Your Beef with the Hobby or Why You Don't Care.

[autocut]

I think we are getting a little off track. We went from your beef with the hobby or why you don't care, to people defending themselves within the hobby. No matter why you are here, you don't have to defend or justify why you feel you are part of the hobby. Just try to stick to the issues.

 

[jswaykos]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

 

[ThoseBackPages]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

a lot of truth in your statement.

Sad that a hobby has turned to such a huge business.

 

[predatorkj]

Prospecting. It seems there are more prospectors today than there are legitimate collectors. I say legitimate because that is precisely what prospectors are not. If you buy cards with the explicit intention to flip them, then you are no longer in it for the same reasons that kids have gotten into it for the last hundred years.

For those that have been collecting for decades the most enjoyable posts for us on boards like this are the ones where a set collector finishes off the last 5 cards he needed for his 1986 Topps set, or the Dale Sveum collector who picked up that card he's been after for 20 years. That is what this hobby was truly about.

Prospecting... my beef.

agian, what do you care what other people do with their time and money?

I don’t care what people do with their time and money so long as they don’t come on a message board “for collectors by collectors” and discuss at length their prospecting hits and misses. If someone wants to blow their money on cases with the intention of flipping that is their right to do so but they better never confuse themselves with real collectors…remember those, the ones that do it because they love the thrill and not the potential.

If you prospect you are not a “collector,” you see it as a business not a hobby.

I agree but I do see the fact that the prospecting might be your "hobby", as it were. But you aren't really collecting for sheer personal enjoyment.

 

[predatorkj]

The funny thing is, my major beef with the hobby is how people think they know how other people should collect. :lol:



It's a hobby, and some people like to make money off of their hobby... who cares? My grandma's hobby is sewing, and she's made countless thousands over the years sewing for people. My other grandma's hobby is making china plates and things of that nature, when I had my daughter she made the cutest little china baby shoe thing. And that lady has made a small fortune. She loves to go around to these little shows and sell her stuff, and see what other people are selling... she makes lots of money, but it's always been her hobby. Why does somebody care if somebody else is trying to make money off of baseball cards? I don't get that.



Myself, I've been pretty serious about collecting for close to 10 years now. I've gone through all kinds of phases. The best time I've had collecting, what I find that I enjoy more than anything else, is collecting Rickey Henderson jersey # cards. I understand that nobody else is into that, but that's OK. It's what makes ME happy. I loved the sets from Donruss, like Sportscasters. Many people hated that set, but I put together these:

They are all #24/xx, and it was hard to track them all down, but the fact that I've accomplished this makes ME happy. Everybody else complained about so many similar yet different cards to chase down, too many cards, too many sets, let's get rid of Donruss. Ryan's favorite company.


You should just enjoy collecting for the reasons you enjoy collecting, and let other people enjoy collecting for the reasons they enjoy collecting. There's no reason to say that somebody else isn't even a collector just because they enjoy a different aspect of the hobby than you do.

Noted but if you really aren't collecting, and you are just selling, while it is a hobby of sorts, you aren't collecting. You're selling. That shouldn't be confused. You can do both. But you can't just sell and then figure you are a collector.

As for why anyone would bother caring...they do only if it affects the hobby as a whole. The fact that this hobby has become primarily about money now makes it hard for a collector to enjoy it as much because now we are more limited in what we can buy. Prices are steep in a lot of cases. Packs or secondary market stuff. So it does affect me. I wouldn't say prospecting affects me much at all but the big money stuff does. There are plenty of Bagwell cards I'd like to own but they are way too costly right now. I can't afford them so I lay off. But that does affect me as my goal is to collect them all. Am I bitching? No. But I am being affected. And I can't blame a seller for trying to get the most out of the card when they may have dropped $200 or more on the pack it came in.

 

[RiceLynnEvans75]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

Couldn't agree more.

I have my own collecting focus that is pretty much different from about 95% of the board. The last and only time I ever prospected was in '99 with a Corey Patterson Topps Chrome Traded RC that I had graded a BGS 9.5 and sold it off. It's just not for me. That doesn't mean that because it is great for others and not me, that it is wrong or a bad thing to do. And quite frankly, who cares if people that only flip to make money call it collecting? It's just a word/label.

I don't collect much modern anymore but do thoroughly enjoy seeing all of the modern that people do pick up and post on here. If people didn't buy modern, no matter what their reason is, there wouldn't be anybody making these pieces of cardboard called trading cards.

 

[theplasticman]

I like cards. I like collecting my favorite players and meeting other collectors who share the same.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

Its interesting to compare the people who sell in the hobby...where's the difference between stocking singles in your inventory (or "stash") or stocking cases of cards in your inventory? Is the person who buys cards with the intent to sell that much different than Burbank, Global Sportscards, D&A, or Atlanta Sports Cards? People may love the selling activity, building up their inventory and then dealing it to others; I suppose to some of these people its a job they love to do thats hobby-related.

Noted but if you really aren't collecting, and you are just selling, while it is a hobby of sorts, you aren't collecting. You're selling. That shouldn't be confused. You can do both. But you can't just sell and then figure you are a collector.

