they're disqualified.
The Mitchell Report was a witch hunt, this is he said she said with no proof. Juan Gonzalez was tainted because a trainer was caught with PEDS in a gym bag going into Canada. A one liner in a billion page report tainted a player.
Copious means numerous and not singular. The player would have to be named in multiple credible documents in order to ward off kangaroo court accusations.

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Austin

Active member
Aug 7, 2008
5,644
Oahu, Hawaii
Bonds will definitely show up. He wants the fame and attention and acceptance.
The bigger question is, how many current Hall of Famers would boycott the ceremony? I don't think any would, but some will probably silently protest the election.

There are most likely several steroid users already in the HOF, so they'll probably just keep quiet and keep their dissatisfaction to themselves.
 

AnthonyCorona

Active member
Oct 6, 2014
9,498
Modesto, CA
I LOVE Mo, my sisters and I all love the guy. My nephew’s middle name is Mariano. Still Barry and Roger are first ballot HOF players. These writers are ridiculous, giving them both praise throughout their careers with MVPs and Cy Young awards but not in The Hall? Without steroids there’s no 98 home run chase and baseball might be dead. They put in the commissioner who so proudly oversaw all of it and was fine with it. Bonds grew up seeing the media hurting his father and he carried that his whole life, I can’t blame him. You have David Ortiz mentioned in the Mitchell report, a guy who went from a scrub to possibly a HOFer but he was funny, people like him and so he gets a pass. Even ARod who I loved has had a whole change of character. He’s great on TV, dating JLo, very good on social media so a lot is the hate for him has seemed to die down as well. I’ll be interested to see how Alex and Ortiz do in voting, put them both in but only after Barry and Roger IMHO


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The whole Mariano Rivera being the very first unanimous HOF inductee proves to me the people who vote are the most completely biased, moronic and contradicting idiots ever.
They start by saying a closer doesn’t belong in the HOF. Then proceed to unanimously vote him in. Now granted Mariano is and should be inducted. But the very first unanimous ever?
You’re gonna tell me every player in the history of baseball, that not one player that has ever stepped foot on the field, not one player inducted in the HOF wasn’t worthy of a unanimous vote?
I laughed when Greg Maddox wasn’t unanimously voted in.
Griffey who could arguably be the only non steroid user in that era and one of the best center fielders, hitters of our generation wasn’t worthy?
Think about this. Mickey Mantle. Ted Williams. Joe D. Clemente. Nolan Ryan for Pete’s sake who holds records that probably will never be broke. 7 no hitters. 5714 K’s. One of the best pitchers of all time.
Rickey Henderson who in my opinion was THEE ultimate 5 tool player.
I could go on and on.
So they’re stating since the inception of the MLB on April 22, 1876, there has been NOBODY worthy until now, January 22, 2019? 143 years nobody until now.
The Baseball Writers who vote need to do that, write. Take their voting rights away. What very little respect I had left for these voters is gone.
Don’t get me wrong. Mariano deserves to be in the HOF. As does Hoffman at this point( all but 51 saves away). But the first unanimous. Cmon.


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Sep 30, 2017
846
Oklahoma
The whole Mariano Rivera being the very first unanimous HOF inductee proves to me the people who vote are the most completely biased, moronic and contradicting idiots ever.
They start by saying a closer doesn’t belong in the HOF. Then proceed to unanimously vote him in. Now granted Mariano is and should be inducted. But the very first unanimous ever?
You’re gonna tell me every player in the history of baseball, that not one player that has ever stepped foot on the field, not one player inducted in the HOF wasn’t worthy of a unanimous vote?
I laughed when Greg Maddox wasn’t unanimously voted in.
Griffey who could arguably be the only non steroid user in that era and one of the best center fielders, hitters of our generation wasn’t worthy?
Think about this. Mickey Mantle. Ted Williams. Joe D. Clemente. Nolan Ryan for Pete’s sake who holds records that probably will never be broke. 7 no hitters. 5714 K’s. One of the best pitchers of all time.
Rickey Henderson who in my opinion was THEE ultimate 5 tool player.
I could go on and on.
So they’re stating since the inception of the MLB on April 22, 1876, there has been NOBODY worthy until now, January 22, 2019? 143 years nobody until now.
The Baseball Writers who vote need to do that, write. Take their voting rights away. What very little respect I had left for these voters is gone.
Don’t get me wrong. Mariano deserves to be in the HOF. As does Hoffman at this point( all but 51 saves away). But the first unanimous. Cmon.


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I think even more damning is the 2013 Ballot included 8 guys who are now in the Hall of Fame but the BBWAA elected no one that year. They weren't Hall of Famers then but are now?
 

All In Cards

Super Moderator
Aug 7, 2008
22,910
21208
it just happened in football this past year. I think Randy Moss had his own induction ceremony at his high school.
 

Brewer Andy

Active member
Aug 10, 2008
9,614
The whole Mariano Rivera being the very first unanimous HOF inductee proves to me the people who vote are the most completely biased, moronic and contradicting idiots ever.
They start by saying a closer doesn’t belong in the HOF. Then proceed to unanimously vote him in. Now granted Mariano is and should be inducted. But the very first unanimous ever?
You’re gonna tell me every player in the history of baseball, that not one player that has ever stepped foot on the field, not one player inducted in the HOF wasn’t worthy of a unanimous vote?
I laughed when Greg Maddox wasn’t unanimously voted in.
Griffey who could arguably be the only non steroid user in that era and one of the best center fielders, hitters of our generation wasn’t worthy?
Think about this. Mickey Mantle. Ted Williams. Joe D. Clemente. Nolan Ryan for Pete’s sake who holds records that probably will never be broke. 7 no hitters. 5714 K’s. One of the best pitchers of all time.
Rickey Henderson who in my opinion was THEE ultimate 5 tool player.
I could go on and on.
So they’re stating since the inception of the MLB on April 22, 1876, there has been NOBODY worthy until now, January 22, 2019? 143 years nobody until now.
The Baseball Writers who vote need to do that, write. Take their voting rights away. What very little respect I had left for these voters is gone.
Don’t get me wrong. Mariano deserves to be in the HOF. As does Hoffman at this point( all but 51 saves away). But the first unanimous. Cmon.


