Alabama will beat Auburn

[gt2590]

Chuck Finley, the Angels pitcher. Found this on FoxSports:

There are a couple of other recent incidents where a PA announcer was fired or reprimanded for playing songs aimed at mocking a particular player.

Chuck Finley- Whitesnakes “Here I Go Again”

As Finley took the mound for an April 2002 game against the Chicago White Sox at then-Comiskey Park II, the stadium’s musical director, Joe Stephen, took a subtle dig at Finley’s messy divorce, and played “Here I Go Again” by the band Whitesnake, referencing Kitaen’s appearance in that band’s videos. Stephen was later fired and the White Sox apologized. That same year Kitaen (yes I said Kitaen not Findley) was arrested for spousal abuse, but the charges were later dropped when Kitaen promised to go to anger management and counseling

 

[mstng99tim]

Chuck Finley, the Angels pitcher. Found this on FoxSports:

There are a couple of other recent incidents where a PA announcer was fired or reprimanded for playing songs aimed at mocking a particular player.

Chuck Finley- Whitesnakes “Here I Go Again”

As Finley took the mound for an April 2002 game against the Chicago White Sox at then-Comiskey Park II, the stadium’s musical director, Joe Stephen, took a subtle dig at Finley’s messy divorce, and played “Here I Go Again” by the band Whitesnake, referencing Kitaen’s appearance in that band’s videos. Stephen was later fired and the White Sox apologized. That same year Kitaen (yes I said Kitaen not Findley) was arrested for spousal abuse, but the charges were later dropped when Kitaen promised to go to anger management and counseling

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[cgilmo]

I hardly hold it against Newton that he took money. The system is messed up in that kids are recruited into a big money sport and are famous superstars of sport, and yet can't fix problems with their families. The fault here isn't with Newton, his situation is a symptom of a broken system that unintentionally encourages cheating by the athlete, their families, and it's member institutions. This type of situation does happen, and has happened at nearly every major college football program in America and at even some of the smaller ones. In fact some of the most flagrant offenders are smaller schools like Memphis.

The difference here is the mentality of the fan base. I haven't talked to a single Auburn fan who is willing to admit that there was a pay for play price on the LOI from Cam. The team I pull for has a very similar fan base as they are taken from the same demographic of people, so therefore they would probably have the same response. However I chose to look at the system itself, and know that if any program in the country is investigated deeply enough dirt will be found. If the news came out tomorrow that a star Alabama player took money, I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[AUTaxMan]

I hardly hold it against Newton that he took money. The system is messed up in that kids are recruited into a big money sport and are famous superstars of sport, and yet can't fix problems with their families. The fault here isn't with Newton, his situation is a symptom of a broken system that unintentionally encourages cheating by the athlete, their families, and it's member institutions. This type of situation does happen, and has happened at nearly every major college football program in America and at even some of the smaller ones. In fact some of the most flagrant offenders are smaller schools like Memphis.

The difference here is the mentality of the fan base. I haven't talked to a single Auburn fan who is willing to admit that there was a pay for play price on the LOI from Cam. The team I pull for has a very similar fan base as they are taken from the same demographic of people, so therefore they would probably have the same response. However I chose to look at the system itself, and know that if any program in the country is investigated deeply enough dirt will be found. If the news came out tomorrow that a star Alabama player took money, I wouldn't be surprised.

I think it's probably accurate that Rogers tried to broker a deal to get Cecil some $ from MSU boosters and that Cecil entertained the idea. I don't believe, though, that Auburn paid for Newton, and no reporters have alleged that they did.

 

[jet0002]

I hardly hold it against Newton that he took money. The system is messed up in that kids are recruited into a big money sport and are famous superstars of sport, and yet can't fix problems with their families. The fault here isn't with Newton, his situation is a symptom of a broken system that unintentionally encourages cheating by the athlete, their families, and it's member institutions. This type of situation does happen, and has happened at nearly every major college football program in America and at even some of the smaller ones. In fact some of the most flagrant offenders are smaller schools like Memphis.

