move on please.

[matchpenalty]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

What is next Leaf release? Rose Collection, Lombardi collection, Ali Metal with Tyson autos???? Leaf mania is gonna be going crazy.

 

[TwinGnats]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

You're the first person I've ever thanked, I dig the Freinds reference.

"They're both autographs"

...THAT is your asinine argument?

I bet you used the same argument about women. "All women are the same" because all of them have functional holes and breasts. At least that was your justification for marrying your wife, who's undoubtedly horrendously fat and ugly

The line is a dot to you. Bad post friend.

 

[goldenegg1]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Sticker autos are just that. They are stickers! If I peel a Jeter sticker off a card and now put it on my Jeep, I now have a Derek Jeter signed Jeep. That is what companies are tryin to sell us isn't it? If leaf signs Barkley, that only drives up his autographics prices. Who in their right minds are going to pay more for an unlicensed sticker auto over an NBA licensed on card product. Same thing will happen with Ichiro autos. Sure they will be hot out of the gate, but long term value, UD won't be beat out by Leaf.

Ichiro and when BG gets Barkley. They won't be sticker autos. He's paying big cash to get cards hard signed.

He can pay all he wants for their autos, they aren't licensed, only driving the prices of UD cards and Fleer cards.
And if you think you are not going to get stickers of Ichiro, I have a feeling you will be disappointed.

 

[Ty Hope]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Off to work. Mini bump in case BG logs on today.

 

[boomo]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Off to work. Mini bump in case BG logs on today.

most pages of a leaf thread i can ever remember that brian didnt respond.
kind of unusual

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Ty,

I got your PM and obviously would have appreciated a chance to reply before the flamefest. Nonetheless, I will share that response for everyone here's benefit since you have brought them into it...
*****


Ty,

Figures you would hit one of these cards. At the 11th hour, I went through the checklist and rmeoved what I thought were drastically substandard autographs. They were cuts that barely made the checklist, however, I believed (and still do) that we added substantial value by doing exactly what we did with that card. Instead of getting an Ann B. Davis cut (Alice from Brady Bunch), you received an Electra/Rodman Double cut.

It cost me $1000's of dollars to do this, but overall it added value (and this has been done by numerous other companies in the past (so I wasnt breaking new ground).

I do not plan on doing this in future, as I have had mixed feedback which I am listening to.

The only time I see this happening in the future is if it allows us to bring a monster name (like Britney) to the product when she would be missing otherwise.

I hope this helps explain our thought process.
While I know you are likely to flame me on the board, I believe our thought process is solid.

I would be happy to take that card back from you and replace it with a sealed unopened pack from our customer service department (although I am not confident your pull would have more value, I know there are no "sticker cuts" in those packs)....

Let me know if that helps... BG

***

Thanks for the opportunity to share my thoughts.... BG

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Sticker autos are just that. They are stickers! If I peel a Jeter sticker off a card and now put it on my Jeep, I now have a Derek Jeter signed Jeep. That is what companies are tryin to sell us isn't it? If leaf signs Barkley, that only drives up his autographics prices. Who in their right minds are going to pay more for an unlicensed sticker auto over an NBA licensed on card product. Same thing will happen with Ichiro autos. Sure they will be hot out of the gate, but long term value, UD won't be beat out by Leaf.

Ichiro and when BG gets Barkley. They won't be sticker autos. He's paying big cash to get cards hard signed.

He can pay all he wants for their autos, they aren't licensed, only driving the prices of UD cards and Fleer cards.
And if you think you are not going to get stickers of Ichiro, I have a feeling you will be disappointed.

seeing as you have no clue what they are, the ichiros in metal and valiant are ON-CARD!!!!!!!
His autos in Legend of Sport are stickers (as we only get one signing and those cards cannot be completed in time)...
BG

 

[clayb31]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Everyone complained about redemptions...so the companies started using the stickers to cut down on the redemptions. Now we are complaining about the stickers so companies are trying to do more on card autos which means redemptions are on the rise again. Its always going to be easier to get a player to sit down once and sign 1000 stickers rather than sit down 10 times to sign 100 cards each time. Stickers and redemtions both are horrible but there is a direct correlation between the two. I feel like the companies are trying to give us what we want....but as consumers we are never going to be happy until there are no redemptions and no stickers.....which will unfortunately never happen.

