World Series Game 6 Thread (BOS v STL, Sox lead 3-2)

[scotty216brs]

I don't think Middlebrooks could have done anything to avoid the call. And the call was correct. Shat just happens sometimes. Unfortunate timing, but this kind of minutia of rule interpretation is one of the reasons I love baseball.

Yeah, it's unfortunate because I don't think the call could have been avoided but sometimes the show must go on. Red Sox are going to play their hearts out tonight, I'll tell you that. Gotta love October baseball.

 

[George_Calfas]

World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

......I will also add that this has been a great last 2 games. The move Farrell made that I did not like was taking Felix out of the game. He should have batted 3rd in the 7th (no outs and no one on) instead of Gomes. This would have saved the short guys and extended Felix.

Props to Craig for the double against Koji, Holliday is a beast, Sox are scared of Molina- would like to see them do something to move runners or attempt a steal, Carpenter is a no-nonsense scrapper like Pedroia.

Home plate ump DeMuth was consistently inconsistent last night. No clue for either team what was going to be a strike or not.

What drama will unfold tonight????

Well StL does not want to pitch to Papi.

This will continue to be a good series full of great pitching and clutch hitting.

 

[MaineMule]

You might want to listen to Joe Torre on MLB network, he breaks it down very clearly and cited Rule 2.00 to include the example that is nearly identical to this play. During the segment they explain why WM was an obstruction during the play. I have not yet heard a single baseball reporter or insider outside of Boston disagree with the implementation of the rule, please share if you know a source.....Schilling and Millar even have agreed. Does it suck that a great game ended thus way yes but this is why there are rules of the game.

The angle none of have been able to see was Joyce's POV from behind the play from the SS side.

I heard Torre but did not analyze Rule 2.00. Telling point is "After a fielder has made an attempt to field a ball and missed, he can no longer be in the act of fielding the ball. For example: If an infielder dives at a ground ball and the ball passes him and he continues to lie on the ground and delays the progress of the runner, he very likely has obstructed the runner."

So, as I read this and think it through, the fielder gets one shot at fielding a ball. That's awkward from a lot of angles if the ball is not handled properly. The runner is given carte-blanche while the fielder is in a tough spot. Guess that is what happened.

 

[George_Calfas]

World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

I heard Torre but did not analyze Rule 2.00. Telling point is "After a fielder has made an attempt to field a ball and missed, he can no longer be in the act of fielding the ball. For example: If an infielder dives at a ground ball and the ball passes him and he continues to lie on the ground and delays the progress of the runner, he very likely has obstructed the runner."

So, as I read this and think it through, the fielder gets one shot at fielding a ball. That's awkward from a lot of angles if the ball is not handled properly. The runner is given carte-blanche while the fielder is in a tough spot. Guess that is what happened.

It was also explained the position and location that WM attempted to catch the ball. Placing himself between the third base bag and home plate left him open to obstruction.

 

[scotty216brs]

It was also explained the position and location that WM attempted to catch the ball. Placing himself between the third base bag and home plate left him open to obstruction.

That's the problem I have with it, because he's not exactly in between third and home...he is to the left of third and there is a non obstructed path to home. Craig makes no effort to avoid Middlebrooks, but makes a more conscious effort to trip over him.

I wouldn't even have a problem with this call if he tripped over Middlebrooks legs, but the path he takes to home resulting in him tripping over Middlebrooks waist doesn't sit right with me.

 

[gmsieb]

I don't think Craig tried to trip over him. Nor does anyone I have talked with.

 

[Hendersonfan]

Re: World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

I don't think any of them were intentional. In the heat of the moment as this, the players are both trying to advance or make the play. Lots of emotion and adrenalin going on. State of confusion as seen in the replays.

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[Hendersonfan]

Re: World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

Earlier when I said WM was doing nothing, I think he was trying to stay out of way of runner, thought he was and then tried to get up. Then they tripped each other. He also was looking for ball, so he wasn't just laying there. And the whole thing was pretty bang bang quick.

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[bmp1971]

"After a fielder has made an attempt to field a ball and missed, he can no longer be in the act of fielding the ball. For example: If an infielder dives at a ground ball and the ball passes him and he continues to lie on the ground and delays the progress of the runner, he very likely has obstructed the runner."

