Question on the Saints Ground Game-Thomas/Bell in Particular

[Card Magnet]

Are Pierre Thomas and Mike Bell really that good, or are they putting up big numbers because they play for the aerial Saints? What I mean is they're running backs on a team that is known for passing. It's kind of the reverse of the receiving opening up when the defense starts playing to the run.

I don't watch any Saints games (not a fan, and there's always somebody else on around here). So this is a serious question.

 

[Viking4Alpha]

I think you just made more of a statement rather than a question. :lol:

All I gotta say is, what other team in the NFL would have Pierre Thomas starting? Maybe one?

 

[Card Magnet]

I'm kind of speculating that's why, but I don't watch them enough to say it as my solid opinion. I was just looking for some insight from guys who watch the Saints.

I hope it doesn't take the route of the Pierre Thomas thread...

 

[Pine Tar]

Kid has to play sometime so why not this week.

 

[sffanmike25]

They both are benefitting greatly from the system. As you mentioned in the first post, when you make the defense focus on the idea of the pass, with a 3-4 WR set, or 3 WR's + Shockey, only so many LB's can be committed to the line of scrimmage. They'll have a mobile LB follow Shockey, who then Shockey will clamp down on when the run is on. On top of that, when teams substitute, they are more likely to add another DB or Safety to their package instead of a LB to deal with the pass, thus both RB's face typically lesser sound tacklers once they've broken through the first level.

 

[blazers091]

I think you just made more of a statement rather than a question. :lol:

All I gotta say is, what other team in the NFL would have Pierre Thomas starting? Maybe one?

Chiefs. I've noticed that Thomas is more of dominant rusher than Bell. Mike Bell isn't really that good

 

[flightposite]

Pierre Thomas - Good.

Mike Bell - Not Good.

 

[sffanmike25]

Regardless of who is at RB:

Saints = Snake-bitten at the position in terms of health (Bush, Thomas, Bell, McAllister, clear back to Dalton Hilliard)

 

[Card Magnet]

The reason I mentioned Bell in the mix is his one good game with 150 or so yards. I don't think he's a top back or anything for sure. That's kind of the point that reinforces my suspicion that the Saints game produces the rushing numbers more than the talent of the backs.

 

[sffanmike25]

The reason I mentioned Bell in the mix is his one good game with 150 or so yards. I don't think he's a top back or anything for sure. That's kind of the point that reinforces my suspicion that the Saints game produces the rushing numbers more than the talent of the backs.

That is correct. The system is the source for RB success. That's why Mike Bell found his way there, just like he did in Denver. He loves systems. :lol:

 

[EricInCT]

Are you asking as a card collector or fantasy value?

One thing you will see is that Pierre Thomas can catch the ball (Keep in mind Bell averages 3 catches a year). He caught a very short pass and made some spectacular moves turning a 5 yard play into 36 and falling out of bounce at the one foot line. I questioned whether Reggie Bush or Bell could make that play.....neither could have in my opinion, especially Bell. Bell is a run through you type runner........Thomas just has a nack of following his blockers....staying low almost hiding behind them.....then stumbling forward for 3 or 4 extra yards.

This is all you need to know about Thomas:
He has the same amount of yards as DeAngelo Williams on 26 less carries.
He is tied for 4th in the league in TDs.
He has 120 less yards but 67 less carries than Brandon Jacobs.
He has 8 less yards than Larry Johnson and 60 less carries.


He has only played 6 quaters this year, 2nd half of Bills and 4 quarters in the Jets game.
Both times he carried the ball in the first drive on the 4th quarter.
Both times the passing game had been completely ineffective.
Both times were one possesion games.....10-7 Bills game and after the Jets came back making it 17-10 (from 17-0)
One drive started on the New Orleans 3 the other on the 20.
Key running plays.
He ran the ball 3 times straight in each game for a total of 6 carries.
He averaged over 12+ yards per carry when a key 3 and out deep in their own territory could have meant poor field position and a loss.

 

[EricInCT]

Here is the problem with Bell:

He has played in a blowout win against the Lions.
He has played in a blowout win against the Eagles.

In a one possession game he stinks. His stats are subpar. When the team has a big lead....he has gapping holes and doesn't get touched for 5-10 yards down the field at times.

Even the Eagles game was 13-17 at the half. Half of Bell's carries in a tight game that could have gone either way were for 2 or less yards. He didn't start moving the ball until they had a 2+ possession lead. He is a phony and I can't believe people want Bell to start over Thomas ::facepalm::

Thomas has scored 12 TDs in his last 9 games played for the Saints......and Bell gets fatigued and fumbles.

He said he can't wait to run through someone this Sunday....I think he meant he can't wait to get hurt again :?

 

[Card Magnet]

Are you asking as a card collector or fantasy value?

Really just asking out of curiosity as a football fan. I'm not an investor when it comes to cards.

I know that he has put up great numbers, but I didn't know if it was because he's that good or because of the system. Especially since Mike Bell stepped in and put up comparable numbers the one game.

 

[EricInCT]

Are you asking as a card collector or fantasy value?

Really just asking out of curiosity as a football fan. I'm not an investor when it comes to cards.

I know that he has put up great numbers, but I didn't know if it was because he's that good or because of the system. Especially since Mike Bell stepped in and put up comparable numbers the one game.

There are rumors now that Thomas will start to run the wildcat for the Saints.

Reggie would fumble the ball and Bell would crash into a defender for a 2 yard gain.

I think Thomas a 1/2 rung away from Ahmad Bradshaw......and in the system he is in with the weapons he can produce similar if not superior numbers.

I think Thomas could replace: Sproles, Larry Johnson, Buckhalter (or moreno...not sold on that bust yet as a diehard bronco fan), Marshawn Lynch, Westbrook, Addai, Jaamal Lewis....and maybe one or two more.

I would love to see him catch 30-50 balls a year......but then again why are you paying that waste of skin Reggie Bush 15 million a year? lol.

 

[joeyV]

They are both better than Reggie Bush. Thats all that matters. Reggie might as well be a receiver. I watch all the Saints games b/c I am in New Orleans.

 

[Viking4Alpha]

I think Thomas could replace: Sproles, Larry Johnson, Buckhalter, Jaamal Lewis...

Your bias is out of control.

Fixed.

 

[jeff550]

thomas is that good.
bell i dont think is that good

 

[EricInCT]

I think Thomas could replace: Sproles, Larry Johnson, Buckhalter, Jaamal Lewis...

Your bias is out of control.

Fixed.

Snyper, it is an opinion you freaking moron. And you think Addai is better? Please, look at the stats you dope.

 

[Viking4Alpha]

I think Thomas could replace: Sproles, Larry Johnson, Buckhalter, Jaamal Lewis...

Your bias is out of control.

Fixed.

Snyper, it is an opinion you freaking moron. And you think Addai is better? Please, look at the stats you dope.

Where was you're precious Pierre Thomas today numb nuts? :lol: All those points and not one score from the fragile frenchman.

 

[Card Magnet]

That was just an aerial shredding in that game. Thomas still put up 72 yards, and Bell got 34 and a TD. I don't expect a RB to put up great numbers when that's going on.

This also plays to my original question - did they get those numbers because the Saints passing game is immaculate?