More UD Carnage, the loss of USA Baseball

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Come the end of this year...I'll take a stab that Upper Deck is done. By the end of 2011 at the latest.

Seriously.

 

[bballcardkid]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

 

[Jaypers]

Am I the only one chomping at the bit to get TopProspectAlert's and Docsilvey's reactions?

 

[sdsportsfan1214]

Come the end of this year...I'll take a stab that Upper Deck is done. By the end of 2011 at the latest.

Seriously.

Bring on the Upper Deck firesale!!!!

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

Upper Deck used the USA license to make rookie cards...not increase the value of the USA Baseball brand. USA Baseball doesn't (nor should they) care about scarcity. And if anyone on this board seriously thinks that Upper Deck increased the visibility of USA Baseball nationally...well...you're wrong.

And for those who think Topps will water down the USA brand, could they do so any more than Upper Deck? Upper Deck was inserting USA cards in virtually every product, so let's not get too carried away here.

This decision was only a matter of time, and makes perfect sense. If MLBP is locked up with Topps across the board...USA Baseball would almost have to follow suit.

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Come the end of this year...I'll take a stab that Upper Deck is done. By the end of 2011 at the latest.

Seriously.

Bring on the Upper Deck firesale!!!!

That firesale will be going to the creditors.

 

[bmc398]

Come the end of this year...I'll take a stab that Upper Deck is done. By the end of 2011 at the latest.

Seriously.

Bring on the Upper Deck firesale!!!!

Any guess to how fast 2007 APs, MJ and Tiger autos and other high $$$ things start flying out the backdoor?

 

[jcmint]

I agree here. Topps will find a way to screw this up.

So, now that Bowman will have USA cards (Harper), who here will be increasing their order?

this probably isn't gonna hapen

 

[goldenegg1]

Upper Deck will not be going out of business for awhile.
I know you guys focus heavily on baseball, but these guys are still making quality Football products and amazing Hockey products.
They also have the exclusive rights to Hockey. With guys like Crosby and Ovechkin, they are able to drive the sales of Hockey products, not to mention guys like Gretzky and Howe that are in their products as well. In fact, I am starting to bust more Hockey than I ever have, due to the fact that Hockey rookie cards sell ridiculously on ebay! I can honestly say that since I've opened more Hockey, I have more income coming in from sales on my Hockey cards that I can open more baseball boxes.

 

[notjomommasclint]

since the cards are about likeness of the player not the logo upper deck and panini will keep this from becoming a monopoly! the term for this situation is an oligopoly.

 

[bballcardkid]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

Upper Deck used the USA license to make rookie cards...not increase the value of the USA Baseball brand. USA Baseball doesn't (nor should they) care about scarcity. And if anyone on this board seriously thinks that Upper Deck increased the visibility of USA Baseball nationally...well...you're wrong.

And for those who think Topps will water down the USA brand, could they do so any more than Upper Deck? Upper Deck was inserting USA cards in virtually every product, so let's not get too carried away here.

This decision was only a matter of time, and makes perfect sense. If MLBP is locked up with Topps across the board...USA Baseball would almost have to follow suit.

First bold-and what is the problem with that?

Second bold-WBC anyone?

 

[mredsox89]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

Upper Deck used the USA license to make rookie cards...not increase the value of the USA Baseball brand. USA Baseball doesn't (nor should they) care about scarcity. And if anyone on this board seriously thinks that Upper Deck increased the visibility of USA Baseball nationally...well...you're wrong.

And for those who think Topps will water down the USA brand, could they do so any more than Upper Deck? Upper Deck was inserting USA cards in virtually every product, so let's not get too carried away here.

This decision was only a matter of time, and makes perfect sense. If MLBP is locked up with Topps across the board...USA Baseball would almost have to follow suit.

First bold-and what is the problem with that?

Second bold-WBC anyone?

I think random USA cards have significantly more profit potential than WBC cards, even if they are produced at the same rate. Most of the WBC cards Topps watered down its products with were guys that were never going to play in the majors, or even in the US at all. The USA guys will almost all either go to college or get drafted out of HS, and you have 4+ years for them to spike

 

[bballcardkid]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

Upper Deck used the USA license to make rookie cards...not increase the value of the USA Baseball brand. USA Baseball doesn't (nor should they) care about scarcity. And if anyone on this board seriously thinks that Upper Deck increased the visibility of USA Baseball nationally...well...you're wrong.

And for those who think Topps will water down the USA brand, could they do so any more than Upper Deck? Upper Deck was inserting USA cards in virtually every product, so let's not get too carried away here.

This decision was only a matter of time, and makes perfect sense. If MLBP is locked up with Topps across the board...USA Baseball would almost have to follow suit.

First bold-and what is the problem with that?

Second bold-WBC anyone?

I think random USA cards have significantly more profit potential than WBC cards, even if they are produced at the same rate. Most of the WBC cards Topps watered down its products with were guys that were never going to play in the majors, or even in the US at all. The USA guys will almost all either go to college or get drafted out of HS, and you have 4+ years for them to spike

But still, speaking of pure numbers, Topps significantly flooded the market with WBC cards compared to UD with USA. I'm just pointing out that I believe Topps can do worse than Upper Deck.

 

[mredsox89]

And the USA cards just became a little more unpopular ::facepalm:: . Seriously, scarcity is what made these cards attractive. Throw that out the window now.

Upper Deck used the USA license to make rookie cards...not increase the value of the USA Baseball brand. USA Baseball doesn't (nor should they) care about scarcity. And if anyone on this board seriously thinks that Upper Deck increased the visibility of USA Baseball nationally...well...you're wrong.