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I was kinda blown away by this last night as well. Saw someone point out that Edgar had to wait 10 years because he was “only a DH” but Mariano goes 100% first try?
I’ve been calming down and thinking a little bit more rationally the more I think about it. I supposed the makeup of the writers themselves changes over time and can lead to changes in voting (ie getting a younger generation of voters, etc). Anyhow I try not to read too much in to percentages or to start over analyzing who “deserved” more votes. Astros fans commenting that Berkman isn’t a HOFer but “deserved” more votes. I understand the sentiment but it’s sorta pointless to go down that hole. Of course I also believe if he played in NY he would have gotten about 100 more votes than he did lol


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AnthonyCorona

Active member
Oct 6, 2014
9,498
Modesto, CA
I think there’s a few differences between Mo and Edgar. Probably #1 being post season performance. Obviously there’s a few times Mo didn’t get a save in the post season but for the most part he was dominant on the biggest stage. Playing in Seattle hurt Martinez too, not a big franchise name or following. The big vote gains over the years is stupid to me regardless of the player. Edgar was a HOFer his first year of eligibility just like his 10th. Larry Walker is gaining traction too but his numbers didn’t change after last season


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jbone17

Active member
Sep 26, 2008
6,688
The Riverlands.
Someone has to be the first unanimous selection of all-time and I'm glad it's Mariano. Don't get me wrong. Griffey should've been the first. The fact three writers grandstanded and omitted Griffey from their ballots was a travesty of epic proportions. Getting back to Mariano, there's several reasons why his unanimous selection should be no surprise to anyone.

1.) The stats speak for themselves. No need for me to hash out every record the man has. With a minimum of 1000 innings pitched, he's #1 in run prevention. No small feat.
2.) Class. You never heard a negative thing about the man. He took the ball, dominated and cue Sinatra.
3.) Postseason prowess speaks for itself. 31 of 42 postseason saves from MO were four outs or more to go along with a microscopic 0.70 ERA. There have been more souls on the moon, than earned runs surrendered by MO in October. The allure and nostalgia is endless.
4.) The humble beginning from rags to riches is a rarity. This man overcame numerous instances of strife. From the poor fishing village of Panama, to the bright lights of the Bronx.
5.) Fierce competitor, but an even bigger sportsman. Even in defeat, MO never bashed his teammates. Never. MO took his lickings personally and walked off the mound with his head held high. The pride of wearing Pinstripes never wavered for him.
6.) He survived for 19 seasons on one pitch. Let's see some other SOB pull that off in today's game.

I can think of more reasons, but these will suffice.
 
Someone has to be the first unanimous selection of all-time and I'm glad it's Mariano. Don't get me wrong. Griffey should've been the first. The fact three writers grandstanded and omitted Griffey from their ballots was a travesty of epic proportions. Getting back to Mariano, there's several reasons why his unanimous selection should be no surprise to anyone.

1.) The stats speak for themselves. No need for me to hash out every record the man has. With a minimum of 1000 innings pitched, he's #1 in run prevention. No small feat.
2.) Class. You never heard a negative thing about the man. He took the ball, dominated and cue Sinatra.
3.) Postseason prowess speaks for itself. 31 of 42 postseason saves from MO were four outs or more to go along with a microscopic 0.70 ERA. There have been more souls on the moon, than earned runs surrendered by MO in October. The allure and nostalgia is endless.
4.) The humble beginning from rags to riches is a rarity. This man overcame numerous instances of strife. From the poor fishing village of Panama, to the bright lights of the Bronx.
5.) Fierce competitor, but an even bigger sportsman. Even in defeat, MO never bashed his teammates. Never. MO took his lickings personally and walked off the mound with his head held high. The pride of wearing Pinstripes never wavered for him.
6.) He survived for 19 seasons on one pitch. Let's see some other SOB pull that off in today's game.

I can think of more reasons, but these will suffice.
I’m not saying MO doesn’t belong. Hands down he deserves to be in. Even when they say the hall is no place for closers or DH. Mo should be the exception. I understand somebody had to be the first unanimous inducted but 143 years to get that blows my mind with the greats that this game has seen.
They should have an asterisk next to his stats with an arrow pointing to Luis Gonzalez. All jokes aside. He is by far the most dominant closer. He belongs.
They say he was so good they had to name the reliever of the year award after him. What I find ironic is they did the same for Edgar Martinez yet it took till his last year of eligibility.
Ahhhh the voters. Good day gentleman.


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jbone17

Active member
Sep 26, 2008
6,688
The Riverlands.
I’m not saying MO doesn’t belong. Hands down he deserves to be in. Even when they say the hall is no place for closers or DH. Mo should be the exception. I understand somebody had to be the first unanimous inducted but 143 years to get that blows my mind with the greats that this game has seen.
They should have an asterisk next to his stats with an arrow pointing to Luis Gonzalez. All jokes aside. He is by far the most dominant closer. He belongs.
They say he was so good they had to name the reliever of the year award after him. What I find ironic is they did the same for Edgar Martinez yet it took till his last year of eligibility.
Ahhhh the voters. Good day gentleman.


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It was a crime that it took Edgar this long. Easily the most feared DH of our time next to Papi.

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