Which Current Hall Of Famer Is Most Undeserving?

[nosterbor]

he was the greatest at short i ever saw! no question about that. ask a Cards fan from the 80's with the game on the line in the 9th with men on and the OZ came up. i lived with one, my Father. he would turn the tv OFF!

 

[nosterbor]

he was the greatest at short i ever saw! no question about that. ask a Cards fan from the 80's with the game on the line in the 9th with men on and the OZ came up. i lived with one, my Father. he would turn the tv OFF!
p.s. you can cost your team a loss offensively

 

[SilverandBlack]

Ozzie Smith isn't just there for his defensive play, but also how he brought fans into the game and touched it with his personality more than the average player. He's very deserving for the mark he left on baseball, if not taking his defensive ability into account.

Yeah people like to spend time looking at certain stats but forget there are a lot of HOF criteria...
Voting is based on the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character. Contributions to the teams he played on is also considered.

Just ask Albert Belle.

Exactly. Hence my contention that Ty Cobb and Cap Anson are undeserving.

This one if the dumbest posts ive seen on these boards ever. Ty Cobb is arguably the greatest player ever to play the game and you say he doesnt deserve it because he was a jerk. Have you ever read anything about pre war baseball? There are several guys in the hall that were known to associate with mobsters and gamblers there are also guys that had huge drinking and drug problems. Look at Babe Ruth he was a drunk and cheated on his wife any chance he got as well as loved to gamble. So saying Cobb doesnt belong in because of his off the field behavior would take several dozen guys out of the hall as well.

 

[scotty21690]

Ozzie Smith isn't just there for his defensive play, but also how he brought fans into the game and touched it with his personality more than the average player. He's very deserving for the mark he left on baseball, if not taking his defensive ability into account.

Yeah people like to spend time looking at certain stats but forget there are a lot of HOF criteria...
Voting is based on the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character. Contributions to the teams he played on is also considered.

Just ask Albert Belle.

Exactly. Hence my contention that Ty Cobb and Cap Anson are undeserving.

This one if the dumbest posts ive seen on these boards ever. Ty Cobb is arguably the greatest player ever to play the game and you say he doesnt deserve it because he was a jerk. Have you ever read anything about pre war baseball? There are several guys in the hall that were known to associate with mobsters and gamblers there are also guys that had huge drinking and drug problems. Look at Babe Ruth he was a drunk and cheated on his wife any chance he got as well as loved to gamble. So saying Cobb doesnt belong in because of his off the field behavior would take several dozen guys out of the hall as well.

Agreed 100%.

maxpower gets the ::facepalm:: of the day award...

 

[LaBlueFan]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

BUT........................Drug Problems weren't part of Ozzie's Game. Ozzie was a Fan Favorite as well as one Hell of a ShortStop. Probably the Best Defensively to play the game from the late 70's through the 80's.

Just my .02

Dave

 

[scotty21690]

George Herman Ruth

Who is that....Babe Ruths uncle?

 

[nosterbor]

Ozzie Smith isn't just there for his defensive play, but also how he brought fans into the game and touched it with his personality more than the average player. He's very deserving for the mark he left on baseball, if not taking his defensive ability into account.

Yeah people like to spend time looking at certain stats but forget there are a lot of HOF criteria...
Voting is based on the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character. Contributions to the teams he played on is also considered.

Just ask Albert Belle.

Exactly. Hence my contention that Ty Cobb and Cap Anson are undeserving.

This one if the dumbest posts ive seen on these boards ever. Ty Cobb is arguably the greatest player ever to play the game and you say he doesnt deserve it because he was a jerk. Have you ever read anything about pre war baseball? There are several guys in the hall that were known to associate with mobsters and gamblers there are also guys that had huge drinking and drug problems. Look at Babe Ruth he was a drunk and cheated on his wife any chance he got as well as loved to gamble. So saying Cobb doesnt belong in because of his off the field behavior would take several dozen guys out of the hall as well.

you have been thanked! i have been harping this for 8 years now! and they want to bring up the PED crap and cheats and such of the players of the 90's. most of the crap that went on in the 20's and 30's was swept under the rug. and what the hell was Ruth on that he could hit more hr than 3-5 teams combined? he was not a GOD!

 

[elmalo]

he was the greatest at short i ever saw! no question about that. ask a Cards fan from the 80's with the game on the line in the 9th with men on and the OZ came up. i lived with one, my Father. he would turn the tv OFF!
p.s. you can cost your team a loss offensively

No, you cannot cost your team a game offensively. Defensively yes, offensively no.

