What does the hobby "need"?

[fordman]

As a collector that left the hobby in 1997 and just re-entered it last November, here is what myself and my 7 yr old would like to see.

1) Cheap baseball cards for kids. When I say cheap, I dont mean skimp on design, photography, I mean price. Kids cant afford over $0.50 a pack. I dont care if they go back to the brown paperstock and wax pack wrappers. Let ripping open cards be fun for the kids again. Put 16-18 cards per pack. Let the kid feel like he got a lot of cards for his $0.50. Make a regular set that kids can collect and trade with Dad or other collectors, not something with cartoon players or psa messages. Do like they used to do, make a base, then make a tiffany/glossy set for those that want a better quality card. Put the auto/relic inserts in the tiffany packs. I know they have opening day but kids cant afford them at $1.00 pk for 7 cards.

I went to a show in Cincinnati 2 weekends ago and a lot of 40+ yr old men walking around but very few kids. Most were there for the Johnny Bench autograph.

2) Quit putting the same pic of the player on every auto/relic card released for that year. Sometimes its the same photo 2-3 years in a row.

3) Quit doing the dumb 'rainbow' thing. Do one color and be done, gold-silver-red-purple; doesnt matter, make the series be truley limited.

4) This one's on MLB, give the license to more than one company. Let competition tell if topps is the only game in town. Make them step up their game and make better cards/designs/photos and let collectors make the call.

5) This one on the collectors, quit paying the prices for stuff like Bowman. Most of Bowman is full of no names and never will be's. Topps knows who the stars are and they short print certain players so you'll buy more. I had a local shop owner tell me he had to buy so much of everything to keep the topps buying license. Tell topps to stick their buying license and you'd rather close your doors than to have to pay out the ***** for product that most collectors cant afford.

6) Quit doing redemption cards. Self explanitory. If you dont already hve the redemption, you end up with the backlog of people waiting for their cards.

7) Do insert mystery wrapped cards into packs. Make it like 'Lets Make A Deal' style. Do you open the pack (maybe something great) or send it back for something better or do you get a 1989 Topps Sal Butera? And by better, have a pre-determained list of better stuff for them to send you. They send you back a pack you have to open to see what you got.

Thats my $0.02.

Fordman

 

[MansGame]

[MENTION=9350]fordman[/MENTION] - Love the post but $0.50 packs will NEVER happen. It sucks but that is something we will never see for new product. If you're looking for a good time with your son busting wax, but old wax on the cheap and just busy away.


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Looking for Albert Belle cards! PM me!

 

[padremurph]

I would love to see an exquisite type insert set in regular Topps 2010 UD style. Something really worth chasing.

 

[gt5717b]

Someone mentioned video games earlier as a reason why kids don't get into baseball cards. If I were Topps, I would partner with EA Sports to include current baseball cards for each release of MLB 20XX. Maybe when you click on a player to see his stats, his current card comes up. That will at least give exposure to cards since all the kids play video games.

 

[predatorkj]

Someone mentioned video games earlier as a reason why kids don't get into baseball cards. If I were Topps, I would partner with EA Sports to include current baseball cards for each release of MLB 20XX. Maybe when you click on a player to see his stats, his current card comes up. That will at least give exposure to cards since all the kids play video games.

That's just way too intelligent for them to do...

 

[predatorkj]

Something else that kinda irks me, video games may take away from some of your audience. But kids still buy yughio and MTG cards. I thought after MTG started being played online, the days of people buying real cards for it would stop. But oddly enough it never did. So there is a market for kids who buy cards despite the video game aspect. But they want their cards, even the commons, to have a use. That is a hurdle I'm not sure sports cards can over come. Set building only gets so close.


As was mentioned about opening day not giving you enough cards(7 cards for a $1), I busted a ton of this stuff. Probably like 6 or so blasters and about 15 or so rack packs as well as some single packs. I still don't have a complete set and my doubles stack is a little bigger than my set/insert stack. I love opening day, especially the parallels but it's insane how much it ends up costing you to put a set together. I get the whole trading aspect but as an adult with things to do like work and other fun stuff, if I had to trade to complete every set, I'd die. I can't imagine it's easier for kids, especially if they don't have friends who collect.

Another thing that got my goat is the sticker album Topps puts out for baseball every year now. Those things cost a fortune to fill as well. And don't even get me started on football (panini). I used to love these kinds of things as a kid and I suppose it's a little odd that I want to collect them now but I guess there is something in me that says now that I have the ability to buy whatever I like, and the money, I feel compelled to do so. Yet you only get like 8 stickers in a pack and the coallation is terrible. I've probably spent around $60 buying sticker packs and am still close to 20 short for the album. I'll buy them and finish it off as singles but to me, spending $60 on these should have ended up with me for sure completing an album and having a boatload of doubles.

So even on the mega low end stuff that is probably geared for kids anyways, it's futile to hope to finish it off unless you let your child look online for singles or he has friends who buy the same stuff and lots of it. And realistically, how many non-collecting parents are going to buy much of this stuff anyways? They buy little Joey the Sticker Album and 19 packs of stickers and slap a $20 on the counter and hope the child will let them alone for two minutes. Meanwhile, an hour later they bring you the album and you see it's mostly still empty. Well there goes that. Mom's not buying anymore. Here, go buy a video game for $20 or a couple of decks of yughio and go be happy for a few days if not more.

