Is Leaf/Brian Gray going to get Johnny Manziel kicked out of NCAA football

[sportscardtheory]

Manziel autograph trading cards cause stir - Sports Business News, Analysis - Dollars Blog - ESPN Playbook - ESPN

"A Texas-based trading card company caused a stir on Wednesday when it announced that a high-profile redemption card already inserted in packs of two of its football sets could be redeemed for an autographed Johnny Manziel card.

The company, Leaf Trading Cards, maintains that the company is doing nothing illegal and won't compromise Manziel's eligibility."

Now;

[FONT=verdana, helvetica, arial, sans-serif]"[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif, Verdana]ESPN reports the NCAA is investigating Texas A&M redshirt sophomore QB Johnny Manziel for allegedly profiting from autographs.[/FONT]

"Two sources tell "Outside the Lines" that the Texas A&M quarterback agreed to sign memorabilia in exchange for a five-figure flat fee during his trip to Miami for the BCS National Championship Game," ESPN's Darren Rovell writes. "Both sources said they witnessed the signing, though neither saw the actual exchange of money." If the NCAA investigation finds that Manziel has violated NCAA Bylaws, which involves accepting money for promoting or advertising the commercial sale of a product or service, he could be ruled ineligible. This is not positive news, but more information should surface in the near future. Texas A&M opens camp on Monday."

WOW.

 

[matfanofold]

Unless LEAF directly compensated Johnny and/or his family, I can not see how he is responsible. If we are talking morally, then all but the most obtuse individuals would not know that the bulk auto's had a reasonable chance of being 'paid for' memorabilia that could/would compromise his (Manziel) standing. To this end, I am sure BG did not care either way and simply capitalized on the opportunity at hand.

More to the point directly, LEAF (BG) acted as a cog in the wheel that creates a avenue for NCAA players (like Manziel) to be swayed by the financial gain. No avenue to sell ones auto = no rules broken. However, I acknowledge no rules are broken on any buyers part (such as Brian Gray)and all unjust ramification falls on Manziel, but moral responsibility here needs to be assumed as wide spread to varying degrees. Anyone who was buying these bulk signings of Manziel, weither it be second or third party removed, MUST have known there was a good chance he (Manziel) was profiting off of this.

And for a third time, ONLY Manziel can bear legal responsibility if allegations are true, but at what point down the line of profiting off of this does one think they are free from moral responsibility to the situation? At what point does one feel free of involvement in creating/harboring the situation to fruition? I suppose that point is the point of profit for most. I certainly do not hold it against BG for trying to make some coin, but awarding bonus points to BG for keeping his distance from a otherwise (possible) tainted situation is obviously not going to happen.

And to reiterate a final point...

ANYONE buying these bulk autographs for resale had to at least wonder/know they may have been obtained as an illegal profiteering measure for Manziel, and obviously did not care.

 

[tikitomoka]

it wasn't just Brian who paid him.

 

[deceptikon1978]

Unless LEAF directly compensated Johnny and/or his family, I can not see how he is responsible. If we are talking morally, then all but the most obtuse individuals would not know that the bulk auto's had a reasonable chance of being 'paid for' memorabilia that could/would compromise his (Manziel) standing. To this end, I am sure BG did not care either way and simply capitalized on the opportunity at hand.

More to the point directly, LEAF (BG) acted as a cog in the wheel that creates a avenue for NCAA players (like Manziel) to be swayed by the financial gain. No avenue to sell ones auto = no rules broken. However, I acknowledge no rules are broken on any buyers part (such as Brian Gray)and all unjust ramification falls on Manziel, but moral responsibility here needs to be assumed as wide spread to varying degrees. Anyone who was buying these bulk signings of Manziel, weither it be second or third party removed, MUST have known there was a good chance he (Manziel) was profiting off of this.

And for a third time, ONLY Manziel can bear legal responsibility if allegations are true, but at what point down the line of profiting off of this does one think they are free from moral responsibility to the situation? At what point does one feel free of involvement in creating/harboring the situation to fruition? I suppose that point is the point of profit for most. I certainly do not hold it against BG for trying to make some coin, but awarding bonus points to BG for keeping his distance from a otherwise (possible) tainted situation is obviously not going to happen.

And to reiterate a final point...

ANYONE buying these bulk autographs for resale had to at least wonder/know they may have been obtained as an illegal profiteering measure for Manziel, and obviously did not care.

You say so much without really saying anything at all.

I'd be curious to find out if BG got his Manziel cuts from Tieman, who OTL said was the one who paid Manziel.

 

[matfanofold]

You say so much without really saying anything at all.

I'd be curious to find out if BG got his Manziel cuts from Tieman, who OTL said was the one who paid Manziel.

Upon first glance perhaps, but it was more to spur introspect and question in ones own opinion(s), then it was to make deliberate and outright claims or points. Hopefully others will understand.

 

[gt2590]

I know ALL publicity, even bad, is supposed to be good for business, but I'd bet the headaches/calls/extra expenses BG has had to deal with from this whole "Mystery Redemption" mess are NOT worth it...

 

[wheeler281]

and UD swaps out patches on 1/1's without syaing it was worn or not. Who really cares at this point

Also who is the bad cop in this thread

 

[MansGame]

There is like 5 threads on this topic lol

It's all over sportscenter as well

I think nothing will come from it personally.

I've said this in similar threads but I love how on the product release and sell sheet Leaf has to site the first amendment rights :lol:


---
Looking for Albert Belle cards! PM me!

