What constitutes an autograph?

[leatherman]

I was looking at a high end cut autograph card earlier, and the cut auto was actually just the person's name in their handwriting. It was obvious that this person was just writing their address down and wrote their name, but this was not a signature in the sense of what they would have signed on an official document.

Is this really a signature? Would you pay the same price for this "address signature" as opposed to a cursive signature by the same person?

Here is the card I am talking about (dual JFK and Jackie):

 

[A_Pharis]

I consider an autograph how they would sign the bottom of a handwritten letter (like the JFK sig).

 

[JackLondon]

Interesting question!

I never really thought about it, but I think that a printed name as opposed to a personal "signature" is still an autograph (in a way). I guess my answer sounds kind of wishywashy.

I have seen some vintage signature listings in autograph collector magazines and newsletters that charge less if a name is printed out (like the Jackie Kennedy in your example). While it may not be a genuine "autograph", it still is written in the person's hand and still would have collector value. I would prefer the signature, but if I had the card you showed, I would keep it proudly in my collection.

 

[i43770]

I don't think anything printed, either writing their name for an address or printing it on a "original rookie contract", can be considered an autograph.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

au·to·graph (ô't?-gr?f') Pronunciation Key
n.
A person's own signature or handwriting.
A manuscript in the author's handwriting.
tr.v. au·to·graphed, au·to·graph·ing, au·to·graphs

To write one's name or signature on or in; sign.
To write in one's own handwriting.
adj. Written in the writer's own handwriting: an autograph letter.

 

[Mighty Bombjack]

I asked this question a few months back. There was an envelope on ebay that contained a letter that Pie Traynor wrote to his wife. He addressed the letter to "Mrs. Harold Traynor," so he was technically writing his wife's name. If you cut out the Mrs., it looked like any of his signature that included his real name (as opposed to "Pie"). Is that an autograph?

How about this one from my collection? A return address from the back of an envelope...

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

I think Mighty's Ed Roush clearly represents Roush's actual signature.

Here is a Bud Podbielan example...I embedded a return address into the card because I thought it was an awkward cut, even though it clearly represents his actual signature shown above it.

 

[predatorkj]

I'd prefer an actual signature as opposed to a printed version but in the case it was someone really famous and I had very limited ability to obtain an actual signature...I'd be pleased enough with the handwritten name.

 

[Penno]

I'd prefer an actual signature as opposed to a printed version but in the case it was someone really famous and I had very limited ability to obtain an actual signature...I'd be pleased enough with the handwritten name.

I pretty much agree with this. Depending on fame and if they are deceased, the print would be ok. Any current MLB player, however, I'd like to have the official signature.

 

[Big Mac McGwire]

This is an autograph

 

[predatorkj]

I'd prefer an actual signature as opposed to a printed version but in the case it was someone really famous and I had very limited ability to obtain an actual signature...I'd be pleased enough with the handwritten name.

I pretty much agree with this. Depending on fame and if they are deceased, the print would be ok. Any current MLB player, however, I'd like to have the official signature.

You hit the nail on the head.

 

[wideright]

I was looking at a high end cut autograph card earlier, and the cut auto was actually just the person's name in their handwriting. It was obvious that this person was just writing their address down and wrote their name, but this was not a signature in the sense of what they would have signed on an official document.

Is this really a signature? Would you pay the same price for this "address signature" as opposed to a cursive signature by the same person?

Here is the card I am talking about (dual JFK and Jackie):

I personally do NOT consider that cut to be an autograph/signature. Handwriting your name in that fashion, I believe, officially could be used as a signature on legal documents, but if you print your name all the time as your official signature, that's one thing. But if there are other examples where a signature is different such as in cursive, then I would not consider a printed name as a signature. Sorry that sounded confusing!

Here is another example of a recent high-end cut released as a signature but it's actually been shown to be how Washington wrote his name, not his actual signature:

LINK TO CARD

So it goes without saying to do your homework before buying cuts. They are being passed off as signatures when some clearly are not.

 

[Therion]

In certain cases, some people's signatures look like it was just written in print. Flipping through my ***** Leagues autograph reference book (closest one to me right now) Oscar Charleston's early signature looked like he slowly wrote in grammar school cursive. "Big Bill" Drake's late signature was barely cursive. Biz Mackey also had a very grammar-schoolish signature. Virgil Blueitt pretty much just signed his name in block letters.

I'm sure I could find a bunch of other examples but I don't feel like flipping through the whole book. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

So the poll needs a new option added: It depends.

 

[Benson]

I posted this the last time this topic came up and no one responded, but maybe someone else will remember.

Wasn't there a cut signature of Babe Ruth that came out a couple of years ago that was two separate pieces of paper, "Babe" on one piece and "Ruth" on another?

 

[Mighty Bombjack]

I posted this the last time this topic came up and no one responded, but maybe someone else will remember.

Wasn't there a cut signature of Babe Ruth that came out a couple of years ago that was two separate pieces of paper, "Babe" on one piece and "Ruth" on another?

I don't remember the Ruth but I do remember a Mantle cut like that

 

[predatorkj]

In certain cases, some people's signatures look like it was just written in print. Flipping through my ***** Leagues autograph reference book (closest one to me right now) Oscar Charleston's early signature looked like he slowly wrote in grammar school cursive. "Big Bill" Drake's late signature was barely cursive. Biz Mackey also had a very grammar-schoolish signature. Virgil Blueitt pretty much just signed his name in block letters.

I'm sure I could find a bunch of other examples but I don't feel like flipping through the whole book. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

So the poll needs a new option added: It depends.

Case in point...I got this IP the other day at the Caravan and even though it almost looks like he just wrote his name...that surely is Jimmy Wynn's signature.Its just how he signs his name.