I get that things need to be challenging. And nothing will be as cheap as it once was. But most kids don't have $60(that I spent on the sticker album) or the insane amount I spent on opening day. And if they do, they buy a video game or yughio cards because at least you get something complete for that that is geared towards the child. And I can't say I blame them.

 

[200lbhockeyplayer]

Who is saying that the hobby is salvageable the way we know it (or once knew it)?

When I opened my first pack ('79-80 Topps Hockey)...I had sports to play, a bike, a few TV channels and books/magazines. Cards helped get my sports fix and brought me "closer" to the sports, the teams and the players I read about in the magazines or newspaper. Now I can choose from any number of cable sports exclusive stations, watch unlimited videos online, tweet a player, have instant gratification of photographs, information, etc. of various players...why do kids need cards today?

Sports cards aren't a game and really do nothing anymore to bring people closer to the player, sport or team. They used to be "trading cards" or "ball cards" - now they're "collectibles"...IE: trading cards without the fun.

Sure, a few comical attempts at digital cards with embedded video have been made, but who cares really when YouTube can produce hundreds of videos in an instant.

The notion of long-term "investing" helped pump up the hobby in the late 80s and 90s...then reality hit when 99.99% of those cards were worth pennies. The only good long-term investment in cards is vintage as everything else is short-term with an incredibly volatile market.

I think the hobby needs to reinvent itself from the outside and a clear big picture vision is needed...but this is 2013...we haven't cared about a "big picture" in anything in decades.

 

[predatorkj]

Who is saying that the hobby is salvageable the way we know it (or once knew it)?

When I opened my first pack ('79-80 Topps Hockey)...I had sports to play, a bike, a few TV channels and books/magazines. Cards helped get my sports fix and brought me "closer" to the sports, the teams and the players I read about in the magazines or newspaper. Now I can choose from any number of cable sports exclusive stations, watch unlimited videos online, tweet a player, have instant gratification of photographs, information, etc. of various players...why do kids need cards today?

Sports cards aren't a game and really do nothing anymore to bring people closer to the player, sport or team. They used to be "trading cards" or "ball cards" - now they're "collectibles"...IE: trading cards without the fun.

Well as child growing up in the 80's, I loved collecting because I was about the same as you when it came to what I had available. One of the things that brought me back into this hobby after so many years away was the chance to get autos of players or GU cards. In reality, it's just some scribbled ink or a piece of a ball/bat/jersey/cleat/hat/helmet/jacket/etc. And who the hell can prove the GU stuff is or ever was real? But they are novelty items IMO. I'm not paying thousands of dollars for this stuff. I'm paying a few bucks here or there. As for the autographs, I'll never get over the fact that I never have to be able to meet the player to be able to get his auto. Yes I'd like to meet them. But I'll take what I can get and be happy about it. I guess that's why the whole sticker argument never bothered me. And it's why I was happy as a lark to get back into the hobby. And if they stopped making stuff tomorrow(cards I mean), I'd be okay with that. I'd still have stuff to collect.

I'm not so sure the hobby needs to or even can reinvent itself. Maybe some of our expectations are too high. Kids collecting cards are a whole other animal. But as for us who aren't kids and do collect, it all goes back to the cycle of crap being so expensive that a collector can't casually bust wax. And people who do need to sell what they pull. That right there needs to stop. Not the busting and flipping. But the fact that it's damn near a necessity.

 

[jbhofmann]

A limited all base card release that the base set is the chase, not inserts.

792 Card Set
No autos/GU or inserts (except 1/1 parallel)
Every base card is serial#ed /50

39600 total cards in print run +792 1/1's
3960 total boxes of 1 card per pack/10 packs per box
396 total cases 10boxes/case
$7.99 pack MSRP = $79.90 box MSRP


The other 792 cards (base cards #ed /50) are randomly distributed in base Topps issues prior to actual product to generate a buzz for the upcoming release. Each of these are essentially 1/1s until the release of the product hits months later. This would create a buzz in the hobby surrounding "base" cards.


I understand it would be an extremely small batch of cards for them to create, but I really think something like this would be a monumental set.
50 total sets plus player collectors chasing these would create a huge buzz in the hobby.

 

[MansGame]

Who is saying that the hobby is salvageable the way we know it (or once knew it)?

When I opened my first pack ('79-80 Topps Hockey)...I had sports to play, a bike, a few TV channels and books/magazines. Cards helped get my sports fix and brought me "closer" to the sports, the teams and the players I read about in the magazines or newspaper. Now I can choose from any number of cable sports exclusive stations, watch unlimited videos online, tweet a player, have instant gratification of photographs, information, etc. of various players...why do kids need cards today?

Sports cards aren't a game and really do nothing anymore to bring people closer to the player, sport or team. They used to be "trading cards" or "ball cards" - now they're "collectibles"...IE: trading cards without the fun.

