My FCG BGS Submission Experience....

[cgilmo]

Wtf does "burned your check" mean? I doubt you're getting scammed here, just an unfortunate issue in such a massive order.

Stole my thunder, I'm not sure what that even means... please clarify

Actually you would have to get an answer from Chris to completely clarify. I assume he means he burns his trash and ended up trashing my check in error and it burned.

I simply did not see the check in the packing material.


Thus when the bubble mailers and boxes were disposed of, they were burned.

 

[AndruwHRJones]

sigh


was there every really any need for this to be public?


There were a couple of gliches, and one is his andruw jones /25 card


its at bgs right now, it isn't lost


no cards are lost


at this point my reaction is simply "whatever"


all this "i hope this doesn't get me banned" talk irks me as well because I haven't banned anyone for speaking out, ever.

I have banned for trolling, never for someone complaining about me or a staff member.


as justin said, there is a learning curve here and the first time wasn't perfect. Please do not judge the FCB submissions on the first one. Lessons learned in this first submission have already been applied to the current one that we already have about 200 cards for. See the BGS Group sub forum at the bottom of the hobby talk section for details.

Nothing I mentioned was untrue, so I don't see why it is a big deal to express my concerns. I feel others should be aware of my experience before deciding to send their cards out. While my experience may not be the norm or even a sign of things to come, I am disappointed with how this whole situation went down.

I still don't understand why I am just now being told my card was not sent with the original group. Why did I have to ask about it before I received an answer. I would have thought that once you realized your error, you would have contacted the owner(me) and explained the situation. Had I received an explanation before I went looking for the answer, I probably would not have been as disappointed. The same goes for my burned check, why did I have to contact you regarding this? Did you not know who was paid in full and who were not? I just feel you very unorganized during this whole process and I definately would not feel comfortable sending my cards through you again. That is just my take, it would not be worth the gamble in my eyes.

 

[cgilmo]

the first sub was unorganized

anyone can see that


I only have a certain window of time to handle issues with the sub. This is why you may feel like I did not give you the personal attention you require. I am sorry, but that is just the way it went down. That is the explanation I gave you, and quite frankly it will have to do. You aren't the only one who had issues with the sub process. Others had issues too, but they PM'd me about them and their issues have been resolved or are close to being resolved. Not only have I resolved their issues, I have also taken steps to insure that they do not repeat on future subs.

The check issue for instance, now paypal is the only way to pay. It is far too easy to not see a check in the bottom of a box filled with packing peanuts, especially when I am not looking for one.

You posting this thread here puts off the perception that our BGS process is completely borked, and that it shouldn't be trusted. I am very concerned with perception and would like people to know that the vast majority of bulk sub participants were happy with the end result as is evident by the threads of people posting scans of their cards.

 

[The_ReverendAct2]

I too was initially impatient until I saw how many cards were sent in the submission. For the price I was willing to roll the dice and I eventually got my order and the one issue that I had I pm'd Chris and he was apologetic and is or has taken care of it. I will be participating in future submission, possibly even the one in May if I can get it together by Friday. If I participate in this one or future ones everything will be serial numbered to keep down confusion because I know there are those who will wonder if their BGS 9 was really the card they sent in if not serial numbered. It's just human nature.

Great job Chris and the FCB staff. You go above and beyond the call of duty to make OUR site the best in the industry.

 

[cgilmo]

rev, today is the deadline for the may sub it's june for you


we kept track of non serial numbered cards by dividing them up into different orders.

 

[jdacunha]

Chris had a lot on his plate and did a great job with a 600+ card submission. I received 3 cards that were not mine and I have sent 2 of the 3 to their rightful owners. I am just waiting on the address of 1 last card. It is not the one you mentioned.

I am sure Chris or the member who received your card will send it out. Maybe I an naive but, I thing most of the members on here are honest and will work with everyone so each member gets his cards.

 

[The_ReverendAct2]

rev, today is the deadline for the may sub it's june for you


we kept track of non serial numbered cards by dividing them up into different orders.

june was my intention, since most will be schaub cards. will be cool if the hanson arrives right be4 call up and he pitches a gem. should make my submission fees back on that 1 card.

 

[phillyfan0417]

No good deed goes unpunished.