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

p.s.-

There IS an argument that stickers still mounted to the backing (or mounted to index) are cuts...
It may not be a popular position, but an argument can be made.
The definition of a cut in this hobby has been stretched like a rubber band (beyond traditional definitions)....

With that being said, we always listen to feedback... Short of Britney or a mega-star, there should be no stickers in future cut products.... (although there may be 2 Cam in Sports Icons)...BG

 

[Super Mario]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Plain and simple a sticker auto is NOT a cut auto and therefor should NOT have been inserted in a Cut product.

 

[ronzo]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Everyone complained about redemptions...so the companies started using the stickers to cut down on the redemptions. Now we are complaining about the stickers so companies are trying to do more on card autos which means redemptions are on the rise again. Its always going to be easier to get a player to sit down once and sign 1000 stickers rather than sit down 10 times to sign 100 cards each time. Stickers and redemtions both are horrible but there is a direct correlation between the two. I feel like the companies are trying to give us what we want....but as consumers we are never going to be happy until there are no redemptions and no stickers.....which will unfortunately never happen.

That would be nice if stickers ever cut down on redemptions. Half of the redemptions now are for stickers anyways, it's just companies don't care anymore. People buy it regardless of what's included so why should they?

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Everyone complained about redemptions...so the companies started using the stickers to cut down on the redemptions. Now we are complaining about the stickers so companies are trying to do more on card autos which means redemptions are on the rise again. Its always going to be easier to get a player to sit down once and sign 1000 stickers rather than sit down 10 times to sign 100 cards each time. Stickers and redemtions both are horrible but there is a direct correlation between the two. I feel like the companies are trying to give us what we want....but as consumers we are never going to be happy until there are no redemptions and no stickers.....which will unfortunately never happen.

Not only easier, but sometimes the only way a deal is done (all the below were rejected when we asked to send cards to be hard-signed at future dates)...

BRITNEY
HARRISON FORD
LINDSEY LOHAN
KATE BECKINSALE

We get one signing... no way we can print 2 years worth of cards for a single signing (and often, the signing has to happen days after doing deal and we couldnt even print cards if we wanted to)....

BG

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Plain and simple a sticker auto is NOT a cut auto and therefor should NOT have been inserted in a Cut product.

Well, if Sam says it isnt a cut..... I guess it cannot even be debated.

I appreciate your opinion, but lots of people have opinions and sometimes they arent the same....
actually, if the sticker is never pealed from the original backing and the backing and we cut the backing (paper) and insert, this is exactly the same as cutting a piece of paper. How different is the sticker on the original paper than the gloss on an 8x10? Again, you can disagree, but it is still a debate..... (even if the opinion is 75%-25%)

I have gotten plenty of emails from people who were appreciative once they learned they hit these instead of a $15 ebay cut.

Outside of TY, not one person has expressed an interest in returning it for an Ann B. Davis cut...

Generally, consumers who have contacted us have preferred the "sticker cut" to the "photo cut" when the value was 3-10X more on the sticker cut.

BG

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Everyone complained about redemptions...so the companies started using the stickers to cut down on the redemptions. Now we are complaining about the stickers so companies are trying to do more on card autos which means redemptions are on the rise again. Its always going to be easier to get a player to sit down once and sign 1000 stickers rather than sit down 10 times to sign 100 cards each time. Stickers and redemtions both are horrible but there is a direct correlation between the two. I feel like the companies are trying to give us what we want....but as consumers we are never going to be happy until there are no redemptions and no stickers.....which will unfortunately never happen.

That would be nice if stickers ever cut down on redemptions. Half of the redemptions now are for stickers anyways, it's just companies don't care anymore. People buy it regardless of what's included so why should they?

In defense of the other companies who rely on stickers far more than us, manufacturing is FAR MORE DIFFICULT than you can imagine... There are too many moving pieces to coordinate for all to cgo swimmingly.

