Why Does Michael Young Get No Hobby Love?

[smapdi]

When was the last time a non-slugger had real heat in the hobby? Probably Ichiro, but not since the year he set the hits record. The sad fact is that unless you are closing in on a record or have an average over .380, no attention is paid to non-power hitters. It's great if you collect guys like that.

 

[pujolsjunkie]

High BA + Homers for hitters, Wins + Strikeouts for pitchers...

Those are the money categories for hobby success. Guys like Michael Young and Kevin Slowey will be unappreciated forever.

 

[FromKoufaxtoEdwin]

How can you be atrocious in the field and when a gold glove?

How did Nate McLouth win a gold glove last year when he was one of the worst outfielders in baseball? how did Rafael Palmeiro win a gold glove when he played like 50 games at 1st base? How did Derek Jeter win any of his gold gloves? Its really an arbitrary award given by people who make judments off of small sample sizes and do not use advanced statistics.

 

[All The Hype]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

 

[soccerman034]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

Fielding Percentage is the worst stat in baseball.

 

[trevordchi]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

Wrong!

He made a bunch of flashy plays that a good SS would have made look easy.

 

[All The Hype]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

Fielding Percentage is the worst stat in baseball.

I disagree, but regardless, I find it hard to understand why people think Jeter is such a bad fielder.

 

[arod305]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

Fielding Percentage is the worst stat in baseball.

How? I totally disagree

 

[bcubs]

I have to agree with the vanilla reference and the fact he plays in TX being strikes against him. I own him in 3 fantasy leagues and he keeps producing and I field plenty of trade offers for him. So he's getting love somewhere, just not in the cards.

 

[trcardcollector]

I have to agree with the vanilla reference and the fact he plays in TX being strikes against him. I own him in 3 fantasy leagues and he keeps producing and I field plenty of trade offers for him. So he's getting love somewhere, just not in the cards.

bet you can't say the same for jeter...i never put him very high in my rankings for my fantasy teams after last season. learned my lesson there. 3 gold glove awards DO NOT equal help with wins on your fantasy team.

 

[soccerman034]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

Fielding Percentage is the worst stat in baseball.

How? I totally disagree

Fielding percentage does not take into account the balls a player SHOULD get too. Look at the Fielding Bibles site, and you will completely understand.

 

[FromKoufaxtoEdwin]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

We're not in 1964 anymore, my man. We have numbers and statistics that can help us understand things like this. No human can possibly watch every ball hit and say "This guy would have made x number of plays more than this guy." But, with computers and the like doing the work for us, we actually can come close to quantifying defensive value. Fielding percentage just takes into account balls a player gets to. Jeter's range is awful, so therefore he doesnt reach balls a normal shortstop would get to, thus costing his team runs. The comment that he makes plays other shortstops dont is completely false, and has about 7 years of data to back it up. I suggest every one here that believe fielding percentage, gold gloves, batting average, and wins are statistics upon which to judge a player visit fangraphs.com. It breaks everything down and is really simple to use.

for instance, just look at Jeter's page. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?pl ... osition=SS
Here, we can see his defensive value over the years using advanced metrics. Since 2002 when the UZR/150 stat is kept, Jeter is on average 6 runs per year WORSE than the average shortstop with poor range numbers, and his improvement the last 2 years has helped that stat. He is still a valuable player and once was super elite because of his bat at the shortstop position, but he now is nowhere close to the best at his position.

 

[All The Hype]

Jeter was in the top 4 in fielding % each of the three years he won a gold glove. He also made a number of flashy, spectacular plays that most shortstops likely would not have made. The combination of the two leads to a gold glove.

I don't understand why so many people on this board think he's the worst fielding shortstop in the league.