600 cards from many different people and it was the first time and some mistakes happened. Chris took on something 99.9 percent of the folks on here would never have done and I guess there are those who feel a public flogging is in order because it wasnt perfect.


You're intention wasnt to tell the "truth", your intention was a calling him out. The idea you would even mention the fear of being scammed on ANDRUW JONES cards is actually laughable. I think there would be about 575 cards I'd scam first from that sub.

 

[The_ReverendAct2]

No good deed goes unpunished.



600 cards from many different people and it was the first time and some mistakes happened. Chris took on something 99.9 percent of the folks on here would never have done and I guess there are those who feel a public flogging is in order because it wasnt perfect.


You're intention wasnt to tell the "truth", your intention was a calling him out. The idea you would even mention the fear of being scammed on ANDRUW JONES cards is actually laughable. I think there would be about 575 cards I'd scam first from that sub.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

That is why I pm'd Chris about my issue because I did not want it to come across as calling him out. So Chris, will the subsequent submission have an unwritten rule that certain people will not be allowed to submit?

At 5.50-6.50 for however many days it took my cards to arrive it was worth it. Wish I had not missed that corner issue on the one Blue Hodges, but grading a COntenders Gordon Beckham and getting a GEM MINT on it makes the profits from the eventual sell even more sweet.

 

[Philip J. Fry]

No good deed goes unpunished.



600 cards from many different people and it was the first time and some mistakes happened. Chris took on something 99.9 percent of the folks on here would never have done and I guess there are those who feel a public flogging is in order because it wasnt perfect.


You're intention wasnt to tell the "truth", your intention was a calling him out. The idea you would even mention the fear of being scammed on ANDRUW JONES cards is actually laughable. I think there would be about 575 cards I'd scam first from that sub.

Agreed 100%. I'm lucky that I'm the only Tony Clark collector on the board (the world maybe?) and so none of my cards were sent to the wrong person. Also, looking back at my blog, I sent my cards out around March 15 and received them back around May 15. Am I complaining about the time? Hell no. I trust Chris 100% with my cards and if I thought for a second that he would mishandle my submission, well, I wouldn't send the cards to him in the first place.

Maybe it's because I don't need the cards back in a hurry or that I need to flip them before my player cools down, but 2 months time (shipping to Chris, waiting on the deadline for cards to arrive to him, logging the cards for Beckett, packaging and shipping to them, 20 business days for grading, shipping back to Chris, sorting out, packaging, shipping back to collectors) isn't too hard to imagine.

Don't forget all the people (me included) asking Chris about what their cards graded, asking for BGS serial #s, constant complaining that their cards weren't in the hands by a certain date, etc. caused him to get behind. Plus, he has a full time job on top of all that. So next time you feel like calling someone out, remember all that Chris has to do and maybe think for a second that you're lucky Chris is able to offer a great deal on submitting cards. It won't be too hard for him to say **** it and then we're forced to wait for BGS specials and piggyback on someone else's submission.

 

[muchuckwagon]

I have coordinated large group orders in the past. The key is to establish rules and deadlines....clearly communicated deadlines. If you miss the deadline, your cards don't make it into the order. It seems harsh but it is only fair to the ENTIRE group cards go out in a timely manner. My large group orders have gone very smoothly in the past because I set and stuck with a schedule.

You also need to set an expectation that cards will start to ship out "X" days after being received from BGS and the shipping process will last approximately a total of "Y" days. It goes without saying but packages need to be audited every step of the process....that way, nothing gets lost in the wash.

Big picture, there is a disconnect in group orders. When you send in cards, you have to keep in mind the person running the order is not doing so for a profit. So you can't demand a high level of customer service and a quick/proactive response to issues. You are dealing with an individual not a company with extensive resources to handle customer issues.

Plus, there are 20 - 30 other people constantly pinging the person running the project with "silly" questions that unnecessarily burn time and delay the research and response to the real issues...such as, my card is missing. This is amplified when you fail to clearly lay out the expectations before starting the process.

Long and short...it is clear from the comments posted over the past few weeks the group order didn't go as smooth as planned. However, I am sure at the end of the day....everyone will have their cards returned. While the OP should have discussed the issue in private with Chris....he or she does have the right to share their experience. On the other hand, I'm sure Chris will make the necessary changes to ensure the next order is run in a more orderly fashion....there is a learning curve.

