The final word on the 2010 Bowman Wrapper Redemption

[kentuckyderby]

Some bought by the case to make money
Mistake #1
That's what happens when a hobby is turned into a profession

Cannot expect to make money and be guaranteed a profit by ripping

On side note, BDP has been very good to me last few years and I feel Topps has done a very solid job with BDP over last few years

Again, if Topps blatantly lied, shame on them
If the value of Tops stuff declined due to market or because more cards are out there than you estimated, oh well

Again, how many of you (us) send money back to Topps when extra goodies included in BDP past couple years?

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones

As a customer of Topps (which I am, I broke multiple cases 2010 Bowman Chrome), I EXPECT not to be lied to.
I feel perfectly comfortable throwing rocks, because I too am held accountable the same way being a fellow manufacturer.
Feel free to call me out if I pull these stunts... I can tell you I have learned from any and all mistakes Ive made. The question is will they learn (or better yet, will you demand this not happen again)...... BG

feel free to call you out??????????
Um I did and you ran to a mod and got me suspended on a regular basis even though every single one of my points = FACT (ie that metal mirrored sig series, that some of the completed auctions by you = misleading while mine were the exact prices, etc)
I do have to admit that you have learned from your faults. Kudos
In regards to me demanding this not happen again, I guess I don't know where the lies are
I see overproduction but I am not sure where the intentional and deliberate lies are (but then again, I have been super busy and haven't really been paying much attention)

I see those who bought big time in pre sells be upset because buying wax wasn't an automatic profit like it was past few years

If someone can tell me where the blatant lies were, then I could get a better picture

On a sidenote, how many of the WSOP redemptions in Razor poker turned in? Would love to see how that turns out. Always enjoy the WSOP season

 

[kentuckyderby]

The fact remains...Topps has lied and misled everyone this year regarding most of their baseball products.

Whether you choose to believe it or not is another story.

They didn't intentionally deceive.

It's sort of like this:

All throughout junior and senior high school, I never studied very much - just enough to get myself to college. Once I got there, all of my BSing couldn't get me a passing grade so I had to actually do work to succeed.

That describes the situation with Topps.

They are in college right now and have yet to open the text books to study.

If those books remain closed, then they will fail out of school.

This is totally horse crap...
They stated the USA buybacks were in packs. They knew one week prior to ship they werent in there and said nothing.
Its a LIE by OMISSION. They're lucky there hasnt been a lawsuit........ yet.
BG

BG- Did Buster Posey USA jersey ever make it into LETTERMAN or was the one sold separately on ebay the only one?

 

[kentuckyderby]

[quote="Crash Davis":1gsmkxoo]

The lawsuit talk regarding the USA buybacks not being inserted in packs is a bit silly. I don't see there really being any damages, particularly since the wrapper redemption program exists. I'm actually happy they did it this way as it provides a bonus not only for box sellers but also for folks who rip chrome and can now get extra value out of a box.

The wrapper redemption program does NOT eliminate the damage of blatant false and misleading advertising.
While one person's damage is miniscule, the collective damages are massive. More importantly, the punitive damages could be substantial. See the post above by the astute member that points out Topps' misleading tweets even after release.

I certainly am not saying to sue anyone...
The hobby doesnt need those black eyes of public fighting...
It needs crap like this to just stop.
BG

Brian - I didn't know that you were a lawyer. Which law school did you graduate from?

Did you know that people with money are actually allowed to call lawyers for opinions?
BG

Actually, people without money can call Lawyers for opinions, as well.

Whether or not they give one to you is their choice.

LOL....
They answer when I call. I guess the $300/hr I waste does the trick.

Crash, nothing against you personally. I am only pissed because I collect/invest in Chrome. Pisses me off to be misled because NO OTHER companies would get away with it. I just don't understand why people refuse to be sympathetic to people who feel (and were, even if unintentionally) misled.BG[/quote:1gsmkxoo]


That sums up my feeling for what happened with Sig and Metal and that was INTENTIONAL and not unintentional
Yeah yeah I know some haters are going to muscle down on me for bringing my complaints back (and some dead horse jokes) but i just cannot sit back and read comments from BG when so many make me shake head considering what happened with razor

 

[hofmichael]

I do not see any law firm devoting any serious resources to this. The damages, if any, are unlikely to make it worthwhile. For those who might want to know, I am a lawyer, though I don't care to tout that fact on these boards.

Damn James we were just starting to get to like you to.

 

[kentuckyderby]

[quote="Crash Davis"18d3ipj]

[quote="Crash Davis"18d3ipj]

[quote="James52411"18d3ipj]The lawsuit talk regarding the USA buybacks not being inserted in packs is a bit silly. I don't see there really being any damages, particularly since the wrapper redemption program exists. I'm actually happy they did it this way as it provides a bonus not only for box sellers but also for folks who rip chrome and can now get extra value out of a box.

The wrapper redemption program does NOT eliminate the damage of blatant false and misleading advertising.
While one person's damage is miniscule, the collective damages are massive. More importantly, the punitive damages could be substantial. See the post above by the astute member that points out Topps' misleading tweets even after release.