Sure, a few comical attempts at digital cards with embedded video have been made, but who cares really when YouTube can produce hundreds of videos in an instant.

The notion of long-term "investing" helped pump up the hobby in the late 80s and 90s...then reality hit when 99.99% of those cards were worth pennies. The only good long-term investment in cards is vintage as everything else is short-term with an incredibly volatile market.

I think the hobby needs to reinvent itself from the outside and a clear big picture vision is needed...but this is 2013...we haven't cared about a "big picture" in anything in decades.

 

[kerryfan5]

A limited all base card release that the base set is the chase, not inserts.

792 Card Set
No autos/GU or inserts (except 1/1 parallel)
Every base card is serial#ed /50

39600 total cards in print run +792 1/1's
3960 total boxes of 1 card per pack/10 packs per box
396 total cases 10boxes/case
$7.99 pack MSRP = $79.90 box MSRP


The other 792 cards (base cards #ed /50) are randomly distributed in base Topps issues prior to actual product to generate a buzz for the upcoming release. Each of these are essentially 1/1s until the release of the product hits months later. This would create a buzz in the hobby surrounding "base" cards.


I understand it would be an extremely small batch of cards for them to create, but I really think something like this would be a monumental set.
50 total sets plus player collectors chasing these would create a huge buzz in the hobby.

Why would you stop at 50 make it 500 serial numbered sets. 10x the print run makes a bigger print run equals more cash for Topps easier set to build if that is what is wanted. Just saying.

 

[MansGame]

A limited all base card release that the base set is the chase, not inserts.

792 Card Set
No autos/GU or inserts (except 1/1 parallel)
Every base card is serial#ed /50

39600 total cards in print run +792 1/1's
3960 total boxes of 1 card per pack/10 packs per box
396 total cases 10boxes/case
$7.99 pack MSRP = $79.90 box MSRP


The other 792 cards (base cards #ed /50) are randomly distributed in base Topps issues prior to actual product to generate a buzz for the upcoming release. Each of these are essentially 1/1s until the release of the product hits months later. This would create a buzz in the hobby surrounding "base" cards.


I understand it would be an extremely small batch of cards for them to create, but I really think something like this would be a monumental set.
50 total sets plus player collectors chasing these would create a huge buzz in the hobby.

Not a bad idea.

 

[jbhofmann]

Why would you stop at 50 make it 500 serial numbered sets. 10x the print run makes a bigger print run equals more cash for Topps easier set to build if that is what is wanted. Just saying.

Nope. Extremly limited print run. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 500 will still find the trash. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 50 becomes a chase for a master set collector.

 

[sruchris]

Nope. Extremly limited print run. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 500 will still find the trash. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 50 becomes a chase for a master set collector.

A print run of 50 is too few as flippers, breakers and hoaders would gobble boxes up and there wouldn't be very many left for actual collectors. Make it 300 and lower the MSRP to $5.

 

[predatorkj]

Nope. Extremly limited print run. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 500 will still find the trash. A base card of Corky Miller #ed to 50 becomes a chase for a master set collector.

Nah, too limited that way. At least make them numbered to a couple hundred. If you do only fifty, it's not going to allow many people to want to do it. Player collectors would deal with it as per usual but people trying to build the set would give up. And it seems like that's what you want them to do, actually collect the set, so making it too limited negates that.

What's scarier is that a base card has to be limited or serial numbered to be desired.

 

[jbhofmann]

Nah, too limited that way. At least make them numbered to a couple hundred. If you do only fifty, it's not going to allow many people to want to do it. Player collectors would deal with it as per usual but people trying to build the set would give up. And it seems like that's what you want them to do, actually collect the set, so making it too limited negates that.

What's scarier is that a base card has to be limited or serial numbered to be desired.

Nevermind. Let's not try something extreme.

 

[MansGame]

Nevermind. Let's not try something extreme.

::facepalm::

 

[gt2590]

A base set numbered to just 150 sounds great to me as part of a $10 per pack-type product.

But please limit "high end" ($99+ SRP) to just one product release per Company per year.

NT, Exquisite and Sterling or Inception would probably be better as one per year products instead of a ton of $100+ products, especially in hoops and football...

 

[predatorkj]

Nevermind. Let's not try something extreme.

Well it could be done but as a set collector, I'm not even entering into that insanity. The fact that topps itself is heavily collected and this stuff would be that limited would make it just about impossible and costly to collect. Is there fun in that?

 

[KCBeltranFan]

I've been guilty myself of hunting down relics and autos in a vain attempt to sell or trade out to things I half heartedly want. I really miss the days of set collecting and insert hunting. There were some Collectors Choice basketball sets in the mid 90s that were way too fun to put together. My all time favorite set to collect was that crazy 1991-92 Skybox. I know I went through way more packs than anyone should have, but I loved the design. They were cheap and a lot of fun. I think some part of that died when I decided to hunt questionable relics and autographs that mean nothing. Bah.

The hobby needs to follow the throwback to the days when it was more about fun than making a buck, but collectors really do too. Just my opinion.

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