 

[mchenrycards]

No good deed goes unpunished.



600 cards from many different people and it was the first time and some mistakes happened. Chris took on something 99.9 percent of the folks on here would never have done and I guess there are those who feel a public flogging is in order because it wasnt perfect.


You're intention wasnt to tell the "truth", your intention was a calling him out. The idea you would even mention the fear of being scammed on ANDRUW JONES cards is actually laughable. I think there would be about 575 cards I'd scam first from that sub.

I think to jump all over this poster and point fingers at him is what is laughable. I understand his point in that these are cards that are something he has collected and are special to him. I understand his feelings and anyone that does not...well put yourself in his place and think about how you would feel.

With that said, Chris and I have gone round and round on a few points from this sub. We have traded PM's and posts in the now closed thread. I think we understand each others point and I know Chris was over his head to so speak with the volume of submissions he received. I am pretty positive he knows there were issues with the 1st sub and even though I have been frustrated with the communication and how thiings worked with this sub, I will give it a few months for him to work the wrinkles out and sub some cards then. I know Chris wasnt neglectful with how he handled this sub and he did all he could but it just turned crazy on him. I am confident he will work things out and make the submission process work like a machine. My only suggestion is that communication could be a little more refined but other than that I do plan on submitting again but as I said, I will give him a few months to refine the process.

Thanks again to Chris and Beckett for the submission opportunity.

Again, Chris, I know I cant help you actually submit the cards but if you need help developing a process to make things better I would love to offer my opinion and experience if you need it.

 

[mchenrycards]

I have coordinated large group orders in the past. The key is to establish rules and deadlines....clearly communicated deadlines. If you miss the deadline, your cards don't make it into the order. It seems harsh but it is only fair to the ENTIRE group cards go out in a timely manner. My large group orders have gone very smoothly in the past because I set and stuck with a schedule.

You also need to set an expectation that cards will start to ship out "X" days after being received from BGS and the shipping process will last approximately a total of "Y" days. It goes without saying but packages need to be audited every step of the process....that way, nothing gets lost in the wash.

Big picture, there is a disconnect in group orders. When you send in cards, you have to keep in mind the person running the order is not doing so for a profit. So you can't demand a high level of customer service and a quick/proactive response to issues. You are dealing with an individual not a company with extensive resources to handle customer issues.

Plus, there are 20 - 30 other people constantly pinging the person running the project with "silly" questions that unnecessarily burn time and delay the research and response to the real issues...such as, my card is missing. This is amplified when you fail to clearly lay out the expectations before starting the process.

Long and short...it is clear from the comments posted over the past few weeks the group order didn't go as smooth as planned. However, I am sure at the end of the day....everyone will have their cards returned. While the OP should have discussed the issue in private with Chris....he or she does have the right to share their experience. On the other hand, I'm sure Chris will make the necessary changes to ensure the next order is run in a more orderly fashion....there is a learning curve.

I agree with what you said. Deadlines need to be established as well as ship dates. I for one also think that pm,in Chris for grades should not be allowed. If chris could somehow post on the thread what all the grades are this will save him time and energy. And although the live break was great I think that took too much of his time as well. I mean come on...we all want to see our grades but it just isnt worth Chris' time to have to film the break, post it on Utube and then field emails and PM's regarding the fact a person did not see his cards. I am guilty of asking for my grades in the 88 page thread but I would forget about asking if it meant I would get my cards back quicker. We all have to realize he is one guy and by trying to accomodate everyone by doing a live break and answering grade questions really slowed down this process and possibly burned Chris out even faster than it should have.

MY feelings:

No grade request questions

No live breaks

Submission deadlines are stuck to

Shipping schedules be posted (but can be adjusted if need be by a simple post in the submission thread)

If these guildlines are used I think everyone's submissions will be a little easier and Chris wont be pulling his hair out.
Bottome line...Patience people...and that includes me too!

 

[Erich]

If anybody thinks they could handle a 600+ card sub from 50-60 different people I say go right ahead and give it a shot. Chris had no idea it was going to turn into this massive sub. Lessons were learned and additional rules were applied. I think you did a stellar job Chris and have submitted in the May sub.

 

[mchenrycards]

If anybody thinks they could handle a 600+ card sub from 50-60 different people I say go right ahead and give it a shot. Chris had no idea it was going to turn into this massive sub. Lessons were learned and additional rules were applied. I think you did a stellar job Chris and have submitted in the May sub.