We're not in 1964 anymore, my man. We have numbers and statistics that can help us understand things like this. No human can possibly watch every ball hit and say "This guy would have made x number of plays more than this guy." But, with computers and the like doing the work for us, we actually can come close to quantifying defensive value. Fielding percentage just takes into account balls a player gets to. Jeter's range is awful, so therefore he doesnt reach balls a normal shortstop would get to, thus costing his team runs. The comment that he makes plays other shortstops dont is completely false, and has about 7 years of data to back it up. I suggest every one here that believe fielding percentage, gold gloves, batting average, and wins are statistics upon which to judge a player visit fangraphs.com. It breaks everything down and is really simple to use.

for instance, just look at Jeter's page. http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?pl ... osition=SS
Here, we can see his defensive value over the years using advanced metrics. Since 2002 when the UZR/150 stat is kept, Jeter is on average 6 runs per year WORSE than the average shortstop with poor range numbers, and his improvement the last 2 years has helped that stat. He is still a valuable player and once was super elite because of his bat at the shortstop position, but he now is nowhere close to the best at his position.

I'm afraid I don't know how to read/comprehend any of those numbers on that page...or even know what any of the abbreviations stand for :?

Call me stubborn, but I'm not buying it regardless. I've seen Jeter play a number of times and he is very good in the field. Should he have won all three of those gold gloves? Maybe, maybe not. But being top 4 in fielding % tells me that he makes the majority of the plays. Even if he didn't deserve any of the gold gloves, this number alone shows that he is not the worst fielder in the league no matter what kind of range he has.

 

[Rudzud]

Heres a question...will he make the HOF?

 

[aw00d05]

Heres a question...will he make the HOF?

Who Young or Jeter, if Jeter haha, Young I seriously doubt it even if he gets 3000.

 

[Rudzud]

Heres a question...will he make the HOF?

Who Young or Jeter, if Jeter haha, Young I seriously doubt it even if he gets 3000.

The thread is about Michael Young, no?

 

[soccerman034]

Young will be borderline at best, especially if he never wins anything. If he gets 3,000 hits (which is unlikely at this point) he will be a lock (obviously).

 

[FromKoufaxtoEdwin]

http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?pl ... osition=SS[/url]
Here, we can see his defensive value over the years using advanced metrics. Since 2002 when the UZR/150 stat is kept, Jeter is on average 6 runs per year WORSE than the average shortstop with poor range numbers, and his improvement the last 2 years has helped that stat. He is still a valuable player and once was super elite because of his bat at the shortstop position, but he now is nowhere close to the best at his position.

I'm afraid I don't know how to read/comprehend any of those numbers on that page...or even know what any of the abbreviations stand for :?

Call me stubborn, but I'm not buying it regardless. I've seen Jeter play a number of times and he is very good in the field. Should he have won all three of those gold gloves? Maybe, maybe not. But being top 4 in fielding % tells me that he makes the majority of the plays. Even if he didn't deserve any of the gold gloves, this number alone shows that he is not the worst fielder in the league no matter what kind of range he has.[/quote:2r1995m5]

Stubborn! There's a glossary on the page that explains all of the statistics, but for defense, the Ultimate Zone Rating is the big one and determines how many runs a player saves or gives back on defense. Really, this is how the game is being looked at by those in charge and making personnel decisions (the numbers available to the public for free are just the tip of that iceberg). Its why Michael Young won a gold glove and was told to play a new position. The Rangers front office knew he was an awful fielder, and no award could prove it otherwise. And unlike watching players, there is no bias. I love Matt Kemp and he's been awesome in the field, but I cant say "Well, he's been the best defensive center fielder in baseball this year" without getting funny looks. But, you look at the numbers, and you see that Kemp is a top 3 defensive center fielder in any metric. Even if you dont believe the numbers about Jeter, just watch a guy like Jimmy Rollins or Jason Bartlett and you can see the difference. I'm guessing you have a belief that Jeter is a good fielder, and your confirmation bias will pick out plays that support that belief. Computers and numbers only have biases towards the good players.

 

[Therion]

Michael Young = Mark Grace

No hobby love for doubles hitters.

 

[tramers]

try being a pirate fan.