I certainly am not saying to sue anyone...
The hobby doesnt need those black eyes of public fighting...
It needs crap like this to just stop.
BG

Brian - I didn't know that you were a lawyer. Which law school did you graduate from?

Did you know that people with money are actually allowed to call lawyers for opinions?
BG

Actually, people without money can call Lawyers for opinions, as well.

Whether or not they give one to you is their choice.

LOL....
They answer when I call. I guess the $300/hr I waste does the trick.

Crash, nothing against you personally. I am only pissed because I collect/invest in Chrome. Pisses me off to be misled because NO OTHER companies would get away with it. I just don't understand why people refuse to be sympathetic to people who feel (and were, even if unintentionally) misled.

BG[/quote18d3ipj]

$300 per hour? Man, I have a lot of friends and colleagues who are lawyers, so I don't pay for my legal advice, not that I have needed any.

I understand your gripe speaking from a collector's perspective.

In this day and age, it's a shame that the quality control can't be better than it is. Maybe they should outsource it to India.[/quote18d3ipj]

I actually pay $225-450 depending on the subject and the lawyer, my intellectual property guys charge mondo bucks!
I guess thats what a top 5 law firm gets ya for!

Honestly, Topps and Leaf are the only two companies that make can make "Chrome" style cards now (we call it metal).
In their defense, we too are having quality problems however we are not going to release anything until everything is just right.
BG

p.s.- I was speaking as a collector/investor. My only gripe as a manufacturer is that my customers are hurt by this whole unfortunate situation.[/quote18d3ipj]


Razor cannot make Metal?
In regards to comment about Topps should unpack everything and fix their error....didn't a certain company refuse to unpack everything and/or refuse to hold off on distribution even though they first promised that Oval Office cards would be in pouches but then it turned out the wooden boxes were the incorrect size and distribution still went on?

 

[JoshHamilton]

Hey *********, this is a thread about Topps. Not Razor.

If you want to whine about how Razor wronged you, start your own thread. Hopefully it'll get you permanently banned this time

 

[matfanofold]

Hey *********, this is a thread about Topps. Not Razor.

If you want to whine about how Razor wronged you, start your own thread. Hopefully it'll get you permanently banned this time

This thread was about Topps wrapper redemptions. It's taken a life of it's own since page 1. And although KD is kicking a dead horse, in which this is not the place for that and I have a feeling he will not continue, he has a point. However, perhaps you should worry about yourself and the unprovoked name calling.

Matter of fact, this thread better get back on track or it will end.

 

[hofmichael]

Hey *********, this is a thread about Topps. Not Razor.

If you want to whine about how Razor wronged you, start your own thread. Hopefully it'll get you permanently banned this time

This thread was about Topps wrapper redemptions. It's taken a life of it's own since page 1. And although KD is kicking a dead horse, in which this is not the place for that and I have a feeling he will not continue, he has a point. However, perhaps you should worry about yourself and the unprovoked name calling.

Matter of fact, this thread better get back on track or it will end.

And that's the bottom line...

 

[kentuckyderby]

Hey *********, this is a thread about Topps. Not Razor.

If you want to whine about how Razor wronged you, start your own thread. Hopefully it'll get you permanently banned this time

This thread was about Topps wrapper redemptions. It's taken a life of it's own since page 1. And although KD is kicking a dead horse, in which this is not the place for that and I have a feeling he will not continue, he has a point. However, perhaps you should worry about yourself and the unprovoked name calling.

Matter of fact, this thread better get back on track or it will end.

Correct. Seems like a bunch of posts all at once but just got home and wanted to respond
I'm done unless I read something that makes me HAVE to respond

The ********* comment.....no sweat. If I respected him it might actually matter

Anyway, NFL football tonight!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[James52411]

I do not see any law firm devoting any serious resources to this. The damages, if any, are unlikely to make it worthwhile. For those who might want to know, I am a lawyer, though I don't care to tout that fact on these boards.

Damn James we were just starting to get to like you to.

Good one, Michael

By the way, to get "back on track" let me just say that the wrapper redemption for this product is very strong. You have around 2K autos available via wrapper redemption and the parallels are going to have some value too. Even if the USA buyback autos weren't via redemption it would be pretty nice.

 

[AMAZIN HOF COLLECTOR]

I guarantee you the Better Business Bureau would be interested in a company that generates pre-sales based upon XYZ, but then pulls out Z without notification. So the lawyer talk isn't silly at all and it wouldn't be that hard to prove damages - at least until the whole wrapper redemption comes into play. That would obviously muddy the waters.

Its obvious they dont care about there rating with the better business bureau, check out the link below:

http://www.dc.bbb.org/report.html?natio ... =S10014615


Nice "F" rating Topps! Found it kind of funny.