 

[elmalo]

Ozzie Smith isn't just there for his defensive play, but also how he brought fans into the game and touched it with his personality more than the average player. He's very deserving for the mark he left on baseball, if not taking his defensive ability into account.

Yeah people like to spend time looking at certain stats but forget there are a lot of HOF criteria...
Voting is based on the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character. Contributions to the teams he played on is also considered.

Just ask Albert Belle.

Exactly. Hence my contention that Ty Cobb and Cap Anson are undeserving.

This one if the dumbest posts ive seen on these boards ever. Ty Cobb is arguably the greatest player ever to play the game and you say he doesnt deserve it because he was a jerk. Have you ever read anything about pre war baseball? There are several guys in the hall that were known to associate with mobsters and gamblers there are also guys that had huge drinking and drug problems. Look at Babe Ruth he was a drunk and cheated on his wife any chance he got as well as loved to gamble. So saying Cobb doesnt belong in because of his off the field behavior would take several dozen guys out of the hall as well.

you have been thanked! i have been harping this for 8 years now! and they want to bring up the PED crap and cheats and such of the players of the 90's. most of the crap that went on in the 20's and 30's was swept under the rug. and what the hell was Ruth on that he could hit more hr than 3-5 teams combined? he was not a GOD!

Are you suggesting that Ruth was on something? What was around back then that he could have been on?

 

[elmalo]

Ozzie Smith isn't just there for his defensive play, but also how he brought fans into the game and touched it with his personality more than the average player. He's very deserving for the mark he left on baseball, if not taking his defensive ability into account.

Yeah people like to spend time looking at certain stats but forget there are a lot of HOF criteria...
Voting is based on the player's record, playing ability, integrity, sportsmanship and character. Contributions to the teams he played on is also considered.

Just ask Albert Belle.

Exactly. Hence my contention that Ty Cobb and Cap Anson are undeserving.

This one if the dumbest posts ive seen on these boards ever. Ty Cobb is arguably the greatest player ever to play the game and you say he doesnt deserve it because he was a jerk. Have you ever read anything about pre war baseball? There are several guys in the hall that were known to associate with mobsters and gamblers there are also guys that had huge drinking and drug problems. Look at Babe Ruth he was a drunk and cheated on his wife any chance he got as well as loved to gamble. So saying Cobb doesnt belong in because of his off the field behavior would take several dozen guys out of the hall as well.

A lot of people dont realize how nasty baseball was, especially pre 20's. And how nasty the players were. Rube Marquard, Hal Chase, John McGraw. It was a different ball game and a different caracter who played it. On and off the field.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

how bad of a hitter was The OZ?
Outs Made s c a p y
...
Career 7528 (25th)
his .328 slug % lifetime i could not find where that ranks all time. it only goes to 999th and that is .3913. like i said he was an EASY out! how many games did he cost his team with his atrocious hitting?

What's interesting is seeing guys on that career list:
Rank Player Outs Made
1. Pete Rose 10328
2. Hank Aaron+ 9136
3. Carl Yastrzemski+ 9126
4. Cal Ripken+ 8893
5. Eddie Murray+ 8569
6. Rickey Henderson+ 8510
7. Dave Winfield+ 8422
8. Robin Yount+ 8415
9. Brooks Robinson+ 8340
10. Craig Biggio 8272
11. Omar Vizquel 8171
12. Luis Aparicio+ 8110
13. Willie Mays+ 8056
14. Paul Molitor+ 8040
15. Rabbit Maranville+ 7906
16. Rafael Palmeiro 7858
17. Lou Brock+ 7823
18. Ty Cobb+ 7748
19. Stan Musial+ 7704
20. George Brett+ 7673
21. Reggie Jackson+ 7659
22. Andre Dawson+ 7621
23. Al Kaline+ 7594
24. Frank Robinson+ 7529
25. Ozzie Smith+ 7528
26. Rusty Staub 7509
27. Harold Baines 7482
28. Tony Perez+ 7462
29. Ken Griffey 7398

Some pretty good guys on this list even if people think the stat is negative.

 

[uniquebaseballcards]

A lot of people dont realize how nasty baseball was, especially pre 20's. And how nasty the players were. Rube Marquard, Hal Chase, John McGraw. It was a different ball game and a different caracter who played it. On and off the field.

Yes, and society was more than a little rougher than today...Belle was just born 100 years too late.

 

[elmalo]

A lot of people dont realize how nasty baseball was, especially pre 20's. And how nasty the players were. Rube Marquard, Hal Chase, John McGraw. It was a different ball game and a different caracter who played it. On and off the field.