The difference here is the mentality of the fan base. I haven't talked to a single Auburn fan who is willing to admit that there was a pay for play price on the LOI from Cam. The team I pull for has a very similar fan base as they are taken from the same demographic of people, so therefore they would probably have the same response. However I chose to look at the system itself, and know that if any program in the country is investigated deeply enough dirt will be found. If the news came out tomorrow that a star Alabama player took money, I wouldn't be surprised.

I believe a fan of any team would deny it until proven guilty. I am not naive enough to think it doesn't happen, I'm just holding judgement.

 

[JoshHamilton]

I hardly hold it against Newton that he took money. The system is messed up in that kids are recruited into a big money sport and are famous superstars of sport, and yet can't fix problems with their families. The fault here isn't with Newton, his situation is a symptom of a broken system that unintentionally encourages cheating by the athlete, their families, and it's member institutions. This type of situation does happen, and has happened at nearly every major college football program in America and at even some of the smaller ones. In fact some of the most flagrant offenders are smaller schools like Memphis.

The difference here is the mentality of the fan base. I haven't talked to a single Auburn fan who is willing to admit that there was a pay for play price on the LOI from Cam. The team I pull for has a very similar fan base as they are taken from the same demographic of people, so therefore they would probably have the same response. However I chose to look at the system itself, and know that if any program in the country is investigated deeply enough dirt will be found. If the news came out tomorrow that a star Alabama player took money, I wouldn't be surprised.

Well said.

I know tons of players who accepted stuff at several different schools in more than one conference.

A lot of times, it was small stuff. New wardrobe, $600 cell phones (back in 2002 when that kind of phone was unheard of), bar tabs paid for, fraternity dues covered. Some guys got new Tahoes after graduation

It happens everywhere. Don't be naive

 

[cgilmo]

I hardly hold it against Newton that he took money. The system is messed up in that kids are recruited into a big money sport and are famous superstars of sport, and yet can't fix problems with their families. The fault here isn't with Newton, his situation is a symptom of a broken system that unintentionally encourages cheating by the athlete, their families, and it's member institutions. This type of situation does happen, and has happened at nearly every major college football program in America and at even some of the smaller ones. In fact some of the most flagrant offenders are smaller schools like Memphis.

The difference here is the mentality of the fan base. I haven't talked to a single Auburn fan who is willing to admit that there was a pay for play price on the LOI from Cam. The team I pull for has a very similar fan base as they are taken from the same demographic of people, so therefore they would probably have the same response. However I chose to look at the system itself, and know that if any program in the country is investigated deeply enough dirt will be found. If the news came out tomorrow that a star Alabama player took money, I wouldn't be surprised.

I think it's probably accurate that Rogers tried to broker a deal to get Cecil some $ from MSU boosters and that Cecil entertained the idea. I don't believe, though, that Auburn paid for Newton, and no reporters have alleged that they did.

I think the evidence is clear that Cecil Newton solicited offers. This makes Cameron ineligible regardless of what he knew.

 

[AUTaxMan]

I think the evidence is clear that Cecil Newton solicited offers. This makes Cameron ineligible regardless of what he knew.

The evidence "clear"? Seriously? I don't think so. It's the word of MSU boosters/former MSU players/anonymous MSU coaches vs. the word of Cecil Newton. All of them probably have some degree of culpability right now, all of them are saying what suits their interests best, and none of them are entirely credible (NFL allegations, changing stories, etc.).

If the NCAA satisfies itself that Cam knew about the deal, he could be ruled ineligible. They also have the discretion to not rule him ineligible. If he didn't know about it, he would possibly be ineligible at MSU, but not at Auburn. Read the rules.

Think about it like this: AUTaxMan approaches MSU coaches/boosters and tells them I can deliver them 5-star QB cgilmo for a six-figure sum of money. MSU coaches turn me in for improper behavior (well, after they end up losing the recruiting battle 6 weeks later). Would that automatically prevent cgilmo from ever being able to play college football? Some guy you don't even know offers to sell you to a school and you are ineligible? It doesn't make sense, and it isn't the rule.

