One of those experiences that makes me question this Hobby

[hofautos]

Matt, next time just email the group of us that has a fracking clue what you are talking about. Obviously a lot of people have no clue because they havent been there before.

i think there are alot of old wise men on this board that are a little too wise to put themselves in that position. Once again, you do not need to be a Genius to figure out if your putting out 5k in wax, you are playing with some serious fire.

Doubtful. Very doubtful. He was trying to make money and his venture has failed as of right now. The fact that you and others are saying its dumb for trying says all anyone needs to know. You are not grasping what he is doing and why he is doing it and why he would be upset. Hell...you have HOFAUTOS over here talking about buying singles. That is how we can tell some people don't know what they are talking about.

You want to explain that to me, and I will explain what I am saying. I basically said the same thing as many others. Even Gilmo said business don't stay in business busting wax.
If you want to do it for fun, and you can afford it, great. But don't get t'd off when your gamble doesn't pay off. Boomo said he busted 48 cases, 40 of them being busts, and he had to get several good hits and do a lot of work to just get ahead.

Gimlo makes a decent point. But I'd say more for a shop type dealer than an internet one.

As for not getting ticked off...why can't he be upset about it? If you went in and purchased $5,000 worth of lottery scratch offs and won nothing over $5...several things would happen. First you would be ticked off. Yes you knew damn good and well it could happen. But you figured with that many tickets...it probably wouldn't. And second of all...you'd probably never want to do it again. Both valid feelings. Maybe it is a lesson learned if that is what you would like to call it. But the lesson would have to come from him getting ticked off now wouldn't it?

You missed my point.
My point was if you are doing it for fun and can afford the loss, you won't get T'd off.
That is another point that told me he couldn't afford it. IMHO, if someone gets pissed off at losing a gamble, then they can't afford it. They are out of their "comfort zone".

 

[predatorkj]

You okay Predator? You seem pretty angry in this thread. Which isn't like you.

He's probably heard it from his wife, and didn't need to hear it from me....sorry pred...

You were just trying to help and give your advice/opinion. Though it wasn't solicited which can rub some people the wrong way.

I'm fine. I just didn't like the tone of his post.


It did rub me the wrong way because I have heard it before. Not necessarily much from my wife lately but more from people in the hobby. A lot of times its not even directed at me. But I'll be at a shop or even talking to a few friends and people act like if you don't have gobs of cash then you shouldn't spend money on cards or going to get autographs or anything.

Oddly enough...I used to know a guy who told me that he never had any credit cards and paid for everything in cash and if he couldn't afford it...he didn't get it. And he did without a lot of things according to him. To me, using a credit card to do anything isn't a bad idea unless there is no way you can afford to pay it off. The bad part is where you can't control yourself.

My wife, while she doesn't particularly enjoy my hobby(although I have determined its her lot in life to not be enthused with any of my hobbies) has no problem as long as I budget myself which is what I try to do. I have seen many cards I wanted pass me up on ebay because I can't afford it. And being married, you have that commitment that you can't be behind someone's back all the time buying stuff. Especially if it hinders paying bills. So I try not to be THAT GUY. So yeah...I'll get upset if someone hints that I am doing that. You'd basically be calling me a bad husband and yeah...I'd say that would normally tick someone off.

But yes, everyone does need a form of entertainment. And this is mine. Because right now...its too damn cold to fish. But it doesn't make it foolish to spend money on entertainment as long as you aren't shooting yourself in the foot. Would I spend $5,000 on cases to resell? Hell no. First off, it doesn't interest me. Second off...I am not in the boat to do it right now. I couldn't afford it. But I'd like to think someone who does do it isn't dumb enough to do it knowing if it doesn't work out...they are totally screwed. Now I don't know Skrip that well at all but I figure if an adult does something like that, even if they take one hard from the results, they would still be able to pay it off with no unreasonable effects.

I go through a lot everyday just like everyone else and I think, just like everyone else, I am entitled to a little entertainment provided I can afford it. And that is the trick, making sure you can afford it. While everyone's definition may vary on that...I feel its safe to say if you don't have trouble paying your bills and its not hurting your relationship with your family...you'll be fine. As for Bankruptcy, that can happen to anyone depending on the situation no matter how frugal you are.