I am not sure anyone is saying Chris did a crappy job. We all know that the submission turned into a massive amount of cards. Chris did a good job with what he had to work with

 

[THREADKILLER-crohrer]

Simple solution. Submit your cards on your own and pay full price for them. The OP's check got thrown out and he stated Chris said he would cover it...problem solved. Card was found...problem solved!!! Was it Indyman who's entire order was missed? Chris notified him and his cards were sent. So yes there were a couple of bumps but they have all been resolved. With all of the complaints Chris has received for this "service" he provided I would say screw it if I was him and not deal with the headaches.

Now I guess we should post all of the good stories that came from the sub.
You did a great job Chris and thanks for saving me $197.

 

[cgilmo]

In time these "headaches" will go away. And we will have a functioning BGS submittal pipeline that is efficent from a cost and time standpoint.

The benefits to this site are obvious.

Thank you guys for beta testing. and yes, that thank you goes to ALL of you.

 

[Craig - 21hawk]

In time these "headaches" will go away. And we will have a functioning BGS submittal pipeline that is efficent from a cost and time standpoint.

The benefits to this site are obvious.

Thank you guys for beta testing. and yes, that thank you goes to ALL of you.

Glad to help.

Craig

 

[AndruwHRJones]

No good deed goes unpunished.


You're intention wasnt to tell the "truth", your intention was a calling him out. The idea you would even mention the fear of being scammed on ANDRUW JONES cards is actually laughable. I think there would be about 575 cards I'd scam first from that sub.

Who ever said I was being scammed out of a card? Maybe by another board member looking to make a profit on an extra card they received, but I never said Chris tried to scam me? I don't know the other 50-60 members who subbed, should I automatically trust them all? I TRUSTED Chris with my cards, CHRIS only. That is why they were sent to him.

And just because you are not an Andruw Jones collector does not make my collection any less valuable than yours? So in your eyes, any cards that are deemed unworthy of collecting should be given the least attention and if you receive them, so be it? What an idiot!!

As for me calling Chris out, yes, I guess you can say that. But I am not lying about anything and feel people should know the truth about MY EXPERIENCE WITH THIS submission. Why should all of these mistakes and organizational issues be swept under the carpet so that future people don't know the truth? I feel it is only right that people know what they are possibly dealing with.

With all that said, Chris had a number of opportunities to explain to me what happened to my card before I posted this. He had the opportunity when he noticed my card was not sent initially, being an Andruw Jones card and only two people submitted them, I find it hard to believe he couldn't locate who it belonged to. He also could have mentioned it me when he packaged up my cards to sent out. Which I will add I only had 8 cards, so I don't know how if Chris actually looked at my list, gave me 7 of my cards and gave me one of Fandruw25's cards. And let me remind you that we received our cards yesterday, days after most of the order had already been shipped. So the excuse that a huge order was the problem I am not buying. How many cards could he have possibly had left to send that he couldn't look at a list of 8 cards and tell that something was wrong?

As for the people that had a great experience, I don't mind them posting their experiences. They are also telling the truth and most of their experiences HAVE been heard in various threads. I should be able to tell mine as well without people making me sound like I deserved it or I am being too harsh.

 

[All The Hype]

This post is not directed only at the OP of this thread, but at anyone who participated.


The one thing that bothers me about the whole thing is that Gilmore went WAY out of his way to help out any FCB member that was interested in having cards graded not only by getting about a 50% discount, but by doing 95% of the work. Think about it, if you participated in this sub, you paid half price and all you had to do was send your cards to Chris by the deadline.


Regardless of how great these group subs are/will be, people complain and complain and complain. It was the first time and it was an enormous order. Give him a break. Not many people would be able to manage what Gilmore did with this order.


If you participated, you got a great deal and you hardly had to do anything to take advantage of that deal. I have a hard time understanding why people can't just be a little patient and understanding.


I also happened to have a thing or two not go as planned with my order, but I talked directly to Gilmore about it, and he was quick to get the issues resolved. He is more than willing to make sure everyone is happy if you simply talk to him instead of simply complaining.


I don't know what other people think about the group subs, but I fully back Gilmore and I look forward to participating more in future submissions.