Because you weren't done klling the value of Metal/Valiant..

[Leaf]

I was ashamed to see this thread because BG has always been actively seeking to satisfy what we want to see - taking opinions, feedback, polls, and putting those into action.

25 purple cards (which dont exist anywhere else) of an established player with not that many autos to begin with is not going to kill anything. There are only about 100 Ichiro autos in Valiant anyways.

Print all the prospects on purple and insert them into Rookie Retro, ok maybe you'd have a point as I felt the same way about all the Heritage chrome reprints that are inserted into Topps Chrome. I bought a few boxes of TC this year and during the first box, I was like "Oh cool!!!! We have all these same heritage chrome cards from a few months ago, except these have a TC logo instead of a Heritage logo." Is this really necessary? That truly is a way to water down the product and crank the presses to spread out "hits".

Actually, all the prospects do have purple parallels and are inserted in this product.
One purple card per pack and packs are $225-250. I dont think there should me any massive dilution with /25 parallel.
BG

 

[Jaypers]

edit nvm

 

[Leaf]

Well then there you have it no surprises here although I kinda agree with Jeff here. 2008 is still fresh for alot of us. If he doesnt add products based on these two all should be ok.

Apologies to you, Jeff and anyone else who was expecting a thread in which he announced it in bold, 80-point font.

God knows he knows how to make an announcement. It's no surprise that this came as a surprise to almost all of us.

Have you bought any of his products ever?

Yes, Jeff has bought my products to be fair.
BG

p.s.- Now, on valiant... he did buy some and if I remember right he was complaining even before he opened it!!!!!

 

[Leaf]

I don't see this hurting Leaf or the previous products at all. If pink variations come out on ebay then its a different story.

No, just these purple which were previously announced.
BG

 

[Pinbreaker]

Well then there you have it no surprises here although I kinda agree with Jeff here. 2008 is still fresh for alot of us. If he doesnt add products based on these two all should be ok.

Apologies to you, Jeff and anyone else who was expecting a thread in which he announced it in bold, 80-point font.

God knows he knows how to make an announcement. It's no surprise that this came as a surprise to almost all of us.

Have you bought any of his products ever?

Yes, Jeff has bought my products to be fair.
BG

p.s.- Now, on valiant... he did buy some and if I remember right he was complaining even before he opened it!!!!!

Thanks Brian.. There are so many threads bashing a product and they have never bought a box.. They just see what is online and make a judgement without looking at the quality of the card, how the ink was applied, etc..

I just bought another Leaf Cut today, (someday I'll pull a Campy.. or Gehrig).. But I enjoy busting a few boxes here and there..

Thanks for putting out products that we might not get our money back on (for prospectors).. but are good looking cards.. that could turn into some nice collections down the road..

Also, when is Golf coming out?

 

[matchpenalty]

Nice value add to the product by Leaf. Only on FCB we would find people crying about it. Why FCB is best sports card board on the planet.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

Nice value add to the product by Leaf. Only on FCB we would find people crying about it. Why FCB is best sports card board on the planet.

You miss the point completely. This is hurting two products that Leaf already hurt, that many have spent a lot of money on, with a 3rd product. I don't give a squirt of monkey pee about adding value to a product I'm not going to buy. It's harming products I've spent a lot of money on already.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I don't see this hurting Leaf or the previous products at all. If pink variations come out on ebay then its a different story.

Of course you don't, because it is in your nature to disagree with every single point I ever make. What does it matter if pink variations come out on eBay? The only place 99% of the marketplace will see these purple variations IS ebay.

 

[rico08]

Nice value add to the product by Leaf. Only on FCB we would find people crying about it. Why FCB is best sports card board on the planet.

You miss the point completely. This is hurting two products that Leaf already hurt, that many have spent a lot of money on, with a 3rd product. I don't give a squirt of monkey pee about adding value to a product I'm not going to buy. It's harming products I've spent a lot of money on already.

You held too long.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

....thanks for including those extra Purple ones in Rookie Retro, Leaf.

Makes me wish I hadn't ever told ya'll about the lottery laws that would have doomed your initial Rookie Retro...

Can you please let us know in advance when the Metal Pete Rose, the Metal Leaf Valiant, and the Valiant Leaf Metal Draft will be coming out, and what product they'll be released in, or on their own?

THanks!

There is no need to be a jerk. We stated DAY ONE that purple parallels would be in Rookie Retro.

(1) THERE IS NO METAL PETE ROSE. I KNOW YOU WERE BEING A JERK IN ASKING THIS QUESTION, BUT THERE ARE NO ADDITIONAL ROSE PRODUCTS. He may appear on a Legends checklist at some point though.
(2) After purple parallels, there are no 2011 baseball parallels left and there are no additional plans for 2011 Baseball products. Our next sets will be 2012 SPRING.