Another big Ffor their NY address as well :evil:

http://www.bbb.org/new-york-city/busine ... k-ny-1147/

 

[Leaf]

Some bought by the case to make money
Mistake #1
That's what happens when a hobby is turned into a profession

Cannot expect to make money and be guaranteed a profit by ripping

On side note, BDP has been very good to me last few years and I feel Topps has done a very solid job with BDP over last few years

Again, if Topps blatantly lied, shame on them
If the value of Tops stuff declined due to market or because more cards are out there than you estimated, oh well

Again, how many of you (us) send money back to Topps when extra goodies included in BDP past couple years?

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones

As a customer of Topps (which I am, I broke multiple cases 2010 Bowman Chrome), I EXPECT not to be lied to.
I feel perfectly comfortable throwing rocks, because I too am held accountable the same way being a fellow manufacturer.
Feel free to call me out if I pull these stunts... I can tell you I have learned from any and all mistakes Ive made. The question is will they learn (or better yet, will you demand this not happen again)...... BG

feel free to call you out??????????
Um I did and you ran to a mod and got me suspended on a regular basis even though every single one of my points = FACT (ie that metal mirrored sig series, that some of the completed auctions by you = misleading while mine were the exact prices, etc)
I do have to admit that you have learned from your faults. Kudos
In regards to me demanding this not happen again, I guess I don't know where the lies are
I see overproduction but I am not sure where the intentional and deliberate lies are (but then again, I have been super busy and haven't really been paying much attention)

I see those who bought big time in pre sells be upset because buying wax wasn't an automatic profit like it was past few years

If someone can tell me where the blatant lies were, then I could get a better picture

On a sidenote, how many of the WSOP redemptions in Razor poker turned in? Would love to see how that turns out. Always enjoy the WSOP season

The problem is them stating something would be put in packs, never inserted, then Topps stating on Twitter to open more as they are definately in there.
That is the "lie" as you called it.
BG

* PM and ill answer other questions.. want to stay on topic

 

[Leaf]

On a more positive note, what will the buybacks bring? I am buying Taillon!!!!!! I am breaking 3 more cases, so I guess Ill be entering the lottery with the rest of yall...
BG

 

[011873]

Ive been debating the the past few days "do I or dont I" for another BC case.

A couple of my guys broke another case each and I was tempted but its just so damn boring once the auto is found due to lack of color or even prospect refractor.

 

[SportsCardMojo]

Ive been debating the the past few days "do I or dont I" for another BC case.

A couple of my guys broke another case each and I was tempted but its just so damn boring once the auto is found due to lack of color or even prospect refractor.

I feel the same way. Do I want to be a glutton for punishment...or wait and save my money on BDP and stuff for next year. But with cases so cheap and this wrapper redemption, it's killing me.

 

[kentuckyderby]

Some bought by the case to make money
Mistake #1
That's what happens when a hobby is turned into a profession

Cannot expect to make money and be guaranteed a profit by ripping

On side note, BDP has been very good to me last few years and I feel Topps has done a very solid job with BDP over last few years

Again, if Topps blatantly lied, shame on them
If the value of Tops stuff declined due to market or because more cards are out there than you estimated, oh well

Again, how many of you (us) send money back to Topps when extra goodies included in BDP past couple years?

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones

As a customer of Topps (which I am, I broke multiple cases 2010 Bowman Chrome), I EXPECT not to be lied to.
I feel perfectly comfortable throwing rocks, because I too am held accountable the same way being a fellow manufacturer.
Feel free to call me out if I pull these stunts... I can tell you I have learned from any and all mistakes Ive made. The question is will they learn (or better yet, will you demand this not happen again)...... BG

feel free to call you out??????????
Um I did and you ran to a mod and got me suspended on a regular basis even though every single one of my points = FACT (ie that metal mirrored sig series, that some of the completed auctions by you = misleading while mine were the exact prices, etc)
I do have to admit that you have learned from your faults. Kudos
In regards to me demanding this not happen again, I guess I don't know where the lies are
I see overproduction but I am not sure where the intentional and deliberate lies are (but then again, I have been super busy and haven't really been paying much attention)

I see those who bought big time in pre sells be upset because buying wax wasn't an automatic profit like it was past few years

If someone can tell me where the blatant lies were, then I could get a better picture

On a sidenote, how many of the WSOP redemptions in Razor poker turned in? Would love to see how that turns out. Always enjoy the WSOP season

The problem is them stating something would be put in packs, never inserted, then Topps stating on Twitter to open more as they are definately in there.
That is the "lie" as you called it.
BG

* PM and ill answer other questions.. want to stay on topic

gracias for the clarification and quick summary

 

[Juddy]

Do y'all think the wrapper redemption will be enough to soak up all of the excess cases in the marketplace?

 

[mancini79]

Do y'all think the wrapper redemption will be enough to soak up all of the excess cases in the marketplace?

NO, but every little thing is going to help.

 

[ThoseBackPages]

the cases will sell eventually. didnt all the 2008 BC cases sell eventually?

 

[PeteD]

I was informed of something that I had overlooked before.


The black border parallels, are paper stock, not chrome.

The inserts are on Chrome, though.

yep

Maybe this means the borders are just like this yr's, that frame the chrome and look like paper stock (or are) but the rest is chrome. Instead of having black ref looking borders like Topps Chrome does?