 

[predatorkj]

[quote="justinmandawg":2yqo31aj]Matt, next time just email the group of us that has a fracking clue what you are talking about. Obviously a lot of people have no clue because they havent been there before.

i think there are alot of old wise men on this board that are a little too wise to put themselves in that position. Once again, you do not need to be a Genius to figure out if your putting out 5k in wax, you are playing with some serious fire.

Doubtful. Very doubtful. He was trying to make money and his venture has failed as of right now. The fact that you and others are saying its dumb for trying says all anyone needs to know. You are not grasping what he is doing and why he is doing it and why he would be upset. Hell...you have HOFAUTOS over here talking about buying singles. That is how we can tell some people don't know what they are talking about.

You want to explain that to me, and I will explain what I am saying. I basically said the same thing as many others. Even Gilmo said business don't stay in business busting wax.
If you want to do it for fun, and you can afford it, great. But don't get t'd off when your gamble doesn't pay off. Boomo said he busted 48 cases, 40 of them being busts, and he had to get several good hits and do a lot of work to just get ahead.

Gimlo makes a decent point. But I'd say more for a shop type dealer than an internet one.

As for not getting ticked off...why can't he be upset about it? If you went in and purchased $5,000 worth of lottery scratch offs and won nothing over $5...several things would happen. First you would be ticked off. Yes you knew damn good and well it could happen. But you figured with that many tickets...it probably wouldn't. And second of all...you'd probably never want to do it again. Both valid feelings. Maybe it is a lesson learned if that is what you would like to call it. But the lesson would have to come from him getting ticked off now wouldn't it?

You missed my point.
My point was if you are doing it for fun and can afford the loss, you won't get T'd off.
That is another point that told me he couldn't afford it. IMHO, if someone gets pissed off at losing a gamble, then they can't afford it. They are out of their "comfort zone".[/quote:2yqo31aj]


It probably depends more on the individual and how they react to such things. Sure anyone who couldn't afford it to begin with would be mega upset. But it doesn't mean someone who could wouldn't get miffed about it either. Especially when they are used to being able to cash in on a certain aspect of the hobby. Nobody likes to lose money whether its known it might happen or not.

 

[hofautos]

[quote="Big Mac McGwire":25v34c54][quote="justinmandawg":25v34c54]Matt, next time just email the group of us that has a fracking clue what you are talking about. Obviously a lot of people have no clue because they havent been there before.

i think there are alot of old wise men on this board that are a little too wise to put themselves in that position. Once again, you do not need to be a Genius to figure out if your putting out 5k in wax, you are playing with some serious fire.

Doubtful. Very doubtful. He was trying to make money and his venture has failed as of right now. The fact that you and others are saying its dumb for trying says all anyone needs to know. You are not grasping what he is doing and why he is doing it and why he would be upset. Hell...you have HOFAUTOS over here talking about buying singles. That is how we can tell some people don't know what they are talking about.

You want to explain that to me, and I will explain what I am saying. I basically said the same thing as many others. Even Gilmo said business don't stay in business busting wax.
If you want to do it for fun, and you can afford it, great. But don't get t'd off when your gamble doesn't pay off. Boomo said he busted 48 cases, 40 of them being busts, and he had to get several good hits and do a lot of work to just get ahead.

Gimlo makes a decent point. But I'd say more for a shop type dealer than an internet one.

As for not getting ticked off...why can't he be upset about it? If you went in and purchased $5,000 worth of lottery scratch offs and won nothing over $5...several things would happen. First you would be ticked off. Yes you knew damn good and well it could happen. But you figured with that many tickets...it probably wouldn't. And second of all...you'd probably never want to do it again. Both valid feelings. Maybe it is a lesson learned if that is what you would like to call it. But the lesson would have to come from him getting ticked off now wouldn't it?

You missed my point.
My point was if you are doing it for fun and can afford the loss, you won't get T'd off.
That is another point that told me he couldn't afford it. IMHO, if someone gets pissed off at losing a gamble, then they can't afford it. They are out of their "comfort zone".[/quote:25v34c54]


It probably depends more on the individual and how they react to such things. Sure anyone who couldn't afford it to begin with would be mega upset. But it doesn't mean someone who could wouldn't get miffed about it either. Especially when they are used to being able to cash in on a certain aspect of the hobby. Nobody likes to lose money whether its known it might happen or not.[/quote:25v34c54]

...sure everyone would get upset if they didn't win.