Imagine Craig was on first and someone hits a sinking, soft liner to Pedroia at 2B. It's a hit-and-run play, so Craig is off and running. Pedroia goes diving after the ball in front of him, which happens to be in the line of Craigs running to 2B. Pedroia fails to catch the ball but does trap it. Knowing he has to get up, he begins to turn to make a throw to Drew at 2B but Craig runs straight into a prostrate Pedroia and falls on top of him. Then Craig stumbles to get up and runs towards 2B, but Pedroia flips to Drew and gets Craig by a step for the out.

Is that obstruction?

 

[scotty216brs]

I don't think Craig tried to trip over him. Nor does anyone I have talked with.

The reason I say that is because Craig knew where Middlebrooks was, and the path he took to home plate made it seem like he did the very opposite of attempting to avoid Middlebrooks. Very bizarre play all around.

Earlier when I said WM was doing nothing, I think he was trying to stay out of way of runner, thought he was and then tried to get up. Then they tripped each other. He also was looking for ball, so he wasn't just laying there. And the whole thing was pretty bang bang quick.

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Will be interesting to see how instant replay next year factors into these types of plays.

 

[Hendersonfan]

Re: World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

Sounds like runner interference to me. Runner impedes Pedroia from making play on the ball. Difference being the ball is still in the picture where as last night the ball is gone.

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[bmp1971]

The home plate ump made the safe call on Craig at home based on the 3B umps obstruction call, which was not even SEEN by him as the play developed. All the 3B ump saw was Craig falling on the ground or on the ground. I don't know if I can watch anymore of this series knowing these imbeciles have the right to determine the course of the game through faulty calls. The homeplate ump was awful on some critical missed strike calls (Doubront, for example).

Here's the ump at third base not even watching the play:

 

[vwnut13]

Yeah Middlebrooks was in the way as a result of fielding the ball, and didn't have time to move out of the way. He made a clear effort to get his legs out of the base path but because of how Craig started his run to home plate (or should I say "1st base") there is no way Middlebrooks can avoid the obstruction call.

I'm sure that you think that runners should be called out when rounding third base because they "left the baseline and are headed towards their dugout" right?

I am not arguing that the obstruction call was wrong (as it's a judgement call) I just don't see how it could have been avoided because of where Middlebrooks ended up from fielding the throw.

It could have been avoided by Saltalamacchia not throwing the ball.


It doesn't matter if the play could have been avoided or not. Middlebrooks obstructed the runner, end of story.

The home plate ump made the safe call on Craig at home based on the 3B umps obstruction call, which was not even SEEN by him as the play developed. All the 3B ump saw was Craig falling on the ground or on the ground. I don't know if I can watch anymore of this series knowing these imbeciles have the right to determine the course of the game through faulty calls. The homeplate ump was awful on some critical missed strike calls (Doubront, for example).

Here's the ump at third base not even watching the play:

Here, how about you actually watch the replay. That picture singles out the 1/8th of a second where Joyce was watching to see where the ball went.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/gameday/inde...eo&content_id=31185453&tcid=vpp_copy_31185453

 

[Hendersonfan]

Re: World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

Yeah, the replay I saw, Joyce watched the play pretty close. Looked at ball, then runner. Either home ump saw the obstruction call or saw Joyce make it as they both pointed.

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[Super Mario]

Yeah, the replay I saw, Joyce watched the play pretty close. Looked at ball, then runner. Either home ump saw the obstruction call or saw Joyce make it as they both pointed.

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The play that I watched Joyce pointed and called obstruction as soon as Middlebrooks put his legs up in the air.

I think had he not lifted his legs, the ump would have let the play slide.

 

[Super Mario]

 

[Austin]

Boston fans should be blaming the loss on Salty's crappy throw to third that lost the game.
If he didn't throw it poorly, Craig wouldn't have scored on that play, obstruction or not.
Salty's bad throw is what caused everything. He blew the game.

 

[Super Mario]

 

[Hendersonfan]

Re: World Series Game 3 Thread (BOS v STL, tied 1-1)

The play that I watched Joyce pointed and called obstruction as soon as Middlebrooks put his legs up in the air.

I think had he not lifted his legs, the ump would have let the play slide.

I agree with this

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[Super Mario]

And another point, I find it hilarious that many Red Sox fans are up in arms about this, when their staring pitcher clearly cheated in game one, and virtually nobody has complained about it.