BG

p.s.- on your grab bag argument, my counsel does NOT agree with you. However, (1) we believe it adds a LEAF identity to the product, so we will continue the tradition and (2) we honestly dont want to open the door for small time lawyers attempting to create a nuisance should they agree with your position (no major firm would ever take an unlikely to prevail contingency case like this anyways)....

1) You said it in a message thread, unclearly, about Rookie Retro, on this message board only, that the majority of the people who are buying Metal and Valiant never read. You said it ONE time.

2) Funny, in that "conversation we never had" about your lawsuit with Topps, you flat out admitted that your counsel agreed with me on the ROokie Retro grab bag issue... and I believe you've admitted here that you inserted those signatures based on my argument and the advice of counsel... but whatever.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I was ashamed to see this thread because BG has always been actively seeking to satisfy what we want to see - taking opinions, feedback, polls, and putting those into action.

25 purple cards (which dont exist anywhere else) of an established player with not that many autos to begin with is not going to kill anything. There are only about 100 Ichiro autos in Valiant anyways.

Print all the prospects on purple and insert them into Rookie Retro, ok maybe you'd have a point as I felt the same way about all the Heritage chrome reprints that are inserted into Topps Chrome. I bought a few boxes of TC this year and during the first box, I was like "Oh cool!!!! We have all these same heritage chrome cards from a few months ago, except these have a TC logo instead of a Heritage logo." Is this really necessary? That truly is a way to water down the product and crank the presses to spread out "hits".

Actually, all the prospects do have purple parallels and are inserted in this product.
One purple card per pack and packs are $225-250. I dont think there should me any massive dilution with /25 parallel.
BG

REally? You don't think another /25 parallel hurts the value of the Blue Metal /25 cards or the Orange /25 Valiants? REALLY? What dream world are you living in, Brian?

 

[Leaf]

Jeff-
If you think that /25 purple is going to "kill" these sets, I think you should star collecting "Precious Moments", "Hummels" or "Hallmark Ornaments"...
This hobby just isnt for you...

The future of these sets squarely rests on the vats, gloves and arms of the players included. I made them short print (and attractive) enough, now its on them.
BG

 

[blanning71]

YES! Another Leaf thread! Fantastic!

 

[Bob Loblaw]

I don't see this hurting Leaf or the previous products at all. If pink variations come out on ebay then its a different story.

No, just these purple which were previously announced.
BG

One time.

On a thread not remotely about Valiant.

In an unclear manner.

On a message board.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

Well then there you have it no surprises here although I kinda agree with Jeff here. 2008 is still fresh for alot of us. If he doesnt add products based on these two all should be ok.

Apologies to you, Jeff and anyone else who was expecting a thread in which he announced it in bold, 80-point font.

God knows he knows how to make an announcement. It's no surprise that this came as a surprise to almost all of us.

Have you bought any of his products ever?

Yes, Jeff has bought my products to be fair.
BG

p.s.- Now, on valiant... he did buy some and if I remember right he was complaining even before he opened it!!!!!

I bought a box of Leaf Metal Draft. I won a second box, Ironically, in AIC's draw. So I got 2 for $90. I didn't get $90 value out of both boxes. I've bought cards on the secondary market.

I bought a box of Valiant. Got it, opened it. Didn't like it. At all. That's when I started "complaining" about the 2nd box I had already purchased before the first box in AIC's live break. My complaints were a criticism of the product and the fact that I didn't like it. Now, AIC couldn't be more of a stand up guy, he offered me a refund without me even asking. But, because I knew if I did get a refund, I'd get the 1/1 Ichiro in my slot. So, I took the break, and from what I saw in the break, I like the stuff even less than I did on my own break. I won't buy any more Valiant boxes at $100 per.

HOwever, again, Ive bought cards on the secondary market.

 

[Leaf]

[quote="Bob Loblaw":1m22qahq]....thanks for including those extra Purple ones in Rookie Retro, Leaf.

Makes me wish I hadn't ever told ya'll about the lottery laws that would have doomed your initial Rookie Retro...

Can you please let us know in advance when the Metal Pete Rose, the Metal Leaf Valiant, and the Valiant Leaf Metal Draft will be coming out, and what product they'll be released in, or on their own?

THanks!

There is no need to be a jerk. We stated DAY ONE that purple parallels would be in Rookie Retro.

(1) THERE IS NO METAL PETE ROSE. I KNOW YOU WERE BEING A JERK IN ASKING THIS QUESTION, BUT THERE ARE NO ADDITIONAL ROSE PRODUCTS. He may appear on a Legends checklist at some point though.
(2) After purple parallels, there are no 2011 baseball parallels left and there are no additional plans for 2011 Baseball products. Our next sets will be 2012 SPRING.