If I paid $1 for a lottery ticket and didn't win, i would be upset, but I wouldn't be pissed.
If I bought 5 lottery tickets, I wouldn't be pissed off if I didn't win.
If I bought 10 lottery tickets...I woudn't buy 10 lottery tickets because it's more than I can afford to lose without getting T'd off.

Everyone has their comfort zone with how much they are comfortable losing, in exchange for the "thrill of the gamble". When the stakes are too high, get out.

For me personally, there is little thrill in gambling, especially where there is no challenge. I am not a gambling person...I guess I am glad I lost on my first pack break....otherwise I may be addicted

 

[predatorkj]

...sure everyone would get upset if they didn't win.

If I paid $1 for a lottery ticket and didn't win, i would be upset, but I wouldn't be pissed.
If I bought 5 lottery tickets, I wouldn't be pissed off if I didn't win.
If I bought 10 lottery tickets...I woudn't buy 10 lottery tickets because it's more than I can afford to lose without getting T'd off.

Everyone has their comfort zone with how much they are comfortable losing, in exchange for the "thrill of the gamble". When the stakes are too high, get out.

For me personally, there is little thrill in gambling, especially where there is no challenge. I am not a gambling person...I guess I am glad I lost on my first pack break....otherwise I may be addicted

My take (as per my pm)is that a lot of these guys make money off of this product and they see it year after year. Sure some years aren't so stellar but it does have somewhat of a proven record. And its their hobby. Its what they do. So to reply in kind...if you purchased those tickets and you always won at least a couple of dollars back or maybe broke even...would it not cross your mind that if you purchased a good amount of them, you have a good chance of hitting a $25,000 winner? That is pretty much what is going on here.

 

[hofautos]

...sure everyone would get upset if they didn't win.

If I paid $1 for a lottery ticket and didn't win, i would be upset, but I wouldn't be pissed.
If I bought 5 lottery tickets, I wouldn't be pissed off if I didn't win.
If I bought 10 lottery tickets...I woudn't buy 10 lottery tickets because it's more than I can afford to lose without getting T'd off.

Everyone has their comfort zone with how much they are comfortable losing, in exchange for the "thrill of the gamble". When the stakes are too high, get out.

For me personally, there is little thrill in gambling, especially where there is no challenge. I am not a gambling person...I guess I am glad I lost on my first pack break....otherwise I may be addicted

My take (as per my pm)is that a lot of these guys make money off of this product and they see it year after year. Sure some years aren't so stellar but it does have somewhat of a proven record. And its their hobby. Its what they do. So to reply in kind...if you purchased those tickets and you always won at least a couple of dollars back or maybe broke even...would it not cross your mind that if you purchased a good amount of them, you have a good chance of hitting a $25,000 winner? That is pretty much what is going on here.

Believe me I understand they want that supefractor, to flip. But logic also tells me, that there will be good breaks and bad breaks, and really good breaks, and really bad breaks.
I also would not spend more money than i have, in hopes of getting that really good break, knowing I could get a really bad break. I feel if I am going to have a lucky day, it only takes one ticket. I also don't think a Lot of these guys make money "consistently" off of this or any product like you suggest, otherwise everyone would be doing it. Sure you see the good breaks, most people don't advertise the bad ones. Boomo's example was a good one. A sampling of 48 cases over 2 years, that the vast majority were bust...the few that were not, and all his hard work, are what just made it to about break even. the odds of getting that 25K super for a 6K investment, are probably less than a spin on the roulette wheel paying 16:1 odds with a lot more work.

I understand what they are doing, but I do concede the odds are better than I expected if the worse case scenarios will still net you 50% of your investment.
Anyway, we will probably continue to disagree, so we should just agree to disagree and quit beating the horse.
Bottom line for me, people shouldn't buy any cards they need to finance, and people shouldn't gamble what they aren't comfortable losing.

 

[jcmint]

Oh Jeff, I never once asked anyone to feel bad for me, and still am not asking for that.

Losing my job was difficult. I am not going to hide it. Not really sure what that has to do with anything. We all have difficult times in our lives. I know you have, right Jeff? I don't feel the need to make it personal, so I won't get into it.