Also, think about Albert Means. Alabama basically admitted delivering cash for his services (without Means' knowledge). Was Albert Means unable to play football after that? No, he played at Memphis.

 

[cgilmo]

In the Means situation the offending party was a high school football coach. That is a much different scenario than an athletes father. There is no room for discretion here, if the NCAA believes that Cecil Newton was fishing his son he will be declared ineligible.

Auburn will not face any sort of sanctions over this, but they will have to vacate any wins with Newton on the field.

 

[AUTaxMan]

In the Means situation the offending party was a high school football coach. That is a much different scenario than an athletes father. There is no room for discretion here, if the NCAA believes that Cecil Newton was fishing his son he will be declared ineligible.

Auburn will not face any sort of sanctions over this, but they will have to vacate any wins with Newton on the field.

There is no distinction in the rules about who does the fishing. There is no presumption of knowledge because a family member is involved as opposed to a coach. In reality, most of these kids are closer to their coaches than their fathers anyway.

 

[cgilmo]

In the Means situation the offending party was a high school football coach. That is a much different scenario than an athletes father. There is no room for discretion here, if the NCAA believes that Cecil Newton was fishing his son he will be declared ineligible.

Auburn will not face any sort of sanctions over this, but they will have to vacate any wins with Newton on the field.

There is no distinction in the rules about who does the fishing. There is no presumption of knowledge because a family member is involved as opposed to a coach. In reality, most of these kids are closer to their coaches than their fathers anyway.

This is wrong, there is a distinction between family members and outsiders. This is spelled out at compliance meetings when athletes are brought into the system. I have sat through a few of those meetings myself as a former player.

 

[cgilmo]

In the specific case of Cameron Newton though, it looks like this all might be coming to an end.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/pub ... cam+newton

 

[mstng99tim]

In the specific case of Cameron Newton though, it looks like this all might be coming to an end.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/pub ... cam+newton

He was ruled eligible, BUT, if you read between the lines of that last paragraph, the enforcement process investigation is still going on.

 

[kdailey4315]

Might as well just put an ad on Craislist. 5 star QB 200K prefers warm weather. Then just pretend the athlete didn't know. I'm not saying this happened with Newton. I just feel that this decision sets a dangerous precedent.

 

[AUTaxMan]

In the specific case of Cameron Newton though, it looks like this all might be coming to an end.

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/pub ... cam+newton

He was ruled eligible, BUT, if you read between the lines of that last paragraph, the enforcement process investigation is still going on.

They are investigating MSU and Rogers.

 

[AUTaxMan]

Might as well just put an ad on Craislist. 5 star QB 200K prefers warm weather. Then just pretend the athlete didn't know. I'm not saying this happened with Newton. I just feel that this decision sets a dangerous precedent.

On the other hand, if the athlete didn't actually know, should your unilateral action disqualify him?

 

[gt2590]

He was ineligible for like, 14 hours. :lol:

But, the NCAA investigation is still ongoing and could last for up to a year. ::facepalm::

 

[Penno]

Might as well just put an ad on Craislist. 5 star QB 200K prefers warm weather. Then just pretend the athlete didn't know. I'm not saying this happened with Newton. I just feel that this decision sets a dangerous precedent.

On the other hand, if the athlete didn't actually know, should your unilateral action disqualify him?

Not necessarily. However, with Cecil's level of involvement with Cam's recruitment, I'm still kinda surprised by the decision. When Cam gave the power of the decision of which school he would attend to his father, then it seems like they are both one in the same.

 

[wheeler281]

I find it funny that people would actually think Cam did not know lol. Nobody can be that naive. I mean what do people expect him to have written it down somewhere. Classic underhanded agreement with hard evidence. Well played Cameron well played.

 

[AUTaxMan]

I find it funny that people would actually think Cam did not know lol. Nobody can be that naive. I mean what do people expect him to have written it down somewhere. Classic underhanded agreement with hard evidence. Well played Cameron well played.

I think it's pretty naive for people to think they they know more about what happened than the NCAA, who has met with all parties involved and made a decision based on its investigation of the facts.

What hard evidence are you talking about, by the way?