BG

p.s.- on your grab bag argument, my counsel does NOT agree with you. However, (1) we believe it adds a LEAF identity to the product, so we will continue the tradition and (2) we honestly dont want to open the door for small time lawyers attempting to create a nuisance should they agree with your position (no major firm would ever take an unlikely to prevail contingency case like this anyways)....

1) You said it in a message thread, unclearly, about Rookie Retro, on this message board only, that the majority of the people who are buying Metal and Valiant never read. You said it ONE time.

2) Funny, in that "conversation we never had" about your lawsuit with Topps, you flat out admitted that your counsel agreed with me on the ROokie Retro grab bag issue... and I believe you've admitted here that you inserted those signatures based on my argument and the advice of counsel... but whatever.[/quote:1m22qahq]

1> we also emailed out to all our direct accounts the initial information which indicated the same.

2> No, they never "agreed".... They thought it would be wise as we could very well have a greed driven party attempt to sue which clearly doesnt come free (even if/when we are proven right)..

Jeff...
At the end of the day, you dont have to like our products (or me for that matter). However, I am still looking for posts where you state the positives you see in our products...
Until then, its hard to consider it a balanced evaulation of our products...BG

 

[Leaf]

I was ashamed to see this thread because BG has always been actively seeking to satisfy what we want to see - taking opinions, feedback, polls, and putting those into action.

25 purple cards (which dont exist anywhere else) of an established player with not that many autos to begin with is not going to kill anything. There are only about 100 Ichiro autos in Valiant anyways.

Print all the prospects on purple and insert them into Rookie Retro, ok maybe you'd have a point as I felt the same way about all the Heritage chrome reprints that are inserted into Topps Chrome. I bought a few boxes of TC this year and during the first box, I was like "Oh cool!!!! We have all these same heritage chrome cards from a few months ago, except these have a TC logo instead of a Heritage logo." Is this really necessary? That truly is a way to water down the product and crank the presses to spread out "hits".

Actually, all the prospects do have purple parallels and are inserted in this product.
One purple card per pack and packs are $225-250. I dont think there should me any massive dilution with /25 parallel.
BG

REally? You don't think another /25 parallel hurts the value of the Blue Metal /25 cards or the Orange /25 Valiants? REALLY? What dream world are you living in, Brian?

I live in the hobby with a long term horizon, not the 20 second rip and flip mentaility prevalent in the hobby today...
In the long run, the value is 100% player driven...
Each guy signed roughly 475 cards for the set and another 25 purple.... the 25 purple will not move the needle significantly.
BG

 

[Jaypers]

We are talking about three distinct products with completely different SRP's per pack and the third one with a different target audience from the other two.

I could see a third parallel #d to 25 hurting the other two if it was included within a product that was prospect-based and had a SRP similiar to one of the others, but it does not.

Therefore, this thread is making a mountain out of a molehill, in my opinion.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

Jeff-
If you think that /25 purple is going to "kill" these sets, I think you should star collecting "Precious Moments", "Hummels" or "Hallmark Ornaments"...
This hobby just isnt for you...

The future of these sets squarely rests on the vats, gloves and arms of the players included. I made them short print (and attractive) enough, now its on them.
BG

No, Brian, your products aren't for me. When I buy a Bowman Chrome box, and whether I pull a Brody Colvin Chrome autograph or a Orange Refractor Bryce Harper autograph, I know DAMN well that the ONLY Colvin/Harper autographs with that picture and that border are in BOWMAN CHROME packs. I know that there won't be Purple or Green Refractor Autos in Topps Heritage or Topps American Pie or Topps Tier One or Topps Marquee.

For you to stand there and say that the value of the already serialized /25 cards won't be affect by putting another /25 parallel out there is spitting in the face of every collector who has given you a dime.

I may still buy your single cards on the open market because I can make some money from them - to not do so is to cut off my nose to spite my face - but this is the last time I'm buying any Leaf unopened product. Period.

And if you just want to take my comment and blow me off, fine. I had already been talking with B/O about buying 3-4 cases of Leaf Metal. Not anymore. And judging from the fact that I've gotten 4 more "thanks" since I posted this... I don't think I'm alone.

 

[Leaf]

I don't see this hurting Leaf or the previous products at all. If pink variations come out on ebay then its a different story.

No, just these purple which were previously announced.
BG

One time.

On a thread not remotely about Valiant.

In an unclear manner.

On a message board.

Honestly, it doesnt matter whether I told YOU or not.
The fact is, the cards are made. If you dont like it, dont buy the product. Its so easy, vote with your wallet.
BG

p.s.- how ya like the retail parallels of chrome refractors... They never tell you about that on the sell sheet for hobby,...
But again, your a LEAF troll... no one expects you to start a thread, "BECAUSE TOPPS ISNT DONE KILLING REFRACTORS IN 2011 BOWMAN CHROME"...