If my posts bug you, go read somewhere else. The board would be better without your negative comments and ridiculous obsession with Cole and his boys. Maybe you should try to smile for once in your life, maybe even make a positive post, that would be a first. Maybe then people might TRY to change their mind about you.

Matt i wonder if it was just a hobby when jeff was given all that 2004 product by Mike Z to "distribute". those were the good ole money making days right Jeff. Was I'mmmmmmmmmm back melodramatic. Get over yourself *********.

Send me more PMs about raping my wife, pal. I enjoyed those.

Typical lying ambulance chaser. If I pm'ed you something like that I wouldnt be here anymore. Good one counselor. Never mind addressing the fact you flat out stole from Mike Z. You like to pile on other people all the time but you aint nothing but a thief. Mike forwarded me all those emails he sent you. Funny how you ignored all of those.

 

[Anthony K.]

Matt,

It really sucks to hear about this bud. I have read pretty much every post in this thread (well, sans the back and forth between predatorkj and hofautos) and I must admit I do agree with many people in the thread, on both sides of the "fence".

I know you've had some awesome breaks in the past and I am sure you've had a few duds hear and there, but I hope this isn't something that takes you out of the hobby completely. Maybe just step back, take a good look at the hobby you love and see if there is some other way for you to enjoy it (buying strictly singles, starting a player or team collection, etc).

You're one of the good guys Matt. Keep your head up and try to recoup as best as you can.

 

[ChasHawk]

[quote="predatorkj":2kzvitld][quote="Big Mac McGwire":2kzvitld][quote="justinmandawg":2kzvitld]Matt, next time just email the group of us that has a fracking clue what you are talking about. Obviously a lot of people have no clue because they havent been there before.

i think there are alot of old wise men on this board that are a little too wise to put themselves in that position. Once again, you do not need to be a Genius to figure out if your putting out 5k in wax, you are playing with some serious fire.

Doubtful. Very doubtful. He was trying to make money and his venture has failed as of right now. The fact that you and others are saying its dumb for trying says all anyone needs to know. You are not grasping what he is doing and why he is doing it and why he would be upset. Hell...you have HOFAUTOS over here talking about buying singles. That is how we can tell some people don't know what they are talking about.

You want to explain that to me, and I will explain what I am saying. I basically said the same thing as many others. Even Gilmo said business don't stay in business busting wax.
If you want to do it for fun, and you can afford it, great. But don't get t'd off when your gamble doesn't pay off. Boomo said he busted 48 cases, 40 of them being busts, and he had to get several good hits and do a lot of work to just get ahead.

Gimlo makes a decent point. But I'd say more for a shop type dealer than an internet one.

As for not getting ticked off...why can't he be upset about it? If you went in and purchased $5,000 worth of lottery scratch offs and won nothing over $5...several things would happen. First you would be ticked off. Yes you knew damn good and well it could happen. But you figured with that many tickets...it probably wouldn't. And second of all...you'd probably never want to do it again. Both valid feelings. Maybe it is a lesson learned if that is what you would like to call it. But the lesson would have to come from him getting ticked off now wouldn't it?

You missed my point.
My point was if you are doing it for fun and can afford the loss, you won't get T'd off.
That is another point that told me he couldn't afford it. IMHO, if someone gets pissed off at losing a gamble, then they can't afford it. They are out of their "comfort zone".[/quote:2kzvitld]


It probably depends more on the individual and how they react to such things. Sure anyone who couldn't afford it to begin with would be mega upset. But it doesn't mean someone who could wouldn't get miffed about it either. Especially when they are used to being able to cash in on a certain aspect of the hobby. Nobody likes to lose money whether its known it might happen or not.[/quote:2kzvitld]

...sure everyone would get upset if they didn't win.

If I paid $1 for a lottery ticket and didn't win, i would be upset, but I wouldn't be pissed.
If I bought 5 lottery tickets, I wouldn't be pissed off if I didn't win.
If I bought 10 lottery tickets...I woudn't buy 10 lottery tickets because it's more than I can afford to lose without getting T'd off.

Everyone has their comfort zone with how much they are comfortable losing, in exchange for the "thrill of the gamble". When the stakes are too high, get out.