As for why anyone would bother caring...they do only if it affects the hobby as a whole. The fact that this hobby has become primarily about money now makes it hard for a collector to enjoy it as much because now we are more limited in what we can buy. Prices are steep in a lot of cases. Packs or secondary market stuff. So it does affect me. I wouldn't say prospecting affects me much at all but the big money stuff does. There are plenty of Bagwell cards I'd like to own but they are way too costly right now. I can't afford them so I lay off. But that does affect me as my goal is to collect them all. Am I bitching? No. But I am being affected. And I can't blame a seller for trying to get the most out of the card when they may have dropped $200 or more on the pack it came in.

 

[predatorkj]

The reason you took offense to it is because you are part of the problem. We see the same problem in the autograph memorabilia side; people wonder why stars charge $300.00 for an autograph, well the fact is they have to charge that so parasites, I mean prospectors, don't flip them for a quick buck because they can't turn a profit.

Do you see Brick and Mortar shops are part of the problem too, because you just described 100% of their business model.

I think they can be part of the problem. Any time you get people who buy cards soley to sell or you get LCS owners who don't really care about the hobby at all, it leads to some sub par business practices and people also devise ways to increase profit. Is maximizing your profit wrong? Hell no. But any time there is that potential, people will turn to scams and tricks. Not everyone but enough people to make it a problem. Just look at the patch fakers for instance. Trimmed cards. I figure trimming has been going on for ages but I know damn good and well it increased several fold once grading became prevalent and grading became prevalent because of the money. People were so damn worried about what they had as far as money goes so grading became very big. And along with that, people wanted more and more out of every pack so the packs became more expensive too.


Once this hobby becomes more about money and investment potential than anything else, Yes Houston, we do have a problem. People are free to do as they wish but nobody could say that money hasn't made this hobby worse in some parts. Better too but IMO...the bad parts are pretty damn bad.

 

[predatorkj]

Its interesting to compare the people who sell in the hobby...where's the difference between stocking singles in your inventory (or "stash") or stocking cases of cards in your inventory? Is the person who buys cards with the intent to sell that much different than Burbank, Global Sportscards, D&A, or Atlanta Sports Cards? People may love the selling activity, building up their inventory and then dealing it to others; I suppose to some of these people its a job they love to do thats hobby-related.

Noted but if you really aren't collecting, and you are just selling, while it is a hobby of sorts, you aren't collecting. You're selling. That shouldn't be confused. You can do both. But you can't just sell and then figure you are a collector.

As for why anyone would bother caring...they do only if it affects the hobby as a whole. The fact that this hobby has become primarily about money now makes it hard for a collector to enjoy it as much because now we are more limited in what we can buy. Prices are steep in a lot of cases. Packs or secondary market stuff. So it does affect me. I wouldn't say prospecting affects me much at all but the big money stuff does. There are plenty of Bagwell cards I'd like to own but they are way too costly right now. I can't afford them so I lay off. But that does affect me as my goal is to collect them all. Am I bitching? No. But I am being affected. And I can't blame a seller for trying to get the most out of the card when they may have dropped $200 or more on the pack it came in.

Nah...what I was getting at is the fact that some sellers and LCS owners really could give a rats ass about the hobby. Therefore, it leads to bad business practices as they don't care if they buy a collection with trimmed cards or fake autos or patches. They will gladly be selling it. Because their primary focus is money. Back in the day when I was a youngster this was also prevalent. But now days, with the sheer amount of money involved, and the various avenues available, its a hell of a lot more prevalent and available. Its easier to do. And also, with the amount of money involved, people who are dumb enough to bust wax hoping for a major ROI need more money per card when they sell to get it. Now granted there are boxes you can buy where you know you're getting an ROI easily. But like someone mentioned before, buying a box of TTT and hoping for one is not a good idea.

So when you throw those types of things into the hobby, it affects every collector. Even sellers. This hobby has always been about money I guess. But never to this degree, never with this amount of money. And never with as many avenues.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

Yeah its definitely some LCS owners but not all. Plenty are "hobby ambassadors" who balance their interests with the interests of the hobby and individual customers. I assume LCS owners are there to make a living but some do it to promote the hobby too - the problem is figuring the extent they're into it for themselves and the extent they're into it to help the hobby. Someone can get a feel for this by visiting the store, LCS owners aren't anonymous. Ebay sellers/sellers on the internet on the other hand are almost entirely anonymous and its almost impossible to tell how much they're greedy and how much they're trying to help the hobby.

I want and expect the LCS owner to make a living, assuming that's the owner's primary means of income, but I also want them to help the hobby for all collecting interests and not just their own.

Nah...what I was getting at is the fact that some sellers and LCS owners really could give a rats ass about the hobby. Therefore, it leads to bad business practices as they don't care if they buy a collection with trimmed cards or fake autos or patches. They will gladly be selling it. Because their primary focus is money. Back in the day when I was a youngster this was also prevalent. But now days, with the sheer amount of money involved, and the various avenues available, its a hell of a lot more prevalent and available. Its easier to do. And also, with the amount of money involved, people who are dumb enough to bust wax hoping for a major ROI need more money per card when they sell to get it. Now granted there are boxes you can buy where you know you're getting an ROI easily. But like someone mentioned before, buying a box of TTT and hoping for one is not a good idea.