And for those who think Topps will water down the USA brand, could they do so any more than Upper Deck? Upper Deck was inserting USA cards in virtually every product, so let's not get too carried away here.

This decision was only a matter of time, and makes perfect sense. If MLBP is locked up with Topps across the board...USA Baseball would almost have to follow suit.

First bold-and what is the problem with that?

Second bold-WBC anyone?

I think random USA cards have significantly more profit potential than WBC cards, even if they are produced at the same rate. Most of the WBC cards Topps watered down its products with were guys that were never going to play in the majors, or even in the US at all. The USA guys will almost all either go to college or get drafted out of HS, and you have 4+ years for them to spike

But still, speaking of pure numbers, Topps significantly flooded the market with WBC cards compared to UD with USA. I'm just pointing out that I believe Topps can do worse than Upper Deck.

Yea, that makes sense. Personally, I would rather have even more watered down USA cards than the currently watered down WBC cards

 

[Sean_C]

I'm sure that the +$2M that UD owed MLB Properties from 2009 is just a sign of how well they are doing, right?

They lost basketball, where their 2 biggest names are (Jordan, LeBron).
They lost baseball, the biggest cash cow in terms of market share
I'm guessing they haven't be selling many Tiger Woods autographs as of late.
The Yu-Gi-Oh lawsuit certainly was a black eye on their reputation.

The hall of mirrors that was UD will be shattering soon enough.

Upper Deck will not be going out of business for awhile.
I know you guys focus heavily on baseball, but these guys are still making quality Football products and amazing Hockey products.
They also have the exclusive rights to Hockey. With guys like Crosby and Ovechkin, they are able to drive the sales of Hockey products, not to mention guys like Gretzky and Howe that are in their products as well. In fact, I am starting to bust more Hockey than I ever have, due to the fact that Hockey rookie cards sell ridiculously on ebay! I can honestly say that since I've opened more Hockey, I have more income coming in from sales on my Hockey cards that I can open more baseball boxes.

 

[Mudcatsfan]

Almost fell off my chair, LOL.

To be fair, many people HERE might know and care who many of these guys are, or at least seem to.

But maybe in four years regular collectors will come to know one or two of all these guys, but proably not really care. By that time the people on these boards who cared about these guys initially...will not care about them anymore either.

Very true. Most people have never heard of, and would have no interest in autographed pre-rookie cards of:

Todd Helton
Alex Rodriguez
Barry Bonds
Kevin Brown
Ryan Howard
Jeff Francoeur
Troy Tulowitski
Mark McGwire
Chris Carpenter
Roger Clemens
Will Clark
Jim Abbott
Nomar Garciapara
Evan Longoria
Tino Martinez
Mike Musina
John Olerud
Jake Peavy
Dustin Pedroia
Carlos Quentin
John Smoltz
Huston Street
Mark Texeira
Frank Thomas
Mo Vaughn
Robin Ventura
Justin Verlander
Matt Williams
Ryan Zimmerman

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

Exactly my point. Even if these cards all existed that would be about one player a year, a third of whom are destined for relative oblivion, many of the others would have had releases in other products (hey UD). But most of your big dogs weren't even made.

And most of the people who buy into them when released will not have their cards four years later...

And I'd love to see your Bonds, Arod, Thomas etc. USA (autographed or otherwise) pre-rookie cards :lol:

Almost fell off my chair, LOL.

To be fair, many people HERE might know and care who many of these guys are, or at least seem to.

But maybe in four years regular collectors will come to know one or two of all these guys, but proably not really care. By that time the people on these boards who cared about these guys initially...will not care about them anymore either.

Very true. Most people have never heard of, and would have no interest in autographed pre-rookie cards of:

Todd Helton
Alex Rodriguez
Barry Bonds
Kevin Brown
Ryan Howard
Jeff Francoeur
Troy Tulowitski
Mark McGwire
Chris Carpenter
Roger Clemens
Will Clark
Jim Abbott
Nomar Garciapara
Evan Longoria
Tino Martinez
Mike Musina
John Olerud
Jake Peavy
Dustin Pedroia
Carlos Quentin
John Smoltz
Huston Street
Mark Texeira
Frank Thomas
Mo Vaughn
Robin Ventura
Justin Verlander
Matt Williams
Ryan Zimmerman

 

[topprospectalert]

Since my opinion was asked for here it is. I think the it will be about the same as it is now. Upper Deck flooded the market with USA's in non-USA sets (sweet spot, ud series 2, timelines, etc) in the last couple years. So if/when Topps floods the market like they did with the WBC cards, its not going to be that much different then what upper deck has done. Boxed set wise which is all I have ever bought, if the price point lowers and the number and uniqueness of autographs stays the same that would be a plus, but I would expect Topps to dumb the box set down to 1 or 2 autos and a jersey per box. Thus making that product crappy. So overall at first glance I would expect it to hurt the USA box sets, but possibly as discussed here before earlier in this thread would add value to products such as chrome/sterling etc and those cards would be a better long term investment autograph wise due to their inclusion in the mainstream chrome sets. It further drives the dagger into the death of upper deck.

 

[goldenegg1]

According to their facebook page, they've settled the lawsuit and are happy with outcome. I hope they just focus on legends projects now.

 

[ChasHawk]

According to their facebook page, they've settled the lawsuit and are happy with outcome. I hope they just focus on legends projects now.

Like how?