For me personally, there is little thrill in gambling, especially where there is no challenge. I am not a gambling person...I guess I am glad I lost on my first pack break....otherwise I may be addicted [/quote:2kzvitld]
Mike, opinion or not, this is complete BS. Even if someone can "afford" it, they have every right to be HUGELY pissed off if they feel they were shorted what, by the odds, they were supposed to receive in the product.

Matt has already posted the pack odds in this very thread, along with what he actually received. That's why he's upset.

Here's another analogy for you: If you could "afford" to buy a $100 filet mignon that was supposed be lean and tender, but it came out to the table grissly and as chewy as shoe leather, do you not have a right to be pissed about it because you could "afford" to lose that $100??

Once again, wax is not gambling. It's a product. Topps is very adament about the fact that it's a consumer product only.

Why is this such a hard concept for so many people?? If you spend $1 or $1,000 on a company's product, do you not expect a certain level of value in your purchased item?? Everything loses value yes, but if you paid $1,000 for a 55" LCD which promised 2 speakers, if it only had 1, would that be ok? How about if only 70% of the pixels worked?? They explain in the documentation for the TV that some dead pixels are expected. Would you keep it or return it??

 

[phillyfan0417]

Oh Jeff, I never once asked anyone to feel bad for me, and still am not asking for that.

Losing my job was difficult. I am not going to hide it. Not really sure what that has to do with anything. We all have difficult times in our lives. I know you have, right Jeff? I don't feel the need to make it personal, so I won't get into it.

If my posts bug you, go read somewhere else. The board would be better without your negative comments and ridiculous obsession with Cole and his boys. Maybe you should try to smile for once in your life, maybe even make a positive post, that would be a first. Maybe then people might TRY to change their mind about you.

Matt i wonder if it was just a hobby when jeff was given all that 2004 product by Mike Z to "distribute". those were the good ole money making days right Jeff. Was I'mmmmmmmmmm back melodramatic. Get over yourself *********.

Send me more PMs about raping my wife, pal. I enjoyed those.

Typical lying ambulance chaser. If I pm'ed you something like that I wouldnt be here anymore. Good one counselor. Never mind addressing the fact you flat out stole from Mike Z. You like to pile on other people all the time but you aint nothing but a thief. Mike forwarded me all those emails he sent you. Funny how you ignored all of those.

This issue needs to die unless you want to discuss it through PM's. Those who were there and witnessed have their perspective and know what they believe happened. Lets not rehash this again.

Thanks

 

[A_Pharis]

It's sucky collation, but as long as the odds stay true over the entire print run then -- technically -- Topps has done their job. Really, the only time they can be called on it is when boxes have no autos since most BC boxes say 1 Auto Per Box on them.

Not saying that a friendly call won't amount to anything, but it's really up to Topps about what they want to do about it. Stated odds say that for every (for example) 24 packs made that there is one auto made. It doesn't say if you open 24 packs that you are guaranteed an auto.

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Not sure why this got so out of control.

Oh, wait, I do know.

Matt clearly stated in the fourth post of the entire thread...
"To repeat, I understand it was a risk, and I am not looking for pity. Please, everyone reading this, I am not looking for your pity. I am just passing along my experience and what I am currently thinking about the hobby, etc."

He's venting, he's pissed and he understood the risks.

He doesn't need a lesson or any advice.

 

[A_Pharis]

Not sure why this got so out of control.

Oh, wait, I do know.

Matt clearly stated in the fourth post of the entire thread...
"To repeat, I understand it was a risk, and I am not looking for pity. Please, everyone reading this, I am not looking for your pity. I am just passing along my experience and what I am currently thinking about the hobby, etc."

He's venting, he's pissed and he understood the risks.

He doesn't need a lesson or any advice.

Yeah, I've been lost onto why people are getting onto him when he's never come off as needing pity. He didn't even post for multiple pages.

 

[ChasHawk]

Not sure why this got so out of control.

Oh, wait, I do know.

Matt clearly stated in the fourth post of the entire thread...
"To repeat, I understand it was a risk, and I am not looking for pity. Please, everyone reading this, I am not looking for your pity. I am just passing along my experience and what I am currently thinking about the hobby, etc."

He's venting, he's pissed and he understood the risks.

He doesn't need a lesson or any advice.

Yeah, I've been lost onto why people are getting onto him when he's never come off as needing pity. He didn't even post for multiple pages.

Because people are inherently jagoffs, myself included at times.