 

[gt2590]

I think nothing will come from it personally.

Well, I gotta disagree with this one.

IF, as alleged, JM did sign all that stuff for profit and was Dumb enough to do it in front of rooms of people, then all he is doing is give the NCAA the ammunution they need for an Attack.

They hate it when an athlete one-ups them or tries to beat them and they will go extra hard on this one. No matter what happens with their paying athletes or not, IF they got him on this one, they'll go at him full-force and he'll be playing in Manitoba this fall.

Remember, it's called the National Committee Against Athletes for a reason...

 

[MansGame]

Him signing items is not against rules... it's been clearly documented that no money was exchanged "in the room" and no people "in the room" saw money exchanged. I'm only going off what I've heard and know... Clearly I'm not part of the investigation, so from what I know so far, I wouldn't be surprised.

NOW if they some how get him to turn over bank records and see a large sum of money in his account, maybe then he is screwed but best believe he comes from money and odds are it's already covered up by this point.

Again, I wouldn't be surprised if JM gets away from this as well...

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Leaf/Brian Gray and the miniscule number of Manziel autographs that Leaf released will have zero effect on the NCAA investigation, it's all but irrelevant.

The huge smoking gun? PSA and JSA receiving multiple hundred plus quantity bulk submissions. That is the glaring issue at hand. And clearly PSA and JSA appear to be working with the investigation or at least talking to someone for these submissions to be leaked.

Where there's smoke, there's typically fire...and good old "Johnny Football" has brought it all on by himself. Good for him. The dollar figures here dwarf in comparison to other issues in the past for memorabilia/autograph deals.

He better hope he gets to keep his Heisman, as he may not get much more of a college career.

 

[Leaf]

I would like to say the following: I have never met, spoken to, seen in person, talked to, done business with or thought about in any capacity this Telian guy I see on ESPN's website. I also have never met, spoken to, seen in person, done business with or talked to Johnny Manziel in any capacity. I have however seen Johnny Manziel play football in televised games (and on ESPN sports center). Once again, we acquired our small number of signatures used in products on the secondary market. BG

 

[Leaf]

it wasn't just Brian who paid him.

I would ask that you edit this post as it contains false information inferring we paid a kid, which Leaf has not and will not ever do while a kid is eligible. BG

 

[sportscardtheory]

I would like to say the following: I have never met, spoken to, seen in person, talked to, done business with or thought about in any capacity this Telian guy I see on ESPN's website. I also have never met, spoken to, seen in person, done business with or talked to Johnny Manziel in any capacity. I have however seen Johnny Manziel play football in televised games (and on ESPN sports center). Once again, we acquired our small number of signatures used in products on the secondary market. BG

Thanks for responding, Brian. I will believe you unless shown proof otherwise. Regardless of the details in your dealings with Manziel autos, he's clearly not very bright off the field and is bringing this all on himself.

 

[MeteoriteGuy]

I've said this in similar threads but I love how on the product release and sell sheet Leaf has to site the first amendment rights :lol:

I saw that also, and was wondering, how does this have anything to do with the first amendment?

 

[bcubs]

I think the NCAA rule is dumb and the kids should be able to sign autographs for cash. Sign for free and everyone can go peddle your stuff on Ebay and make big coin, but take a few bucks for doing it and you've suddenly thrown the world off its axis. I can't be the only one who thinks this is stupid.

 

[MansGame]

I think the NCAA rule is dumb and the kids should be able to sign autographs for cash. Sign for free and everyone can go peddle your stuff on Ebay and make big coin, but take a few bucks for doing it and you've suddenly thrown the world off its axis. I can't be the only one who thinks this is stupid.

What a great business to be in though as a broker these "kids" are giving autographs for LOL... they get all their product for free and then go sell it... I'm sure there is always stuff on the side or some sort of unspoken rules of payback after they graduate into the majors or whatever but god...

 

[nappyd]

I think the NCAA rule is dumb and the kids should be able to sign autographs for cash. Sign for free and everyone can go peddle your stuff on Ebay and make big coin, but take a few bucks for doing it and you've suddenly thrown the world off its axis. I can't be the only one who thinks this is stupid.

At the postseason all star games kids sign a lot of items, wouldn't that already violate their amateur status before they even sign a loi?

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[MeteoriteGuy]

At the postseason all star games kids sign a lot of items, wouldn't that already violate their amateur status before they even sign a loi?

No rule against signing autographs. They just cant make money off it (yet the college or NCAA can). Although, they are allowed to have low paying jobs. So maybe you could hire one as an actual job to sign autographs, if you paid them minimum wage. I don't think anyone has tried that yet.

They should pay the starter players $12,000-15,000 a year, and maybe $8,000-10,000 for non-starters. That would only leave 80-90% of the money still on the table for the university.

 

[MansGame]

No rule against signing autographs. They just cant make money off it (yet the college or NCAA can). Although, they are allowed to have low paying jobs. So maybe you could hire one as an actual job to sign autographs, if you paid them minimum wage. I don't think anyone has tried that yet.

They should pay the starter players $12,000-15,000 a year, and maybe $8,000-10,000 for non-starters. That would only leave 80-90% of the money still on the table for the university.

So you think they should just pay all college players a salary? Your proposed salaries are less than what they already get in scholarships; I'm sure you took that into consideration right? So you want salary over/above what some get in free tuition, etc. or to replace it? I think this is a much bigger conversation and one that is probably for another thread :lol: