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As great as Jeter is playing, does he have any shot at Rose?
- Thread starter JEBJJA
- Start date
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reljac
New member
All good points...
Would Jeter really play for a small portion of what he earns now? No one will pay him the kind of cash he makes now to play at 45.
Would the Yankees want 45 year old Jeter active in their lineup EVERY day at the salary he will make when they can afford any player in baseball to replace him?
Would Jeter really play for a small portion of what he earns now? No one will pay him the kind of cash he makes now to play at 45.
Would the Yankees want 45 year old Jeter active in their lineup EVERY day at the salary he will make when they can afford any player in baseball to replace him?
Defensive metrics are flawed.
your entitled to that opinion.
Jeter has cost his team nearly 150 runs in the field during his career.
Smith saved his team nearly 240 during his career.
Based on what? And regardless, who said anything about Ozzie Smith? You could compare almost any SS in thehistory of the game and they will fall short of Smith.
Rtot (Total Zone Total Fielding Runs Above Average)....you said he has never needed to move from short. I was stating that AROD was a better fielder and posted Smith stats to show just how big a difference there is between a great fielder and a really below average one.
D-Lite
New member
I think pretty much any defensive argument shows Jeter has been at best adequate as a SS. But considering his offensive value over that time from a prime defensive position I'm pretty sure most people take Jeter.
Using WAR and the Jeter/Smith comparison, in 19 seasons Smith was 70.3 WAR and Jeter in the beginning of his 18th season is at 75.8 WAR. Again, like any metric, not perfect, but considering the huge difference in defense comparing to Ozzie, Jeter is pretty impressive.
Larkin was a slightly above average defensive SS and over his 19 seasons, managed a 70.6 WAR.
But what is most interesting from the defensive stats and comparing to the others is that Jeter has actually been notably better on average over the more recent seasons that he was in the prime of his career. He had some atrocious years but nothing nearly that bad recently. Even Ozzie Smith declined to merely really good over the last 5-6 seasons. I'm not saying this means Jeter can stay at SS for the duration of his career, but I am saying that until he regresses much more notably he's got the position through his current contract and probably for 1-3 more seasons after. Not the best situation to be in for the defense, but Eduardo is hardly pushing him out of the position...
sportscardtheory
Active member
I can see him getting to 4,000 hits. It will be up to the Yankees if they want to let him play as a shell of his former self to attain the record.
uniquebaseballcards
New member
- Nov 12, 2008
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Rose was a switch hitter, it gave him a great advantage especially later in his career.
I'm not sure what you mean by this quote. Would he have had many more hits just hitting from his natural side, or did he cheaply add hits to his total because he was smart enough to work from both sides of the plate?
D-Lite
New member
I think any objective fan would agree with you. The discussion here isn't about his GG legacy but rather is he just good enough for the the near term to hold the position down to get to 4257.
Yes, but the "near term" is approx 5 years away (what 42yrs old?). SS is a premium defensive position and in the AL East you cant just give runs away because your SS can't get to balls....
Will you be supportive of Sabermetrics when I tell you that CC Sabathia had a higher WAR than Mr. MVP Justin Verlander last season?
sportscardtheory
Active member
Lucky for him the Yankees are in the American League. 2 or 3 years at DH (or even outfield) at the end of his career could get him the record.
3 things:
xRA or Level of Opposition could have contributed to a higher WAR for C.C. He faced the AL East much more than Verlander.
xRA_def or Adjusting for teams Defense. Team defense behind the pitcher will change the score as well.
PPFp or Custom Park Factor. Yankee Stadium=hitters park. Comerica=pitcher's park.
Therefore it is highly plausible that Sabathia had a higher WAR for the Yankees than Verlander had for the Tigers.
Edit: After looking up the WAR stats Verlander was listed as an 8.3 and CC as a 7.0 so I'm not sure what you are getting at anyway?
http://www.baseball-reference.com/awards/awards_2011.shtml#ALcya
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CC Sabathia - 7.1 CC Sabathia » Statistics » Pitching | FanGraphs Baseball
Justin Verlander - 7.0 Justin Verlander » Statistics » Pitching | FanGraphs Baseball
But don't you see? Sabermetrics are so tell all that different people calculate them in different ways.
D-Lite
New member
And you're probably right. He'll likely finish out the current contract at SS and if they have/find a decent defensive SS that can at least be average with the bat he'll likely get time in the OF and DH, but more likely the former (ARod will need to take regular turns at DH).
I think Sabathia had just as good a year last year as Verlander. So this doesnt surprise me at all.
But Verlander had 24 Wins!!! Wins are really important!!!
(geez, sometimes wins are important and sometimes they are not. Weird)
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