Yes, and society was more than a little rougher than today...Belle was just born 100 years too late.

Alberte Belle was the man. I think he should be in.

 

[mancini79]

Well. First of all, I discount All-Star appearances and MVP shares because voting is not always accurate and often (especially in the case of All-Star voting) bias.

I have to disagree. The HOF represents a players impact to their respected era for fans to appreciate. In Ozzie's case, he was voted by the fans 15 times! Sure you can make a case that he didn't deserve some of the years, but you can't deny his popularity during that time. Jeter didn't deserve either AS or GG this year, but his legacy is what got him there. That has to account for something.

 

[bodiaz]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

This is just wrong on many levels. I bet if you asked any pitcher from that era who they would chose, a majority of the m would say Ozzie. I know a guy who pitched for St Louis in the early 80's and he told me there was no one like Ozzie. His defense won games.

That is not the point! Any GM that would take Ozzie in the first round would be out on his ass! Any GM would draft the non HOFers I mentioned over Ozzie.

 

[elmalo]

Well. First of all, I discount All-Star appearances and MVP shares because voting is not always accurate and often (especially in the case of All-Star voting) bias.

I have to disagree. The HOF represents a players impact to their respected era for fans to appreciate. In Ozzie's case, he was voted by the fans 15 times! Sure you can make a case that he didn't deserve some of the years, but you can't deny his popularity during that time. Jeter didn't deserve either AS or GG this year, but his legacy is what got him there. That has to account for something.

Wasnt Jeter hitting over .300 at the all star break? Who deserved to play ahead of him? And the Gold Glove is voted on by managers and players, I think they know what they are talking about.

 

[elmalo]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

This is just wrong on many levels. I bet if you asked any pitcher from that era who they would chose, a majority of the m would say Ozzie. I know a guy who pitched for St Louis in the early 80's and he told me there was no one like Ozzie. His defense won games.

That is not the point! Any GM that would take Ozzie in the first round would be out on his ass! Any GM would draft the non HOFers I mentioned over Ozzie.

Any GM would take 2 Flash in the pan players with off field problems, or a couple of good starting pitchers one with injury problems over a 16 year hall of famer who was te greatest player at the most difficult position in the game?

 

[elmalo]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

This is just wrong on many levels. I bet if you asked any pitcher from that era who they would chose, a majority of the m would say Ozzie. I know a guy who pitched for St Louis in the early 80's and he told me there was no one like Ozzie. His defense won games.

That is not the point! Any GM that would take Ozzie in the first round would be out on his ass! Any GM would draft the non HOFers I mentioned over Ozzie.

Any GM would take 2 Flash in the pan players with off field problems, or a couple of good starting pitchers one with injury problems over a 16 year hall of famer who was te greatest player at the most difficult position in the game?

 

[nosterbor]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

This is just wrong on many levels. I bet if you asked any pitcher from that era who they would chose, a majority of the m would say Ozzie. I know a guy who pitched for St Louis in the early 80's and he told me there was no one like Ozzie. His defense won games.

That is not the point! Any GM that would take Ozzie in the first round would be out on his ass! Any GM would draft the non HOFers I mentioned over Ozzie.

Any GM would take 2 Flash in the pan players with off field problems, or a couple of good starting pitchers one with injury problems over a 16 year hall of famer who was te greatest player at the most difficult position in the game?

the most difficult position in the game?

uhhhh NO catcher!

 

[bodiaz]

Ozzie Smith

+1

He is the sole reason I will never visit Cooperstown! It is a farce that he got over 90% of the vote first ballot! If you had a draft of all of the players in the 80's, this guy would not go in the 1st round. Alot of non hofer's like Jack Morris, Bret Saberhagen, Doc Gooden, Daryl Strawberry and many others would be drafted higher!

This is just wrong on many levels. I bet if you asked any pitcher from that era who they would chose, a majority of the m would say Ozzie. I know a guy who pitched for St Louis in the early 80's and he told me there was no one like Ozzie. His defense won games.

That is not the point! Any GM that would take Ozzie in the first round would be out on his ass! Any GM would draft the non HOFers I mentioned over Ozzie.

Any GM would take 2 Flash in the pan players with off field problems, or a couple of good starting pitchers one with injury problems over a 16 year hall of famer who was te greatest player at the most difficult position in the game?

He was not even close to the greatest at his position! If he played in the AL, he may have made 2 or 3 All Star games. Ripken, Trammell, Fernandez, Yount were all better players. Templeton and Larkin were better for that matter, Ozzie did back flips, fans are stupid. That explains his popularity.