So when you throw those types of things into the hobby, it affects every collector. Even sellers. This hobby has always been about money I guess. But never to this degree, never with this amount of money. And never with as many avenues.

 

[predatorkj]

I just wish some of them would act like they care instead of having that look like you're a giant ******* for even collecting cards. I have seen quite a bit of those types and they are the ones that scare me. Its like the whole reason they even own a shop is for their own private gag reel of people paying cash for cards. In my mind, those types are the types that are liable to pull some crap, be it trimming, or card altering of some form.

 

[tomtheripper]

I just wish some of them would act like they care instead of having that look like you're a giant ******* for even collecting cards. I have seen quite a bit of those types and they are the ones that scare me. Its like the whole reason they even own a shop is for their own private gag reel of people paying cash for cards. In my mind, those types are the types that are liable to pull some crap, be it trimming, or card altering of some form.

example: The entities behind "Sportscardgirl"

 

[predatorkj]

I just wish some of them would act like they care instead of having that look like you're a giant ******* for even collecting cards. I have seen quite a bit of those types and they are the ones that scare me. Its like the whole reason they even own a shop is for their own private gag reel of people paying cash for cards. In my mind, those types are the types that are liable to pull some crap, be it trimming, or card altering of some form.

example: The entities behind "Sportscardgirl"

?

 

[tomtheripper]

I just wish some of them would act like they care instead of having that look like you're a giant ******* for even collecting cards. I have seen quite a bit of those types and they are the ones that scare me. Its like the whole reason they even own a shop is for their own private gag reel of people paying cash for cards. In my mind, those types are the types that are liable to pull some crap, be it trimming, or card altering of some form.

example: The entities behind "Sportscardgirl"

?

Do you not know what I'm talking about or do you not understand how it relates?

 

[hofmichael]

I said his statement was jackassy.


I didn't call him a *******.

But you should have.

 

[predatorkj]

I just wish some of them would act like they care instead of having that look like you're a giant ******* for even collecting cards. I have seen quite a bit of those types and they are the ones that scare me. Its like the whole reason they even own a shop is for their own private gag reel of people paying cash for cards. In my mind, those types are the types that are liable to pull some crap, be it trimming, or card altering of some form.

example: The entities behind "Sportscardgirl"

?

Do you not know what I'm talking about or do you not understand how it relates?

Correlation?

 

[Sweetness]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

Exactly!

 

[autocut]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

Exactly!

That's human nature like it is with religion. That's why you have people adding "true" or "real" before whatever it is to separate what they feel as for the love vs for the money.

Now we see what's the biggest cloud in the hobby behind integrity. Everyone worried about what order collectors are doing instead of just focusing on keeping the hobby honest. We should be keeping the companies honest and the secondary market honest. How other collectors decide to collect should be their business and enjoyment.

 

[predatorkj]

Another beef that this thread is making me realize I have: people who think they're way of collecting is the ONLY way to collect, and criticize others for collecting differently.

Exactly!

That's human nature like it is with religion. That's why you have people adding "true" or "real" before whatever it is to separate what they feel as for the love vs for the money.

Now we see what's the biggest cloud in the hobby behind integrity. Everyone worried about what order collectors are doing instead of just focusing on keeping the hobby honest. We should be keeping the companies honest and the secondary market honest. How other collectors decide to collect should be their business and enjoyment.

Well for me it really is. I may have an opinion about your collection but it in no way should ever shape what or how you collect. To do so is the worst thing possible. I collect for me and me only. I would like to think others are the same. Now I may ask you questions or throw advice out there but after all, you have to do what you have to do to be happy. And I will say there are a ton of people who collect way differently than I do. Some of it I understand and some of it I don't.

But I think one thing some of you constantly overlook is that how other people collect does affect the hobby. Sometimes in a small way and sometimes in a bigger way. And eventually it does trickle down to affect everyone. For instance, the 90's inserts. There were a handful of us collecting the crap out of them for a while and then everyone joined in. Now the prices have gone up a good bit. So that does personally affect me to a degree. Now I don't buy as much of them. Too much competition.

A Bagwell collector for instance. I know when I first got back into collecting, I was looking to have a main focus and after seeing my friend's collection, I started collecting Bagwells. At first I would assume he thought I was copy catting but after seeing what he had, I had to have it for my own enjoyment. I have always liked Bagwell and the cards were just too awesome. So now I am out there with more money to spend than he has and also, my collection spawns more collections that other people start up. All of a sudden my friend has a lot more competition than he used to. He hasn't purchased a Bagwell card in about 3 years now. He told me he is simply taking a break to pay off some bills but the added competition surely doesn't help. I still throw him some stuff I know he doesn't have once in a while to help him out.

What and how we collect does affect others in varying degrees.