The celebrities/athletes cannot get shipments of cards every week to sign. They just wont do the deals.

The celebrities/athletes are not sitting at home waiting for me, Topps or anyone else to ship stuff to sign... we have to work around them...

The factories that print/package are so jam packed booked we cannot miss print dates or it could result in items being pushed back MONTHS in some cases.... collectors hate delays (and companies cannot afford the float) too....

The cost efficiencies to print (and keep product affordable) require whole sets to be printed at once... Therefore, if a player cannot sign in the window as others can. He either signs stickers or gets redemptions...

Trust me, it aint easy... we do more on-card as percentage than the big 3.... It aint easy.... BG

 

[boomo]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Plain and simple a sticker auto is NOT a cut auto and therefor should NOT have been inserted in a Cut product.

Well, if Sam says it isnt a cut..... I guess it cannot even be debated.

I appreciate your opinion, but lots of people have opinions and sometimes they arent the same....

I have gotten plenty of emails from people who were appreciative once they learned they hit these instead of a $15 ebay cut.

Outside of TY, not one person has expressed an interest in returning it for an Ann B. Davis cut...

Generally, consumers who have contacted us have preferred the "sticker cut" to the "photo cut" when the value was 3-10X more on the sticker cut.

BG

id be on an Ann B Davis cut like a bulldog on a pork chop

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Plain and simple a sticker auto is NOT a cut auto and therefor should NOT have been inserted in a Cut product.

Well, if Sam says it isnt a cut..... I guess it cannot even be debated.

I appreciate your opinion, but lots of people have opinions and sometimes they arent the same....

I have gotten plenty of emails from people who were appreciative once they learned they hit these instead of a $15 ebay cut.

Outside of TY, not one person has expressed an interest in returning it for an Ann B. Davis cut...

Generally, consumers who have contacted us have preferred the "sticker cut" to the "photo cut" when the value was 3-10X more on the sticker cut.

BG

id be on an Ann B Davis cut like a bulldog on a pork chop

I can build ya an executive cut of her...
BG

 

[Leaf]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

heading to dinner.... will be in chatroom later tonight to debate this, and other fun topics... maybe Ill share some names weve signed for Metal Draft!!!!!!

BG

 

[HPC]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

p.s.-

There IS an argument that stickers still mounted to the backing (or mounted to index) are cuts...
It may not be a popular position, but an argument can be made.
The definition of a cut in this hobby has been stretched like a rubber band (beyond traditional definitions)....

With that being said, we always listen to feedback... Short of Britney or a mega-star, there should be no stickers in future cut products.... (although there may be 2 Cam in Sports Icons)...BG

I certainly respect your opinions, and you know more about making/producing and getting cards signed than I do.

However, an arguement that a sticker auto mounted to backing is a "cut" auto, is ridiculous and in my opinion for a company to take the side that it is a cut auto is lazy.

Cut auto is just that: "cut" from a document. Earlier cut autos were always from historical documents or checks. Just because a company manufactuers some checks to make it look cut doesnt change what it is: a card manufactured to look like a check. Also, most cut autos are from persons deceased.

Is there an instance where a sticker auto could be considered a "cut auto"? Sure. I could see a Cory Lidle sticker auto maybe being considered a cut, or Pat Tillman. But not people like Rodman or Electra

 

[MisterT]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

Brian -

Let me preface this with 2 things. 1. I am one of the people who thinks that a sticker and a cut are not the same. 2. You have represented yourself and your company well in all the threads I have seen you in.

That being said, I think we are in an emotional/philosophical argument here and the best thing to do is let it end. There is no winning. Your offer to Ty is fair - keep your card or return it for a sealed package. Done.

I do expect however, that if stickers appear in future products, other than in the situations you have described, you will have a serious backlash from some of your best customers.

 

[Adamsince1981]

Re: Seriously Leaf... (calling BG) pic added

7 pages of nothing but differing opinions about a minor "issue."

Sad, considering this was a simple customer service issue, Brian is very easy to contact, and Ty knows this.